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Maintankadin

102.4 vs 540 - a lot of hp's

Helpunot
Sun Dec 28, 2008 4:21 pm

102.4 vs 540 - a lot of hp's

This thread is not about getting both, but rather if you can choose between the two in a world where a boss will not be able to get through HS, which would a really experienced tankadin rather have?

I prefer the 102.4 since with it, I am sitting at 40k fully raid buffed, and without it I sacrifice anywhere from 1.6-2k health pool and am not unhittable.

Just lookin for opinions and or a thread to debate which is better.

If I have failed and this has already been posted, I will go sit in a corner and /wrists.
Threatco
Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:52 pm
Second

Never drop below 540 defense.
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At 540 Defense, when the tooltip says you have 5.6% chance to be missed, you really have a 4.11%.
Eaglestrike
Sun Dec 28, 2008 8:15 pm
Pretty much what Knaughty said. Unfortunately I do not yet have the gear sitting around to be able to set up too many different sets. I'm mostly block-capped though so I'm focusing more on getting the rest of my stats up. Tanking Malygos makes me want to go take a full stam whoring approach, lol.
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Helpunot
Sun Dec 28, 2008 8:29 pm
What is the reasoning behind never dropping below 540 defense? I cannot be crit at 516 defense (I was at at one point, think its like 531 now or something) if im at 102.4%. The only reason I know of not to drop below 540 is to avoid getting critted. If I cannot be critted I am curious what I am missing.

This is ALL of course besides tanking a boss that can stun you in any way, or you getting hit more than your HS charges can handle before you can respam HS.
Maihes
Sun Dec 28, 2008 8:49 pm
How could you be 102.4% mitigation and not be above 530 defense? Is there actually gear to support this bass akwards gearing?
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Majiben
Sun Dec 28, 2008 8:53 pm
Things that can lower your chance to block/avoid a hit:
Disarmed
Silenced
Agility debuffs
Stuns
Attacks from behind
Adds eating through charges
Loss of short term buffs
Possibly specials which can not miss but still can crit

In naxx I count 4 fights where one of these are in play and 2 more where it can come into play. Of course the 1st boss in the military wing is discounted and I'm not even considering the adds on gluth.

Additionally even if you don't get crit you can get dazed. Yes I found this out once back when handling adds on vashj. I had 484 defense and some resilience. I took a daze that caused me to be unable to grab adds which killed a healer.
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Doloth
Sun Dec 28, 2008 11:16 pm
Most people recommend stacking EH for being the hateful tank on Patchwerk, but I would argue that it is better to go with the standard block capped gear. Because, and I don't know if this is common knowledge or not, but Hateful Strike can be blocked.

Raid buffed I sit at about 1750 block value (without libram), and granted this is far more than when I first hateful strike tanked patchwerk, it is now a joke, especially for the healers. They have told me how much better I am to heal as compared to the warrior tank.

I used to be a defense/avoidance whore (back in the days of Sunwell Radiance), but I have now fully converted over to the camp of block value, but that is a discussion for another time.

Reinforcing what Knaughty wrote, however, for fights where the physical damage is not the big deal (Malygos, Sapphiron, Kel'Thuzad, Sartharion) I stack stamina, even at the possible loss of block cap.
PsiVen
Mon Dec 29, 2008 12:37 am
I don't think it's been thoroughly established one way or the other, but I would expect that crits work like glancing blows: unless you can reduce them directly, you cannot push them off the attack table. So if you're 102.4% you might be crittable anyway, which is obviously unacceptable.

The one thing you can be sure of is that you will drop HS, get hit in the back and take a crit that wipes the raid.

Anyway, if you're doing this you have too much block rating for a boss tanking set and should replace it with defense.

Threatco
Mon Dec 29, 2008 12:41 am
So 102.4% will push crit off the table making crit reduction of 5.6% from def/resil not needed?

Makes sense but I don't think I ever seen that mentioned.
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At 540 Defense, when the tooltip says you have 5.6% chance to be missed, you really have a 4.11%.
Gamingdevil
Mon Dec 29, 2008 2:21 am
It's true though, just like any blocked hit can't (couldn't) be a crushing blow and obviously an avoided hit can't be either. A blocked hit can also never be a crit.

However, since defense is still a good stat to stack for avoidance and/or getting block capped, I see no reason not to get uncrittable.
As Majiben pointed out there's too many things that can make your holy shield drop for a moment and make you crittable, potentially wiping the raid. It's just not worth the risk imo.
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If it is weak, kill it before it gets stronger. If it is strong, weaken it.