Last Man Standing

/Agree with a lot thats been said.

How much healing are you taking? That is a source of Threat as well as Mana (and more mana means you can burn more threat). If you have too much avoidance it can be problem - make sure you scale it for the fight.

Might want to swap in S1 Gavel to boost your SD. Also consider swapping in SD trinkets.

What kind of spell opening and rotation are you using?

My boss fights I do the following:
SoR, AS, HS, Consecrate, JoR, SoV, JotC, SoV
Keep HS up, Consecrate when you can, when SoV builds a 3 more stacks, I pop AW, JoV, HS, Consecrate, SoV ... (I save AW for midfight because I typically dont have trouble grabbing aggro at the beginning of the fight).

No one should be engaging the boss (exception for misdirected hunters) until your consecrate hits, they need to let you front load aggro.

When people steal aggro are you BoPing them if RD is on cooldown? (Give them a timeout if they don't control their aggro).

If you have a hunter in the group make sure he misdirects to you.

DPS should be using their aggro dropping abilities if needed, i.e. FD, Fade, etc...

The other key is that DPS don't go all out, the goal is to down the boss (however long that takes - provided the healer doesn't go OOM), not to try to burn down the boss as fast as possible, steal the tanks aggro and wipe the group.

Salv on all DPS classes that are stealing your aggro no matter how much they whine about it, unless the demonstrate aggro control they don't need a buff.

It might not be out of place to request they down-gear their weapons if they cannot control their aggro - again the goal is to be successful not for them to lead the damage meters.

There is a real problem if the DPS out gears the tank by too much, these boss fights require group balance or very precise control.

your dps fail
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i put the sensual

back into nonconsensual

Tried to run my first Heroic last night (Hellfire Citadel), we didnt get far at all.

A fellow pally in PVP epics suggested my gear was too low for heroic instances, going to have some time off dungeons. Getting tired of taking blame for wipes as people don't understand that a decent set of blue avoidance stats gear is superior to a mix of PVP epic dps gear in dungeons.

Yeah, thanks Bara, all you say is correct of course, I'm referring those in my guild who say I'm undergeared to this site.

Its difficult arguing with people who's thinking is epic = better than blue, regardless of whether the epics are PVP dps and the blue specific paladin tanking gear. For example I use a level 65 shield of the wayward footman for it's uncrushable stats. A guildie sees that and thinks "gear too low".

As for dps staying below my threat, I wish - I'm lucky if I get half a second on a mob before dps jumps in, all eager to top the damage meters and break their pb crit.

Anyway, I saw elsewhere on this site that the best approach when being constantly criticised as tank is to let them have a go at tanking for a few days.

<3
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Quidquid latine dictum sit altum videtur (Anything said in Latin seems deep)

best answer - dps needs to watch their threat. 200 dmg is enough. if they keep you from having fun in an instance because they wont listen or learn what the PVE side is about then replace them. dont forget too if you have an epic'd hunter have them MD pull for you then toss your shield while the mobs incoming, you'll get a ton of threat from it.

F it I have to get through this for my gear/quest some how answer - if the healer is all epic'd too then put on all the spell dmg you can even if it hurts your survivability. If their dps is that uber then any boss in normal 5 mans will fall super quick. if you can hold initial threat and stay alive for 30 secs the fight will be mostly over.

another thing is just spread way out, when the boss comes off of you wait till it gets to whoever pulled and bop them, then it will run back to you or the next sucky dps'r, then you can taunt or a hunter can sac his pet or whatever. if the boss is inbetween ppl running around a bunch and dps is that uber he will go down (and loosing a few dps along the way doesnt matter if he goes down). if you can make it work it saves on your repairs anyway.

it can be fun embracing the chaos if the group can handle it. Nothing will be as effeciant as a group who knows their roles, but that doesnt mean that you have to. accept it for what it is or find something different.
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Real Dwarves tank in Crusader Aura

Thanks again all, I'm enjoying the break from dungeon MTing tbh and hopefully it'll allow one of the PVPers to try tanking in their PVP epics for a while. The gm of the guild is a mate, and I want to stand by him so will be staying as long as I can, but it's increasingly becoming a guild of PVPers which is a shame.

In the mean time I'm saving for a few BoE epic pieces (bracers/helm) which will hopefully satisfy the purple is better than blue brigade a bit.

bit late but id like to add... my pally is my alt account and i really enjoy tanking on him, iv MT'd full kara clears with full blue instance/quest items including shield of the wayward footman.. had 13k unbuffed,uncrit,uncrush hardly did any heroics (enough for the libram) so if the dps give u shit be sure to tell them to L2Play.. its a dps's only job to do max damage without passing agro.. thats there life!

Ran another instance recently (Shattered Halls) and things were much much better - our guild healer has upped his healing a lot and this seemed to be reflected in increasing my aggro holding as someone pointed out up thread.

To be fair to the guild DPS, I was also concerned they were being held back by my relatively low dps ie if dps has to keep below my threat the more dps I do the more it allows them to unload.

I think the problems we still have to overcome are the Mechanar and Botanica bosses with all their nasty tricks and taunt immunity. I've also been saving for some purple to reassure the purple PVPers I'm not a total noob, so the next question of the available BoE epics:

Bracers of the Green Fortress or...
Helm of the Stalwart Defender

Belt of the Guardian would be perfect but I've never seen it on Ghostlands AH.

Thanks again all who've helped.