[Northrend Beasts] Preperation for HEROIC/HM Boss #1

Worldie wrote:Actually he got only 4 snobolds, not 5. His buff stacks only reach 4 as well.

Got 5 this pull: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-V ... 786&e=7104

granted that's the only attempt he got 5, rest were all 4, not sure what caused it - maybe the mage the snobold was on dying and the snobold jumping onto someone else.

granted that's the only attempt he got 5, rest were all 4, not sure what caused it - maybe the mage the snobold was on dying and the snobold jumping onto someone else.

That may be the case. I looked through all our log parses as well and only saw 4 applications.

If a target dies with a snobold on, it does add another stack.

Finally got to zone in and look at this on 25man today (long story).

Disappointing. But not as disappointing as Jaraxxus and Faction Champions.

I know, people are going to jump down my throat. But I don't think we should be able to 4-shot a hardmode boss. We even played safe, took 3 tanks and 6 healers to get used to the damage, figuring we'd have to adjust since the dps check is supposed to be tight. It isn't. P1 has lots of room for error. P2 is a bit tight, but really not bad. P3... we succeeded, even though melee had near-zero time on target because our warrior tank was somehow unable to charge after knockback, so Icehowl was wandering all over the map.

I'm editing the video now, looking over the kill, and I have to think that with all the mistakes we got away with, this encounter is undertuned for a "heroic" instance. I'd rather had to, like, work for the kill.

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Meloree, <Edge>, Garona

Just saying guys... >-> My guild got Gormok down with 12 people left and Acidmaw and Dreadscale killing everyone. ;D He was at 10% when they entered. ACCOMPLISHMENT FOR US! sad... I know. /cheer.

Meloree wrote:Finally got to zone in and look at this on 25man today (long story).

Disappointing. But not as disappointing as Jaraxxus and Faction Champions.

I know, people are going to jump down my throat. But I don't think we should be able to 4-shot a hardmode boss. We even played safe, took 3 tanks and 6 healers to get used to the damage, figuring we'd have to adjust since the dps check is supposed to be tight. It isn't. P1 has lots of room for error. P2 is a bit tight, but really not bad. P3... we succeeded, even though melee had near-zero time on target because our warrior tank was somehow unable to charge after knockback, so Icehowl was wandering all over the map.

I'm editing the video now, looking over the kill, and I have to think that with all the mistakes we got away with, this encounter is undertuned for a "heroic" instance. I'd rather had to, like, work for the kill.

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Meloree, <Edge>, Garona

This isn't our experience at all, although we have been extremely limited by server lag, unable to get many decent attempts in because often although the raid's latency is fine, there is a lag of ~1000-3000 ms on all abilities. This leads us getting significantly behind in DPS in Phase 1 and it flows on from there. We have about 18 attempts remaining and we're still no closer to a kill (gave up after the lag was too much and went back to Ulduar to finish our second Valanyr)

Having said that on our "good" attempts we are still behind, hitting the enrage timer while Icehowl is at ~25%. I'm quite interested in checking our your video. We've been trying it with 3 tanks and 6 healers - we switched to 2 and 5 but didn't get to P3 due to server lag and stupid deaths.

A couple of questions - how do you handle bleed stack rotations in P1? If you are using 3 tanks, do you switch at 2 stacks? What is your kill order for phase 2? Do you kill acidmaw first and deal with an enraged dreadscale? How is your raid positioned in phase 3? I'm fairly impressed that you beat the encounter ahead of the enrage timer with minimal melee time on Icehowl. How is your raid stacked - is it mostly ranged?

And finally the big question - when do you use heroism?

Soralin wrote:A couple of questions - how do you handle bleed stack rotations in P1? If you are using 3 tanks, do you switch at 2 stacks? What is your kill order for phase 2? Do you kill acidmaw first and deal with an enraged dreadscale? How is your raid positioned in phase 3? I'm fairly impressed that you beat the encounter ahead of the enrage timer with minimal melee time on Icehowl. How is your raid stacked - is it mostly ranged?

And finally the big question - when do you use heroism?

Bleed rotations in P1: I start, prot warrior second, dk thirds. Everyone swaps at 2 stacks. Warrior and DK use cooldowns to cover thier impales on 2nd rotation (although our warrior failed at this on the kill), and I use DP to cover my 3rd rotation. Simple, easy, no stress.

P2: Wasted Acidmaw (35% after his first phase up). I tanked Acidmaw (stationary), Dreadscale (stationary enrage), Dreadscale (mobile and enraged), and then moved to be 2nd threat on Icehowl while our DK tanked Dreadscale through his final stationary phase. Dreadscale died just as Icehowl became active

P3: We're typically very melee heavy, actually. We popped heroism on the first Icehowl stun. Postioning was supposed to be "melee backed against a wall, prot warrior tanks and charges back from knockbacks to keep mob stationary". Positioning ended up being "all over the place, wtf". We wanted to keep all charges on one side of the room for dps-time. We ended up having them all over the place.

I'm not sure you actually want to see the video. Half the time it's unwatchable because I'm backed against a wall. It's also full of my really bad habits that I'm trying to get over. And I apparently have the worst UI ever built.

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Meloree, <Edge>, Garona

We've tried to burn down Acidmaw first in p2, but one of our major issues was that with all 8 or so melee DPS attacking one target, if one of them gets targeted by the rooted worm's spray at any point (usually Dreadscale after one submerge), several of them get hit and nuke each other, or even if they survive, if three or four of them get burning bile, they all have to move off target to avoid killing each other. To try to avoid this, we only put 4 on Acidmaw, and 4 on Dreadscale, each four split into pairs who stack on each other, but this is ofc slowing down the burn and we have to be extra careful to make sure both worms are debuffed effectively. Is there some simple mechanic we're not seeing through which you can get all of your melee on Acidmaw until it's dead without risking all of them getting sprayed?

Edit:

Actually, does the rooted worm target who he's going to spray before he casts it? And if so does he do it early enough that whoever gets it could run out of the melee pile?

Rhiannon wrote:We've tried to burn down Acidmaw first in p2, but one of our major issues was that with all 8 or so melee DPS attacking one target, if one of them gets targeted by the rooted worm's spray at any point (usually Dreadscale after one submerge), several of them get hit and nuke each other, or even if they survive, if three or four of them get burning bile, they all have to move off target to avoid killing each other. To try to avoid this, we only put 4 on Acidmaw, and 4 on Dreadscale, each four split into pairs who stack on each other, but this is ofc slowing down the burn and we have to be extra careful to make sure both worms are debuffed effectively. Is there some simple mechanic we're not seeing through which you can get all of your melee on Acidmaw until it's dead without risking all of them getting sprayed?

Edit:

Actually, does the rooted worm target who he's going to spray before he casts it? And if so does he do it early enough that whoever gets it could run out of the melee pile?

It does target, and it does have a castbar, but it's very fast. There's pretty much just three things we did to take care of the melee all getting hit problem. 1) That's what aura mastery/dsac are for. 2) Acidmaw didn't really have very long left to live by the time he became mobile and melee became legit targets for burning bile. 3) Pray.

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Meloree, <Edge>, Garona

we split the melee dps up after the first submerge because acidmaw should be low anyway, rather kill acidmaw 10 secs longer than 8 melee dying to burning bile and wasting an attempt.