Leatherworking and Alchemy as Professions

So I noticed a lot of tanks are taking Alchemy and Leatherworking over JC and BS. Is there a reason behind this. Just scribbling as I render some video

Alchemy:

380 Stamina Trinket + Slot
120 Stamina from flask
213 Mastery

Leatherworking:

195 Stamina

*************************

JC - 303 Stamina or 201 Mastery from 67x3
BS - 2 slots possibly 120 stamina or 60 + other stats


Anyone have any idea what is possibly better overall. Has anyone changed their JC and BS for raiding HM?

I have both Alch and leatherworking. I took leatherworking because I anticipated resistance fights in WOTLK and felt tank gear + resistance wrist enchants would be effective. Turns out there really weren't any, aside from Hodir. It continues to be a very efficient itemization location to gain a bunch of stam. Regarding alchemy, it was great for having a 359 stam trinket when starting raiding at 85. Today, it's not great. The recent bump in stam (120 --> 180?) from the steelskin flask makes it a lot more palatable.

Maelsstrom wrote:The recent bump in stam (120 --> 180?) from the steelskin flask makes it a lot more palatable.

Mixology still only gives 120 additional stam from the flask.

I think Alchemy is good for this tier of content but what happens when you actually go to 4.2+ and new trinkets with better stats drop. Think they'd have Alchemy trinkets upgraded?

Unless I'm mistaken they didn't "upgrade" the Alchy trinkets in Wrath, based soley on that I doubt we will new Alchy trinkets this time around either. So with my thinking the future benifit will only be mixology, but we will prob have to wait and see what happens as more details on 4.2 land.

Alchemy isn't JUST for the trinket/flask bonus. You get a bonus from all the elixirs (which are arguably better for some fights, Prismatic Elixir kicks ass). You get 15 bonus resistence from mixology which you might not think is much, but when burst is Magic damage then that resistence can mean the difference between life or death. It's 40 Mastery bonus from the Elixir of the Master. You gain 120 bonus armor from the Elixir of Deep Earth, again this isn't the best profession bonus. Overall it's still a pretty solid profession, especially considering your flasks from Cauldrons last for most of a raid night.

So basically it is a huge stamina upgrade over JC BS

towelliee wrote:So basically it is a huge stamina upgrade over JC BS

No, the only clear winner for Stamina boosts is Leatherworking with 195 stam to bracers, which is 22-25 higher than any other stamina bonus from professions.

JC is 123 Stam because you can use 3 x 101 stam gems which levels out to 123 more than if you used 3 60 stam gems, again this has more flexibility than Alchemy due to straight 67 Mastery gems.

BS is 120 Stam (potentially due to 2 sockets) but has more flexibility than Alchemy.

Enchanting is 120 Stam with 60 Stam to both Rings.

LW is 195 Stam to bracers, the only other stam to bracer enchant (unless I've nuffed it and missed a cata one) is 40 stam. A raw gain of 145 stam if you're looking at pure stam weights.

Mining is 120 Stam passive, from stickin your hands into the ground lots.

Did I miss one? I think I did somewhere... regardless they're all roughly the same with LW being slightly higher than the others.

Alchemy (BONUS FROM FLASK, NOT ALCHEMY STONE) is 120 Stam. The stone is an equip item, meaning if you didn't use it (most raiders don't when they have 372 trinkets) you don't gain ANY benefit from the profession. Mixology only gives you a bonus for flasks and elixirs that you've consumed and can craft yourself.

I'm not gonna drop Alchemy (partially due to being the cauldron bitch) because I'm always under the effect of some kind of consumable in a raid situation, so any bonus to it will be appreciated. Alchemy just offers a 'cheaper' form of flexibility with elixirs rather than re-gemming/chanting etc.

JC

303 stamina - 101gems

BS

120 - sockets

423 x 17.7 (hp/1 stam) = 7487.1



380 stamina trinket - I am an unhittable tank so I do need this

Don't use Steelskin

195 LW

575 x 17.7 = 10177.5

So 2600 or so increase in JUST HP not talking flexability just pure HP gain. I feel like I am missing something?

JC its more accurate to consider the difference between those 3 JC gems and 3 normal stam gems (101-60 61 each) making JC only 123 stam gain (only 3 more then BS)

However if/when epic gems are released epic stam gems would most likely be 75 stam so BS= 150 and JC= 78 (to be equalized JC gems would have to be changed to 126 or stam to be 3 more stam then BS like currently)

Arincia wrote:JC its more accurate to consider the difference between those 3 JC gems and 3 normal stam gems (101-60 61 each) making JC only 123 stam gain (only 3 more then BS)

However if/when epic gems are released epic stam gems would most likely be 75 stam so BS= 150 and JC= 78 (to be equalized JC gems would have to be changed to 126 or stam to be 3 more stam then BS like currently)

Blizzard updated dragon eyes in wrath when they added epic gems, I don't see why they wouldn't do the same in cata.

towelliee wrote:JC
303 stamina - 101gems

BS
120 - sockets
423 x 17.7 (hp/1 stam) = 7487.1

380 stamina trinket - I am an unhittable tank so I do need this
Don't use Steelskin

195 LW
575 x 17.7 = 10177.5
So 2600 or so increase in JUST HP not talking flexability just pure HP gain. I feel like I am missing something?

JC you need to factor int he fact that you would have 60 stam gems in them otherwise....The Alchemy trinket means nothing, because being unhittable you are either using dual mastery trinkets or are mostly in 372 gear. Using steelskin is irrelevant, if you use mastery and armory or prismatic you get the bonus from there. If you are looking solely for stam gains then yes LW is the clear cut winner but offers no flexability like BS does. Alchemy offers fleaxbility but nothing else to a heroic tank, JC and BS provide the same things as always.

From a purely stamina point of view, LW (with 155 stamina) and JC (with 123 stamina) are the two BiS professions. I'll probably be leveling LW soon since in future tiers we probably won't need to make use of every single resource to hit 102.4% - to the best of my knowledge LW does still offer the resistance enchants, they're just more difficult to get your hands on.

The alchemy trinket is grossly overpowered in stat points for its ilvl, but its has no proper usage or proc. It's arguably not that good coz it will get replaced in future content, but the fact that the other profession items just don't compare, makes this one kind of sting.

The leatherworking stamina version is about 35 stamina stronger then other professions. And since dodge is still pretty meh, it's the only viable cata wrist enchant given to us. What makes this even more painfull is that we already went over this once before in nax, and we had to wait untill ulduar before they upgraded enchanting properly to compensate. Even worse, in 4.0.6 they did compensate every other stat except for stamina.

These 2 professions have been a thorn in my sight since the beginning of the expansion. I for one will not spent 20K gold for one content patch coz blizzard can't balance things. I will be glad when trinkets get replaced in firelands, and when lw will finally be nerfed in 4.3, only to be buffed again in 5.0

And on that note, nerf taurens night elfs and draenei.

/end rant

Just checked, swapping to lw would give me 500 health, and getting alchemy 4000 health. That's just sad.

Brb farming gold.

woopdidoo alchemy only costs 6K on my server, I just gained over 3700 health while keeping the block cap.

I'm done complaining about unbalanced things, i will just play for the winning team.

This is exactly why I made the changes. To stay Unhittable but add a good chunk of HP. Too had LW cost my ass 9k gold on my server.

well lw might not benefit it's full 35 stamina use since then you can only be 20 above or below the block cap. With Jc that's a margin of 7. LW is still better but not always by the full amount.

Also, jc will allow me to switch from elixirs to flasks sooner ( but prolly very late in the content ) , wich benefits alchemy even more buffing it to its full 120 stam gain. Also the buffed flasks have slightly more total item points.

Ofc lw would be better for the time being but the difference is MUCH small then not taking alchemy .

dont forget. LWers get to enchant their own leggings using wicked cheap mats compared to other proffs.

so you save gold by not having to pay someone to enchant your wrist, and save gold by being able to toss the best leg enchants on your gear soon as you get an upgrade. if you are working your LWing as you lvl (or like me had a skinner farm toon who collected enough to pretty much max you out soon as you were 80) then this can be a nice little bonus as you collect gear.

Awyndel wrote:And on that note, nerf taurens night elfs and draenei.

no gnomes with thier eng buff?
and why nelfs?
tuarens - herbalism boost and stam boost
dranei - jc boost with resistance
nelfs - dodge boost?

the thing you have to remember is that you can plug JC gems into the BS slots
so you still have all the normal slots and only replace 1 gem with an eye