Help with tankadin non-believers

So I love the people in my guild, but I'm getting at the end of my wits with the tanking situation. There are two prot warriors main tanking everything, and their gear is just not as good as mine (One has 17-18.5k health buffed vs mine being around 20-21k buffed with almost identical avoidance, and one's gear is MUCH worse, and he shows up unflasked... no repair money... really dumb stuff for progression runs.) My threat is similar to theirs if not a little better depending on my gear choice. They're not BAD tanks, but at the risk of sounding a little arrogant, they're not as good as me .

We are currently working on tidewalker in SSC, and it looks like he'll be down soon if we get a solid night in on him.

Now, I am all about helping the guild, healing when I'm not tanking, off-tanking aoe adds for Tidewalker, Hydross etc, but they don't even consider me for main tanking anything (Lurker, Mag, and I doubt anything else in the future.) I've brought it up with an officer in charge of tanking in a nice way, and he avoids the topic, or says something like "we'll see" and I can't get an answer. He's very into old-school pre-bc stuff, and I think that's part of the reason he thinks Paladins can't tank. Now I'm sure some of you guys have dealt with this type of thing... any suggestions? Time to /gquit? make a scene? Spec holy? Roll a warrior?

Well... I'd like to go about this in a classy/quiet way without dragging anybody through the mud and do what I'm best at... tanking... the only reason I post on the forum is because I'm sure none of them read it.

Last thing... do you guys think it'd just be a better idea to spec 13/48 or something and offtank everything and heal bossfights?
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Sanity is not statistical.
-George Orwell

Show them some video where paladin is tanking Illidan. Try to explain your arguments a bit, use "why don't you let me try that" attitude. If it won't help and you want to raid as a prot, just gquit.
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If you wanna be more dramatic invite him to an instance with crowded packs and promise that you'll pay for his repair bill if you wipe. Have a good healer as well. When inside pull a crowded pack and aoe tank them while the group aoe's and dps'es however they want. His opinion will most likely change afterwards.
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If your guildies are RL friends or you have some other personal reason for staying in the guild, then I would recommend to just spec holy. You mentioned that the tanking officer is caught up in the pre-bc mentality so he will never really consider the viability of a paladin tank. There's a large amount of evidence currently available to show what paladins can do and if he hasn't picked it up yet or isn't convinced still, I'd consider him just ignorant. I would try to avoid confrontation if you wanna stay in the guild and keep in good standing. Staying in that guild means being in the pre-bc mentality.

On the other hand if you enjoy the game tanking and want to stay prot with your paladin I suggest you look elsewhere. There are opportunities in other guilds and other servers. It becomes a matter of doing homework.

When not tanking I think you can go either way. My personal preference is staying in tank gear and wizbotting. People don't really notice or care about gimped heals. But DPS will notice that they can push a little bit harder since they have mana to spare.
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RICMRUNE - Paladin (Windrunner)

http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Windrunner&n=Ricmrune

Only attend raids where you will be doing what you want to do. If they invite you as a tank one day, and you do not get to tank, tell them the next day "I will only come as a tank, let me know if you need one"

If they stop inviting you to raids, start raiding with a friend's guild while still guilded with them. If you truely want to tank, MT'ing your own ZA is more rewarding than being random_unwanted_guild_member in TK.

If you're filled out in full ZA drops + Badge gear, you will not have problems being recruited by a T6 guild, even if it is only to tank trash waves in Hyjal.
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Mindrak - 70 - Korgath

I think they've seen what I can do to be honest. I've tanked everything in Kara etc, even done stuff like tank two arcane guys, Illhoof, Kil'rek, and Imps all at once... all that gimmicky crap we can do in Kara. Completed every heroic blah blah blah. I think it has something to do with hurting the warriors feelings too. There are three that all want to main tank... only one imho that has the gear/preparation.

How do you guys set stuff up like that in your guilds? Tank rotation? Best gear? Best class for each boss? If you guys have any suggestions I'll pass it on to the officers.

It sounds like I just need to lay it out for this guy, and if he's still stuck in the pre-bc thing then I have a few friends in similarly progressed guilds on my server.

Thanks so much for the input thus far.
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Sanity is not statistical.
-George Orwell

Ant,
I was in a similar situation to you in the beginning of 2007. I basically outgeared or was equally geared to our warriors and had much more dedication than most of them, but I was straight out ignored in a tanking role. one of the things I did to exploit and take advantage of the min/max philosophy of the officers in my guild was to farm out epic and blue +resist sets, thus, when it was time to select resist tanks, I was the best, and sometimes, only choice.
Reading through your post(s) my best guess is that you are a victim of class politics. I know my suggestion won't solve your problem overnight, but it's a good first step.
cheers,
Jaspr
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http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Gilneas&n=Jaspr

MY guild tends to be very open minded in regards to its long time members. So, we've been willing to try ret pallies adn prot pallies adn all manner of odd or funny specs. While we certainly do want to progress we believe that you paly at your best when you play the way you want to play. As a result we ahve no shortage of tanks of all varieties and specs of all kinds to pull from as we progress.

that being said doesn't help you any.

What I can tell you is that you acocmplish nothgin by saying nothing. Talk to these people let em know what you think and be prepared to lsiten to their response. If you don't like what they ahve to say then deal with it or move on. Obviously they value you as a tank or they wouldn't ask for you to come along as prot or they would demand that you respec.

Ultimately it is your 15$ do with it as you will.
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70 Prot Pally
Muahahaha 70 Warlock
Kalishnakov 54 Hunter

Hey Mate, I used to be in a guild where the raidleader was a OldSchool preBC raider and after 3 months of being to to shut up and heal I gave up..
if you got 22k buffed you should have no problem finding a guild that would love to use you as a tank, sadly a lot of people are stuck in PreBC, and you can't convince them.

Best of luck mate, If It was me I would most likely be looking for another guild.
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How close are you to your guildies? My take on these things is that you play WoW to have some fun. If the people around you are limiting that fun for some silly personal agenda, then you need new surroundings.

Just do your best to get some open dialogue with whoever is in charge. Just tell them straight out in a friendly way - "Hey, I'm really well geared and know what I'm doing, I know I can help out much better by tanking, etc.". Just lay it all out

If it they become open minded great. If not you shouldn't put yourself through frustration, especially if you spent a lot of time working on your tank gear. If you want to heal and you enjoy it then that's fine also, but don't do it if you're not going to.

Like others said I'm sure you could find another Guild that is more open minded especially given your gear and skill level. A Guild that doesn't take you seriously isn't a Guild to me.
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Paid by the Alliance
To slay all the giants

-Ahms of Mannoroth
0/49/12

Art - http://ahms.deviantart.com/

Thanks for all the great responses and support guys! Gotta love this forum and the good people running it. I think I'm going to basically talk to the officers in a more forceful manner than I have been (in private), give it a couple weeks, and see what happens. I'll give you guys an update on the outcome.


Anta
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Sanity is not statistical.
-George Orwell

http://files.filefront.com/Silent+Resurgence+vs+Illidan+Stormrage/;9221790;/fileinfo.html

Paladin tanking Illidan, as Fiorina suggested.


Unless you're the GM or raid leader of your guild, it's an uphill battle no matter what. We are still the new kid on the block when it comes to tanking, and there are a LOT of preconceptions that any new tankadin is going to have to wade through. Be thankful you're doing this post-2.3... at least you're not having to deal with the "but you have less hp blah blah blah" crap. Go tank Void Reaver. If that doesn't give a Tier 5 guild some idea of what you're capable of, then I don't know what else would.

The sad thing is, depending on the guild, experience means little to nothing. This is both a curse and a blessing. It's a curse in that you might be getting benched for some warrior who's been playing since BC came out... even if you've had a history in the game since the beginning. It's a blessing in that most guilds who are open to the idea of a tankadin aren't going to expect there to be a lot of skilled ones out there. They'll be willing to train you... because even a new prot pally in Hyjal makes it hella easier than not having one at all.

Point out to your guild that they need to start investing in the future. Giving you experience and gearing you as a tank is going to make their BT/Hyjal progression much faster than if they just kept sitting your ass on the bench. Not to mention, Sunwell is coming out soon... and if you look at half the bosses, what are they? Demons. What do you think the trash mobs are going to be? /scratch forehead

What I find somewhat sad and funny is that if I ever chose to leave my guild, I could go to a guild that is wiping on Kael'thas and apply for an MT spot.... and still get turned down purely for being a paladin
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http://chicktankadin.blogspot.com

You Aetherial have given me an unattainable dream from my own server. I idolize and curse you at the same time.
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As an old raider (but raiding as a warlock my whole wow life, but now playing a paladin as main), I would just gquit.

I was the warlock officer for a long time and when BC came out, I couldnt believe druids or paladins could tank.
Of course, that changed as I lvled into BC. In general, I became a believer! Halleluia!

Anyways, sadly, my old officers didnt had that mentality.
I tried to talk to them, but eventually, our prot paladin gave up and /gquit, burying the subject for good.

In his shoes, I would do the same. I'd add the people I actually "love" to my friend list, chat to them all the time, but wouldn't be in a place where people aren't open. Tidewalker, for example, is a place where you NEED a paladin tanking for the murlocs.
Now, how a pally will tank there correctly if he never were given the oportunity to gear up?
Although this excuse is no more with 2.3 badges, but still.

There are many guilds out there, more progressed or just starting Kara that actually want a prot paladin, and as they progress with you MTing it, they will respect you more (it is better to step back into Kara where you can actually play as you like that put up with that kind of crap)

Of course, if your bound to them is so strong (wich doesnt seem to be the same from them since they only reply "will see"), respecc holy and STFU .

But again, with that much HP and avoidance, you are ready to join any raiding guild as a tank you'd choose.