sanctuary in 3.2 -> Sanctified Kings

Trav wrote:Meh. It's still much improved over six possible blessings, which only last five minutes (with a ten minute option added later)...

I still remember MC.

[pull, kill mobs]
RL: "Okay, paladins, rebuff"
[pull, kill mobs]
[pull, kill mobs]
RL: "Okay, paladins, rebuff again"

And there weren't even greater blessings, so you were single-target blessing 40 people every five minutes. GOOD TIMES.

Lore wrote:I'll still prefer Kings unless I need the mana.

Hmph. Well what all am I missing out on, other than Int and Spirit?

55 Agility (Leg Enchant) + 52 (Imp MotW) + 178 (Imp Str of Earth) = 285

10% is 28.5, or 29, which is 0.56% dodge before DR. That'll be probably around... 0.4%?

My STR based on Armory is 1307. Add in another 52 (Imp MotW) and 178 (Imp Str of Earth) and I'm at 1546.
10% of that is 154.6. Divided by 2, that's 77.3, or ~77 BV. It'll probably get modified by Redoubt, so that's almost exactly 100 block value.

So I'm effectively choosing between 100 BV + 0.4% dodge and 3% flat DR, assuming I don't need the mana. For hits over 3333 damage, 3% DR will beat 100 BV (and it applies to unblocked hits and magic). Unless I'm missing something, I think I'd probably go with Sanc unless I can have both.

I should have clarified that I pretty much always have a Disc Priest, so the 3% damage reduction is redundant.

So for me it's a choice between the mana gains, or the little bit of dodge and block.

Lore wrote:I should have clarified that I pretty much always have a Disc Priest, so the 3% damage reduction is redundant.

So for me it's a choice between the mana gains, or the little bit of dodge and block.

Ah, well that completely changes the picture. Given that then yeah, there's not much point to sanctuary, especially when you consider that BoKings helps your mana regen as well (via 10% Int + Divine Plea, about 27 mp5 if I'm calculating correctly).

Plus, unless you're running with 4 or more Paladins, you're probably overwriting Wisdom on yourself, so there's a tiny bit of mana loss there.

BoSanc really just needs to be removed and the 3% damage reduction put on some other buff.

I didn't catch the 10% stamina bonus only to sanctuary... I was really looking forward to not needing to manage kings and just do sanc

Lore wrote:Plus, unless you're running with 4 or more Paladins, you're probably overwriting Wisdom on yourself, so there's a tiny bit of mana loss there.

BoSanc really just needs to be removed and the 3% damage reduction put on some other buff.

And the mana regen rolled in elsewhere.

moduspwnens wrote:

Lore wrote:Plus, unless you're running with 4 or more Paladins, you're probably overwriting Wisdom on yourself, so there's a tiny bit of mana loss there.

BoSanc really just needs to be removed and the 3% damage reduction put on some other buff.

And the mana regen rolled in elsewhere.

And that.

I LIKE the changes that Sanc is getting. About time.
Many times in 5 and 10 mans there aare only 1 or 2 pallies, which means that as a tank i take sanc for myself, yet missout on kings (or have to bully the holy/ret pally to do kings and i do the ghettobuff of might/wiz on them).

With new sanc, i get most of the benefits of kings that a tank wants.

Lore wrote:I should have clarified that I pretty much always have a Disc Priest, so the 3% damage reduction is redundant.

So for me it's a choice between the mana gains, or the little bit of dodge and block.

Actually its not, the 3% from Disc priests stacks with Sanc.

The armour buff from shammies stoneskin stacks with devo aura.

Don't ask why, just be thankful

(Although, they really should fix these...)

moduspwnens wrote:

Lore wrote:Plus, unless you're running with 4 or more Paladins, you're probably overwriting Wisdom on yourself, so there's a tiny bit of mana loss there.

BoSanc really just needs to be removed and the 3% damage reduction put on some other buff.

And the mana regen rolled in elsewhere.

Revert the stam change, make it stack with Kings. Or make it passively give the mana return, and stick the DR in with Devotion Aura.

*Shrug* Of course, it's rare I don't have like 4 paladins in my raids, plus a disc priest.

Gamingdevil wrote:

Sark wrote:... warriors have to choose between commanding and battle shout

i think with the 3.2 change sanct will be fine as is

But that's not the point. You only need 2 warriors for both (actually one, since they let the paladins buff might) The problem is that the paladins still want 4 blessings (primarely on themselves) and it's a real bitch arranging that when there's less than four paladins (much mur juggling improved blessings around)

I agree. Even if you do use two warriors, all you have to do is say "you get battle, I'll get commanding" once at the start of the raid and you're set for the whole night. No muss, no fuss, nobody loses out on a buff they spent talent points to improve, no baby sitting individual people who need a different buff. Plus warriors don't have to choose between commanding shout and say, focused rage or shield specialization. I'd say the mana return from sanctuary has more in common with talents like those than with battle shout.

On a somewhat related note, I hear a lot of warriors complain that shout durations are too short, and I can't deny that refreshing them every two minutes could get annoying. But compared to how clunky the blessing system is, I'd say they're fine. I'd kill to have to only press one button every two minutes to buff the entire raid.

But back on topic, they should definitely add 10% to all stats to sanctuary. The downside is so tiny (we'd be slightly more powerful in situations where we're the only paladin) compared to the huge reduction in hassle, I don't see how anyone could be against it. They should go even farther, in my opinion, and make greater blessings raid wide instead of per class.

To be quite frank they should remove Sanctuary altogether, or remove the mana gains portion of it, and instead have an improved kings talent that adds the 3% reduction into kings. They removed the other resourse gains from sanc for other classes and integrated equivalents via talents instead. They should do the same with the mana gains portion of sanctuary and roll it in some talent in prot.

I would also like to see a change to our blessings.
Extend their duration to 30mins minor, 1hr major.
Change them so its one buff per person - no more need to worry about other pallies automatically getting sanc.
Change the symbols so they stack to 200 or 500.

masterpoobaa wrote:I would also like to see a change to our blessings.
Extend their duration to 30mins minor, 1hr major.
Change them so its one buff per person - no more need to worry about other pallies automatically getting sanc.
Change the symbols so they stack to 200 or 500.

I wouldn't make them one per person

buffing 25 seperate people who want different things would be quite a bigger headache

30m ghetto blessing and 1hr major would be a godsend though