Improved Seal of Crusader - Is it working?

Has anyone been able to confirm that Improved Seal of Crusader is working?

I judged Seal of Crusader on Void Reaver at the very beginning and kept it up throughout the entire encounter. I've compared WoW Web Stats from the previous week's encounter to this one, and I don't see any impact to Crit, from any class (Rogues, Mages, Paladins, etc.) in our raid.

The group makup between the two different encounters was largely the same and I can confirm no one else was judging VR. We had one Feral Druid w/ Leader of the Pack, but he was in the Tank group on both encounters. Is there anything that might cancel out it's crit benefits?

I'm not saying it's not working or bugged. It's just that the benefits aren't obvious to me so before I do more digging, I'd like to know if anyone else has seen an issue.

Thanks.

Back when I was researching on the talent before when it was basically a ret pally only talent, I was looking at numbers and it seemed that it added roughly 200-300dps to your overall raid dps (Typically 20-30dps per dps class in your raid). I think its kind of hard to quantify. Our raid dps can fluctuate up or down 1000 any given encounter just depending on who shows up, a string of odd luck. Seeing a difference of a rogue doing 1000 dps or 1020 dps is nothing significant and would be hard to attribute to the talent.

So far its hard to tell. Stuff SEEMS like its dying faster, but we've also cleaned up our raid group a LOT over the past few weeks. I don't know if its due to the talent or due to people stepping up their A game.
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I would've expected to see an increase in crit for all attacks this week over last week. I see no increase in WoW Web Stats (WWS) for any class. It seems like something is broken.

I do see a noticeable increase in crit to the group that had Leader of the Pack (4-5%) but again, no increase in crit to any other group that should've seen benefit from Improved SoC. Would've expected to see a 2-3% increase in crit rate to all groups from the previous week without Improved SoC.

So that I rule out a fluke, I will run stats on Lurker this coming weekend and then compare that from the week before. Would be nice to confirm more definitely whether this talent is giving any measurable benefit.

I'd be happy to read your research into this. We don't run with a ret pally at all so I figured I'd pick up the talent for a bit of raid utility. If its not making a difference (due to it not being worth it or a bugged talent for the time being) I'll drop it in favor of something else until its fixed.

Keep us posted
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Thanks. Let me see if Blizzard knows of a problem. If not, then it's worth looking into this some more and I'll post the raid stat links so you can have a closer look. 3% crit is a nice raid buff, so definitely worth making sure this works.

We don't run with a ret. pally either, but I took the Improved SoC for raid benefit. I'm with you though...if it's not making a difference because of a bug, I'll drop it and take 2 more pts in Deflection and maybe 1 pt. in PoJ.

I don't have any facts or stats but last week we downed maggie with one of our holy pala's judging this on him. I was the fastest we have ever done it and everyone seemed to notice a dps increase. Now that i have been told to go full time prot i have taken it to help with the DPS
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Yeah, we cut almost a minute off the time it took to kill VR and that was after losing two DPS very early on. It's really hard to tell whether the added DPS is coming from Improved SoC or from "other" 2.3 changes.

I will post the stats as soon as I can get the ok from my raid leader. I don't think he'll have a problem with it.

All of our kills have been faster this week. But it's hard to say if it's the talent helping out or other factors.

Well running as ret spec the crit bonuses are deffinetly noticable, the 3% base increase from sanctified seals and the judgement from improved seal of the crusader.

I've built my prot spec around gaining this boost to full raid crits. Haven't run any numbers on it but there does seem to be a noticable bonus.
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Durkon
Lvl 70 Paladin
Anvilmar

I recently dropped this talent in favor of Precision. For me, the benefits weren't apparent but the opportunity costs were: JoW and Precision.
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http://armory.worldofwarcraft.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Medivh&n=Minn

There was a post of a paladin being crit while over 490def. The problem was his Improved Judgement of Crusader being reflectet and all mobs gained 3% more crit towards him. If it is indeed working for mobs, I think it might be working for the raid, too.
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The non noticable increase could be due to the hit rating of your party. if a player doesn't have enough +hit then they cannot maximize their full crit potential. so an extra 3% won't impact anyone under a certian point. bosses push crits off the table we just need hit rating to unbalance that.
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Durkon
Lvl 70 Paladin
Anvilmar