Kings...its not prot's responsibility

qq thread is a qq thread
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armory | youtube | pally stole my bike

Sigh, you're not putting in anything new!

IF you can 100% rely on a Ret pally with the Kings blessing, then YES, you can skip Kings yourself. Nobody will disagree about you with that.

If you cannot, then take kings yourself. In your case, you deem you can force a Ret pally with Kings to be there every raid. In that case, of course, it's the best solution to have the Ret pally take kings, freeing you up with 5 more talent points.

Your point is not "How viable is Kings" but "Can I guarantee that there'll be a Ret paladin there every raid?" It's a moot point.
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Zoe's guide to building your tankadin

Also it was proven a long time ago that you only need 3 points in reckoning if you are that in love with it. The optimal uptime for points spent is 3/5 reckoning.

The reason reckoning is useless is the tanking seal is now seal of corruption (vengence for allies I think). Getting a full 5 stack takes no time and after that all reckoning is adding is white damage which does not get any effect from righteous fury. I could go into the full argument but theirs no point you are obviously not gonna change your mind based on the tone of the post.
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"Salv doesn't fix stupid"
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Mal%27Ganis&n=Duces

It's been said before, and it will be said again.

Reckoning is a leveling talent.

That's it. That's all.
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Póg mo thóin

Ok lets say that as prot pally, we will be judging judgement of the just most of the times on boss for that extra avoidence (20%attack speed reduce anyone?), so skipping kings and picking up Heart of the Crusader talent gives us two benefit for 1 judgement, while ret pally can judge light because JotL is based on ap and ret provides more benefit by judging JotL, see where I am going with this?

BoK is nice to have, i agree. However I am sick and tired of people,even some on this forum going like 'there is no better alternative, get kings", or coming up with arguments like"that ret dont want to spec kings, so its up to prot to spec it". The 1st statement is matter of perference, the 2nd one is just lame...why would you bring a ret to a raid that refuse to provide kings???

Im not trying to argue here, just trying to say that this bok thing can stop now please, and its quite clear in my original post stating optimal performance and stuff.

I've went without BoK, but I did start with two friends as a paladin trio. Pre-WotlK, the holy had it, now, the ret is going to have it.

For my personal choice, I don't think 5 points are worth it for a talent that I'd only use on myself in boss fights.
The biggest argument for taking it imho is that it just needs to be present in a raid, or you're really missing out. This may leave the prot in the uncomfortable situation that he brings BoK for everyone else at cost of not only 5 talent points, but also one of his two favourite blessings.

So, I can certainly understand both camps, and would argue it really depends on whom you are regularly grouping with.

Cheers,
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I don't think of the talent points as that big of a sacrifice. What the big sacrifice is, is that you can only apply one blessing to yourself. So you have to choose between Sanc and Kings, possibly the two most important buffs to a tankadin.
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Stevadin, Level 75 BE Paladin, Maelstrom

Making a holy paladin get it is a large decrease in their healing capabilities, 1-4%. decrease in tanking capabilities to get it, <.5%.
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Majiben
If we wanted Ret to be a joke, we would have just left the tree as it was, and maybe kicked it a little for good measure. -GC

You don't lose anything particularly huge to pick up Kings. I have it in my prot build at the moment, I haven't missed those talent points at all. I even had extra points to put into Imp HoJ.

If you're running with a Ret pally, anything past 6 points in Ret is a waste, and you've got extra points to spend on Kings.

If you're not running with a Ret pally, you don't have Kings, and should take it.

EDIT: In fact, having Kings with a Ret Pally in the raid is probably a good thing, because it lets them put Imp BoM out.
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Station wagons are my favorite things.

I currently don't have it because I have a reliable ret pally to run with who does.

If that was not the case, I would have it 100% of the time even if I personally got little benefit outta it in any scenario besides progression bosses.

/shrug. It is too good to not have unless you are 110% sure someone else will have it. And we really do not sacrifice much to get it.
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