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Help with Kael'thelas

A'lar, Void Reaver, Solarian, Kael'thas

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Postby Tekkel » Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:20 am

Got another go last night. Gotta love warriors bitching at you for grabbing a 2nd weapon off them with your conc. But without it I kinda have a hard time to keep both the mace and shield on me.

About that p3. I tanked telonicus there and moved towards the warlock tanking capernian to give him the aura back and eat a few conflags which I could heal myself from. Doubt it's very useful indeed though.

Atm we have issues getting enough weapons down before p3 and thus don't get enough adds down before kael goes loose.
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Postby Zaephod » Fri Jan 18, 2008 1:09 pm

Tekkel, I don't know your healing situation at all, but the way we do it seems to work rather well for us. Who knows, it might help you.

Right after Telonicus dies, but before phase 2 starts, go to the middle of the arc where the weapons spawn, consecrate, then bring up SoR. Then wait for the weapons to spawn. Once they do, target the Cosmic Infuser (mace), Judge it and move the mass of weapon that'll be on you slightly to the right of where you first consecrated.

Have your warrior pick up the axe and take it to the left side of the platform close enough to aoe but far enough not to hit people with whirlwind.

You'll have 4 weapons on you: the Phaseshift Bulwark, Cosmic Infuser, Warp Slicer, and Infinity Blades. Have a rogue or two "tank" the staff and a hunter "tank" the bow.

Once you've positioned the weapons, consecrate again, throw on AW and yell for the aoe to begin.

Single target dps starts with the mace. Melee goes to Infinity Blades afterwards, and single target ranged dps goes to the staff, then axe.

When the mace dies, move your pack of weapons away so that healers can loot it. Target the shield at this point and start beating on it. (It always seems to be the one I have the least threat on.) Then stay there until the axe dies. Head over to where Telonicus died; you'll usually have the Warp Slicer and/or Phaseshift Bulwark left.

Make sure to consecrate a few seconds before Telonicus respawns so you can pick him up while still tanking the last weapon(s).

PS. There's a stupid healing problem that could arise right after you move the pack so that people can loot the mace: All healers looting at the same time. It's killed me multiple time, but they're better about it now.
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Postby Lumenactio » Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:24 pm

I might have missed it... but anyone have a Kael'thelas from a prot pally perspective video?

We're going to start learning this encounter tonight. Thought it might help.
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Postby Worldie » Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:28 pm

I have my own one, but it's just p4/5 + some seconds of p1/2/3 and i'm kiting phoenixes there. I'll give u the link if u are interested.
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Postby Lumenactio » Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:36 pm

Sure. Anything is fine. Appreciated.
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Postby Worldie » Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:41 pm

Click me
Forgive me for crappy quality, my computer sucks. My kiting tecnique got perfected later since it was a first kill there. I now kite nearer to the raid so i don't lose the staff buff :)
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Lumenactio » Sat Jan 19, 2008 10:44 pm

Thanks, I'll check it out.

Any one else have vids. I'm interested.

Knowing is half the battle and all that.
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Postby Gracerath » Mon Jan 21, 2008 3:43 am

I actually fraps'd our 2nd Kael kill ever. Basically I loafed around in phase 1, tanked staff and dagger phase 2, tossed some heals and uber SoV dps phase 3, phase 4 and 5 pheonix tanking along with some more wimpy heals and SoV dps. One thing I really like about making these is I tend to watch them over and over to figure out how to do better. I noticed that I attacked from the front a few times with the MT, adding the possibility of extra parries. Also, the damn flame strikes get me every time, I think its a pheonix popping out so I run towards it :P

Not the most glorious of raid positions but there it is.

http://files.filefront.com/Kaelthaswmv/ ... einfo.html
Bye space sword!
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Postby Tekkel » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:25 am

Right now I'm the phoenix tank, bringing around 200fr to the fight but currently we bring 1 bear, 2 prot wars and me to the raid for learning the encounter so there's no way i'm aoe tanking the majority of the weapons.

Last night I had my 1st full night on Kael and basicly threw down the conc before kael and grabbed initial aggro on the weapons. I usually have 2-3. The mace, shield and the dagger. I'm having some issues keeping the shield on me through soc if I just concecrate it. That thing is just plain weird as I can tank anything with conc vs soc but the shield needs at least 1-2 judgements to keep it sticking to me. Near the end of p2 our MT taunts the shield off me. We get to the point where the shield dies really close to the end of p2 and only the axxe is still alive.

But in p3 our problems start. Picking up the adds isn't the problem but generally a bunch of ranged and healers die due to thaladred. Telonicus dies before thaladred atm and we hardly get him down before p4. With 3 adds up there we wipe really quickly.

Question is what do u guys do when tanking an add and u get gazed? Happened to me only once when he switched on to me as someone kited it right next to me mob. But what do u do when he's still on the other side of the room?

I just wish our ranged dps and some healers pull their shit together and stop dieing to stupid issues in p1 and not getting hit by thaladred, not getting knockbacked into capernian range and not kiting into fear range..
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Postby Gracerath » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:43 am

If you get gazed while Thaladred is still on the other side of the room, chances are he'll switch gazes again before he gets to you so its generally safe to stay put. Since he is running toward you, he'll probably be right in line of any of the melee dps as well and if he gazes one of them next, they have to be ready to move the hell away. If he gazes you again, you'll have to move. It is possible to take a hit from Thaladred while still having one of the other adds on you but its not optimal. Just try to kite in a direction that has the least amount of people or important roles (we try not to kite him near the Capernian warlock + healer ever).

Thaladred is a pain but is really easy to handle when people figure out how to kite him. Always try to kite him away from the main group of people. After the engineer dies, we stick that tank following Thaladred around putting the dagger debuff on him to make sure he dies faster. If that tank gets gazed, he wont get one shot.

Our rule of thumb is do not be close to Thaladred ever. Even if you are not being gazed, be max range if you are a caster. If you are a melee, just stay the hell away period. Sure there is a cooldown on his gaze for melee dps to go in and take a few whacks but if something goes wrong, it can lead to a horrible chain of gazes where he'll just obliterate your melee dps. Phase 1 is not a dps race anyway and phase 3 melee have two other adds to work on.
Bye space sword!
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Postby Tiandelin » Tue Jan 22, 2008 8:21 am

We just have all the ranged dps stand in the center of the room, and whoever gets gazed kites Thaladred in a circle around them so that the rest can just stand still and dps. It's a significant dps increase compared to everyone having to chase him around while trying to burn him. We also have our warrior MT follow him around stacking the dagger debuff to get him down even faster.

After changing our strat from burning Telonicus at the beginning of phase 3 to leaving him till the end, we one-shotted Kael (after a couple false-starts with our Sanguinar tank dying horribly at the start of phase 3). Generally, we have the axe and the shield still up when phase 3 starts, so the kill order is as follows:

1) Ranged move to the center and start on Thaladred, melee burn down the shield.
2) Melee move to Sanguinar while ranged finish off Thaladred and then help burn down Sanguinar too.
3) Melee move to Telonicus and ranged destroy Capernian in the south.
4) Ranged come to the stage and finish off the axe and then join melee on Telonicus.

Usually only Telonicus is up when Kael becomes active, and he dies soon after. Then it's just 25 of us vs him. Killing off Capernian and the axe frees up two healers, which seems to help (us, at least) a lot against Kael. It's highly advisable to have a hunter tag along with the melee to keep the bow debuff on their target.

After that, I tank the phoenixes behind Kael with FR aura and the mace buff. At about 40% health or so, we have ranged switch from Kael to help burn down the bird and get a quick start on the egg. Melee joins in when the egg comes up, and we just let the shock barrier run its course. The Kael tank uses the phaseshift bulwark on the first pyro and then a combination of nightmare seed or fire protection pot and a priest shield on the second.

Once you get to phase 5, the fight becomes almost as easy as phase 1 as long as you don't get complacent.

Note that your mileage may vary, and it seems like different guilds have success with wildly different strategies. This is just how mine does the fight. However, attempting to kite Thaladred in a circle really should help if your casters find themselves having to chase after him to burn him.
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Postby Dragonzbane » Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:01 am

Tiandelin wrote:After changing our strat from burning Telonicus at the beginning of phase 3 to leaving him till the end, we one-shotted Kael (after a couple false-starts with our Sanguinar tank dying horribly at the start of phase 3). Generally, we have the axe and the shield still up when phase 3 starts, so the kill order is as follows:

1) Ranged move to the center and start on Thaladred, melee burn down the shield.
2) Melee move to Sanguinar while ranged finish off Thaladred and then help burn down Sanguinar too.
3) Melee move to Telonicus and ranged destroy Capernian in the south.
4) Ranged come to the stage and finish off the axe and then join melee on Telonicus.


We pretty much do the same thing though we stack heavy on ranged so our shield is down by P4.

For melee, killing Telonicus last is best positioning wise as it puts them right next to Kael so they don't have to run across the room for barriers.

If I get gazed I stay where I am regardless.
We have a floating healer who off-heals the raid and helps out if any of the other healers get in trouble or Thaladred goes after one of the tanks.
I feel this is a lot better than trying to kite Thaladred and Telonicus around the room.

In P4 the stage is pretty fluid for us.
The MT and melee move around avoiding Flamestrikes and Phoenixes when necessery. I tank the Phoenixes where I pick them up and try to move them to a spot where they aren't hitting anyone.
I don't where FR gear, just use FR Aura, the mace buff and the shield for blasts and I'm fine.
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Postby Moraus » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:27 am

Small question, if i get assigned to pheonix tanking how much unbuffed FR do i need (w/o aura).

My guild is just starting kael tonight and i can feel myself being asked to get resists for it, is badges gear enough or as the above poster mentioned dont bother with it just FR aura and mace buff.

Cheers

Moraus
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Postby Gracerath » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:33 am

Moraus wrote:Small question, if i get assigned to pheonix tanking how much unbuffed FR do i need (w/o aura).

My guild is just starting kael tonight and i can feel myself being asked to get resists for it, is badges gear enough or as the above poster mentioned dont bother with it just FR aura and mace buff.

Cheers

Moraus


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Bye space sword!
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Postby Moraus » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:45 am

Gracerath wrote:
Moraus wrote:Small question, if i get assigned to pheonix tanking how much unbuffed FR do i need (w/o aura).

My guild is just starting kael tonight and i can feel myself being asked to get resists for it, is badges gear enough or as the above poster mentioned dont bother with it just FR aura and mace buff.

Cheers

Moraus


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ty :)
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