Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby theckhd » Thu May 16, 2013 6:13 pm

Schroom wrote:
Worldbreaker's Stormscythe tends to pull ahead thanks to its hit/expertise itemization, but the two sword offerings (Qon's Flaming Scimitar and Do-tharak, the Swordbreaker) manage to match it in the hands of a Human.


what if you only gem full yellow hastegems. Do-tharak is the only one who will give you a socketbonus of 60 strength.

would this let it pull ahead of Worldbreaker's Stormscythe?

Probably, though it's already getting a haste/stam gem, so the difference is only 160 haste. That's still something like 400 DPS though.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby theckhd » Fri May 17, 2013 7:53 am

Updated the single-target rotations post with corrected data. I had to disable some of the queues (ones that combined ES with SS) because they cause the FSM code to fail now thanks to increased state size. They'll have to wait until I have time to decide how/if to fix them.

The oddity with the CS>J>AS+>HW>Cons>AS queue still exists - it has a small increase in HPG. I still have some thinking to do about this; theoretically it shouldn't happen, but I may just be missing a really strange edge case.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Derrickster » Sat May 18, 2013 6:15 pm

Looking over the sims again it looks like any time AS+ is designated over just AS the HPGs goes up so the only thing I can think of that would cause this is if separating AS+ from AS someone makes the grand crusader usable instantly either through resetting the GCD or possibly making the proc'd AS off the GCD? I'm not sure I buy this explanation but it seems to be the only thing that could possibly be wrong without really knowing how the sim (or sims in general really) work.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby theckhd » Mon May 20, 2013 8:55 am

That can't happen in the sim, as far as I'm aware. But I'll double-check the code.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Klaudandus » Thu May 23, 2013 1:14 pm

Ok, I might have some time off tomorrow, is there anything that needs to be tested since 5.3 came out?
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby theckhd » Thu May 23, 2013 6:35 pm

I don't think there's anything pressing, no.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby theckhd » Wed Jun 12, 2013 7:34 am

Today's blog post is of some relevance to this thread:
http://www.sacredduty.net/2013/06/12/th ... uture-sim/
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Promdates » Sat Jul 20, 2013 6:54 am

Do you have an easy way of determining the Holy Power per minute of the new Holy Avenger and Sanctified Wrath talents in 5.4?
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Thels » Sun Jul 21, 2013 2:49 am

Promdates wrote:Do you have an easy way of determining the Holy Power per minute of the new Holy Avenger and Sanctified Wrath talents in 5.4?


Holy Avenger didn't change, did it?

Either way, I did some napkin math earlier:

Thels wrote:Lessee... Let's assume 0% haste for a moment.

HA: Lasts 18 seconds. During these 18 seconds, we'll press CS 4 times, and J 2.66 times on average. This would generate 13.33 extra HoPo per use, or 6.66 extra HoPo per minute.

SW: Lasts 30 seconds. During these 30 seconds, we'll press J 10 times and CS 5 times. This would generate 25 total HoPo per use. Normally, in that 30 second timespawn, we'd press CS 6.66 times and J 4.44 times on average, so we'd generate 11.11 total HoPo. Therefor, SW would generate 13.88 extra HoPo per use, or 4.62 HoPo/minute.

HA also buffs the HoPo from GC, while our SW rotation actually reduces the number of GC procs while increasing the chance we waste procs from avoidance. Ergo, not only does HA generate more HoPo per minute, it also generates more HoPo per use.



To make sure Haste doesn't mess things up too much, let's check the other end of the spectrum, 50% haste:

HA: Lasts 18 seconds. During these 18 seconds, we'll press CS 6 times, and J 4 times. This would generate 20 extra HoPo per use, or 10 extra HoPo per minute.

SW: Lasts 30 seconds. During these 30 seconds, we'll press J 15 times and CS 7.5 times on average. This would generate 37.5 total HoPo per use. Normally, in that 30 second timespawn, we'd press CS 10 times and J 6.66 times on average, so we'd generate 16.66 total HoPo. Therefor, SW would generate 20.83 extra HoPo per use, or 6.94 HoPo/minute.

Again, HA also buffs the HoPo from GC, while our SW rotation actually reduces the number of GC procs while increasing the chance we waste procs from avoidance. Ergo, not only does HA generate more HoPo per minute, it also generates more HoPo per use.


Of course, that was pre-GC change, but it doesn't change much. SW comes out a little better, since the less CS presses don't lead to less GC procs. Still, HA provides extra HoPo per AS+, and the tight SW rotation still has a bigger chance of wasting GC procs, so HA still wins out on HoPo generation per use. Obviously, with a shorter CD, it wins out on HoPo generation per minute as well.

However, the generation per use is really small, so if you have more than 20% haste, and are saving it for tight moments, SW's extra healing received might top that instead. Then again, do you really need the extra healing at that moment.

Under 20% haste, SW doesn't give you 100% SotR coverage, so HA clearly wins as a defensive cooldown.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Promdates » Mon Jul 22, 2013 8:35 am

I'm never looking at those talents as "defensive" cooldowns, as I would rarely use them for that (mostly because I've been running Divine Purpose since mid last tier). So in general, HA is roughly 10 HP/min. That's better than the random proc of 2-15 HP/min of Divine Purpose. Using HA with the 4P bonus and some "interesting" mechanics can make you get ~100% sotr uptime.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Thels » Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:29 am

I've found HA to be a very nice DPS+Survival CD. I usually pop it at the start of the fight for some threat lead, and reducing the need for healer attention, as people are getting to their positions and what not. After that, having 50% physical damage reduction for half a minute available every two minutes can be really powerful. For a lot of situations where heavy damage is incoming, I pop HA first, and only when SotR is almost running out, do I move to my other CDs, if so required.

Didn't DP generate more HoPo overall? The tradeoff is control VS HoPo generation, right? It wouldn't make sense if DP generated less HoPo than HA.

You could sim it now. :) Switch from one talent to the other, and check your SotR uptime. Do make sure that if you're running 4 piece T15, you tell the sim to pop DP on CD, as it'll affect your HoPo generation.

Spoken about 4 piece, it should make DP a little stronger than without 4 piece, as 4 piece boosts DP, but not HA or SW.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Fetzie » Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:49 am

HA is 25 seconds of ShoR on demand every 2 minutes, which DivPurp will give you over all and on average more ShoR, you have little control over when (and if) they occur. So DivPurp would be better on a fight on which you are tanking the boss the entire time and no tank swaps occur and there are no phases of massively increased damage taken (Tortos, for example) and HA would be better on a fight when you need the coverage at a specific moment (like with Iron Qon heroic when all three dogs land).
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Klaudandus » Fri Oct 11, 2013 7:19 pm

Got a question... If you were to code your sim with 0%, where would our DPS be vis a vis equally geared tanks? In the case we're below other tanks, what's the theoretical amount of haste needed to just be on par with the 2nd worst tank?
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby theckhd » Sat Oct 12, 2013 1:23 pm

I would imagine a paladin tank with 0% haste would be near the bottom of the totem pole, if not at the bottom. The entire reason that warriors and DKs got Riposte was to keep their damage competitive with us, monks, and druids despite the fact that the latter gear for dps stats.

I'm not sure I can answer your question directly because I'm not 100% sure how accurate the Brewmaster and Guardian modules are in SimC. DKs and Warriors should be in relatively good shape since I know they're being worked on actively.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - MoP/5.x

Postby Klaudandus » Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:05 pm

theckhd wrote:I would imagine a paladin tank with 0% haste would be near the bottom of the totem pole, if not at the bottom. The entire reason that warriors and DKs got Riposte was to keep their damage competitive with us, monks, and druids despite the fact that the latter gear for dps stats.

I'm not sure I can answer your question directly because I'm not 100% sure how accurate the Brewmaster and Guardian modules are in SimC. DKs and Warriors should be in relatively good shape since I know they're being worked on actively.


ok, assume a paladin tank with only 540 Flex gear on, with the 4 best tier pieces you think are there, and the only haste he has coming from those tier pieces with haste on -- what is his dps on the sim?
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