[25N] Horridon

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[25N] Horridon

Postby Sagara » Thu Mar 07, 2013 6:30 am

So we got ten or tries on the guy last night. It was more "experimental" than anything because 23 peeps, 5 healers, among which 2 undergeared, so we decided to three-tank it. Here's the log if you're curious.

The boss in himself doesn't seem too though - good use of AM is the best way to handle Triple Puncture, and Paladins *rock* thanks to ShotR's nature. We just switched every door without too much trouble. Just have people move closer to the boss if they get charged to minimize the panic of a huge dino in the middle of an AoE-fest. Still, the adds seem to be a bit more problematic:

Farraki: easy as pie - stay closer to the side you come inside the room in, and move slowly to the other side of the gate as the sands start piling up. Get the stonegazers down ASAP, and you'll get through with minimal trouble.

Gurubashis are nasty little buggers compared to the Farraki - we often got upwards of 11 stacks of poison with the door littered in poison clouds. We had three dedicated interrupters on the Venomancers, but that didn't seem enough - should we rather focus the Effusions to limit the stacks, or the Venomancers to limit the amount of Effusion and speed things up? Also, if you got a MW Monk, Revival is awesome when you're done with Venomancers.

Drakkari didn't seem like much of a problem, but I got a hunch that we were wrong to just AoE the whole lot. The Mortal Strike debuff looks horrible, so maybe we should focus fire the Warlords and THEN wipe up the rest.

Amani: only got to those guys once, but they didn't seem too though. Just be careful to stop DPS'ing bears when another bear dies - the Beast Shaman is really nasty.

War-God seems easy enough, execution-wise: just have enough guys alive to burn him fast.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Chronos » Thu Mar 07, 2013 8:30 am

In our 10 n the gurubashi and drakkari were definitely the hardest. We burned effusions as they have way less hp and cast the same aoe spell that the priests do. We also marked priests when more than one were up and burned it fast. The Drakkari was the hardest for us with only two paladins on dispels one of them prot. Again we marked a mortal strike mob and cleaved off it. Two other things helped us a lot. Get control orb ASAP! Prevent another wave from coming. We also had everyone move towards Amani door so that all Drakkari hsd to run thru me to get to them. Cleanse on cd too.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Rhiannon » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:01 am

Recommend heroing on one of the doors, second or third. Proper interrupting makes a world of difference to the raid damage on the second, so if you get that sorted hero on the third door. At least on 10 man the last phase is a joke. We had 4 people dead by the time we got to the last phase on our kill try (standing on totems on fourth door primarily >_<) and no heroism, and one tank, and killed it fine, though we had paladin tank + paladin healer rotating hops to clear the tank debuff.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Bellanka » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:08 am

Rhiannon wrote:Recommend heroing on one of the doors, second or third. Proper interrupting makes a world of difference to the raid damage on the second, so if you get that sorted hero on the third door. At least on 10 man the last phase is a joke. We had 4 people dead by the time we got to the last phase on our kill try (standing on totems on fourth door primarily >_<) and no heroism, and one tank, and killed it fine, though we had paladin tank + paladin healer rotating hops to clear the tank debuff.


That's how we managed it. Assigned interrupts for second door, Lusted on third, laughed at 4th.

The only difference is that I tanked the boss the entire fight, using a /cancelaura macro and DS/HoP (with Clemency) to clear my stacks after each gate. Had a sustained 150k dps for it, while our Monk handled adds. Shield of the Righteous timed against Triple Puncture made tank healing a joke, so it was easier for our healers this way.

EDIT: for clarity.

But hey, challenge accepted :P
Last edited by Bellanka on Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Belloc » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:36 am

Bellanka, so you just tanked the boss and the adds? Did you run into any issues with Double Swipe or anything?
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Bellanka » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:43 pm

Belloc wrote:Bellanka, so you just tanked the boss and the adds? Did you run into any issues with Double Swipe or anything?


No, JUST the boss. No Tank swaps. I had Horridon from engage until he died and our Monk tanked adds. He has much better AoE threat, and I have much better single target survivability. I edited my previous post for clarity, sorry!

But thinking about this ... it is possible to solo tank the encounter, but your skills and awareness as a tank are going to have to be pretty spot on. Letting a Triple Puncture (370k base on normal 10m, +10% per stack ... ouch) go off without SoTR up to mitigate it would be rough. The vengeance stacks alone would cement any threat issues, melee can stand inside the boss, or off to the side and strafing out of and back into Double Strike is easy. Would need someone kiting the orb droppers in P3 and have our Disc Priest and Holydins healing... and this is definitely possible.

I'm going to ask my team if they wouldn't mind letting me try this for a pull or two next week.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby PsiVen » Thu Mar 07, 2013 6:45 pm

Shouldn't be too bad really, he will be charging into melee all the time anyway so they should be used to dodging swipes.

The only problem would be those orb dropping dicks, they Mortal Strike and hurt quite a bit. But if you Heroism that door with that much Vengeance and an extra DPS, they'll be dead before CDs fall.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Fenrìr » Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:19 am

Sagara wrote:The boss in himself doesn't seem too though - good use of AM is the best way to handle Triple Puncture, and Paladins *rock* thanks to ShotR's nature. We just switched every door without too much trouble. Just have people move closer to the boss if they get charged to minimize the panic of a huge dino in the middle of an AoE-fest. Still, the adds seem to be a bit more problematic:



Good use of Aura Mastery? For a physical attack?
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby daishan » Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:28 am

I would guess he means Active Mitigation, so our SotR :p
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Fenrìr » Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:57 am

Yea, that makes a lot more sense...lol. Similar acyronyms has me all confused.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Sagara » Fri Mar 08, 2013 4:01 am

Whoooooops! Yeah, Active Mitigation :) I'm trying to stay class-neutral, which doesn't help ^^
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Astronomic » Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:00 am

What's a good health percentage to have horridon at once you've finished the 4th door, and about how long does he have left on enrage? Also seems like horridon is the bane of our monk tank. He can get bursted down 500-600k hp in 2 seconds : /
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Sagara » Fri Mar 08, 2013 6:28 am

Astronomic wrote:What's a good health percentage to have horridon at once you've finished the 4th door, and about how long does he have left on enrage? Also seems like horridon is the bane of our monk tank. He can get bursted down 500-600k hp in 2 seconds : /


THat's probably because he can't use much of his defensive model - dodge and parry don't work on Triple Puncture, so he has to rely on his Stagger/Purifying Brew. COnsidering every other TP immediatly follows a Double Swipe, I can imagine him getting trounced. How much is he Staggering?
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Winkle » Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:34 am

Astronomic wrote:What's a good health percentage to have horridon at once you've finished the 4th door, and about how long does he have left on enrage? Also seems like horridon is the bane of our monk tank. He can get bursted down 500-600k hp in 2 seconds : /


You can have horridion at 100% as far as i can see. We literally didn't touch him until the 4th door was closed and he melted in p5 with hero.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Bellanka » Fri Mar 08, 2013 7:48 am

Sagara wrote:
Astronomic wrote:What's a good health percentage to have horridon at once you've finished the 4th door, and about how long does he have left on enrage? Also seems like horridon is the bane of our monk tank. He can get bursted down 500-600k hp in 2 seconds : /


THat's probably because he can't use much of his defensive model - dodge and parry don't work on Triple Puncture, so he has to rely on his Stagger/Purifying Brew. COnsidering every other TP immediatly follows a Double Swipe, I can imagine him getting trounced. How much is he Staggering?


Why would the Double Strike matter? That can be easily strafed out of, and strafed back into position when it's over. Triple Puncture and normal melee are the only boss abilities a tank should ever be hit by. I was talking to a few other tankadins last night after our raid (woo, whispers!) one of whom linked me a youtube of their attempts, and I saw their OT getting hit by Double Strike so often it was painful to watch, all because they were trying to run out backwards.

Double Strike is a cone AoE, which means it's narrower towards the boss. People who are having problems avoiding it can just straight towards the boss and a little out or, like I prefer, curve-strafe out and back in.

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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Sagara » Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:05 am

Bellanka wrote:
Sagara wrote:
Astronomic wrote:What's a good health percentage to have horridon at once you've finished the 4th door, and about how long does he have left on enrage? Also seems like horridon is the bane of our monk tank. He can get bursted down 500-600k hp in 2 seconds : /


THat's probably because he can't use much of his defensive model - dodge and parry don't work on Triple Puncture, so he has to rely on his Stagger/Purifying Brew. COnsidering every other TP immediatly follows a Double Swipe, I can imagine him getting trounced. How much is he Staggering?


Why would the Double Strike matter? That can be easily strafed out of, and strafed back into position when it's over. Triple Puncture and normal melee are the only boss abilities a tank should ever be hit by. I was talking to a few other tankadins last night after our raid (woo, whispers!) one of whom linked me a youtube of their attempts, and I saw their OT getting hit by Double Strike so often it was painful to watch, all because they were trying to run out backwards.

Double Strike is a cone AoE, which means it's narrower towards the boss. People who are having problems avoiding it can just straight towards the boss and a little out or, like I prefer, curve-strafe out and back in.


Two things - I was explaining why he could get downed so fast. Doesn't mean it's ok - like you said, it's fairly easy to dodge.
Second, it doesn't remove anything from the point - the monk's tanking method is not that hot for Horridon. You'd need to Purify just before and after the Puncture to be mostly OK, and you'll still be eating bigger spikes than the average paladin.

In fact, I'm seriously considering using the DS/HoP trick to tank a crapload of doors and let our Monk lolspin through the trash.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Bellanka » Fri Mar 08, 2013 8:12 am

Sagara wrote:
Two things - I was explaining why he could get downed so fast. Doesn't mean it's ok - like you said, it's fairly easy to dodge.
Second, it doesn't remove anything from the point - the monk's tanking method is not that hot for Horridon. You'd need to Purify just before and after the Puncture to be mostly OK, and you'll still be eating bigger spikes than the average paladin.

In fact, I'm seriously considering using the DS/HoP trick to tank a crapload of doors and let our Monk lolspin through the trash.



Ah, that makes sense. And yeah ... if a tank isn't avoiding that damage the issue comes down to playstyle. I've noticed that the normal modes are no joke like they were in previous tiers. And, to be quite honest, I kind of like it this way.

That method (Pally solo on Horridon, Monk on adds) is actually how we killed him. I specced into Clemency, and used DS/HoP/HoP/DS after each gate to stay on Horridon. Monk died to the 5th phase boss and I grabbed both with GoAK followed AW/HA+SoTR/WoG spam until the God-King-Whatever-His-Name-Was died.

This method was MUCH easier on Priest and Druid healers.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Astronomic » Fri Mar 08, 2013 9:33 am

Sagara wrote:
Astronomic wrote:What's a good health percentage to have horridon at once you've finished the 4th door, and about how long does he have left on enrage? Also seems like horridon is the bane of our monk tank. He can get bursted down 500-600k hp in 2 seconds : /


THat's probably because he can't use much of his defensive model - dodge and parry don't work on Triple Puncture, so he has to rely on his Stagger/Purifying Brew. COnsidering every other TP immediatly follows a Double Swipe, I can imagine him getting trounced. How much is he Staggering?


If I recall the stagger ticks were anywhere from 20-40k. I can't access the logs from work but if I recall it seemed like there would just be moments where all the monk's buffs werent up so you'd see somethign like 200k physical attack 150k triple puncture 200k physical attack, with stagger ticks thrown in there over 2 seconds.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby 99sitr » Fri Mar 08, 2013 10:48 am

My 25 man is currently hitting a wall with the Drakkari door. I'm solo tanking Horridon while our DK tanks all the adds. He isn't dying or getting low nor are the dps getting clipped by the adds. But when have the first door down to a minimal amount of sand traps. The second door apparently we are having issues with the priests and the effusions. The poison stacks seem to come in CPU te of 3-4 each attempt. We have dedicated interrupters and people dispelling but their just seems to be such an influx of damage at that point.

I'm managing keeping myself and my dedicated pally healer cleansed but decisive is just lighting up like a slot machine during that phase. I know they are focusing the first priest and if its not down by the time the second one pops they are continuing to focus on the first while throwing interrupts on the second. The problem is the effusions just throwing out all the stacking dots.

We have managed to get to the 3rd door but not without losing at least 4-9 people. Then the mortal strike add comes to say hi to me and its GG at that point.

We did have several new people last time but we put a solid 3 hours on the boss and the best was door 3 with plenty dead.

As far as me I am solo tanking Horridon and HoPing the stacks at 6-7 and trading HoP's with my healer and the damage has yet to be an issue like stated above.

I will post logs shortly as I'm on the phone ATM.



Best of luck to those still working on this one.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Solanthanius » Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:00 am

Bellanka wrote:
Sagara wrote:That method (Pally solo on Horridon, Monk on adds) is actually how we killed him. I specced into Clemency, and used DS/HoP/HoP/DS after each gate to stay on Horridon. Monk died to the 5th phase boss and I grabbed both with GoAK followed AW/HA+SoTR/WoG spam until the God-King-Whatever-His-Name-Was died.

This method was MUCH easier on Priest and Druid healers.


I also recommend it. Pally tanks are perfect for dealing with Horridon, 50-60% reduction on every triple puncture is godly, and this trick lets you tank him the entire fight without issue.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Heracles » Fri Mar 08, 2013 11:44 am

We did this boss in five attempts. First pull we had people dying in sand traps, not switching to the adds and trying to nuke the boss and we also had deaths to charge as the boss was tanked too close to the Farraki door. Generally it was a right old cluster fuck.

2nd pull we faired better as we moved the boss to the outside of the room between the open Farraki door and the next one along (Gurubashi) with a Holy Paladin healing the MT, with a Resto Shaman helping out. On this try we wiped there due to lack of dispels and lack of people getting on the Priests quickly enough. Poisons basically overwhelmed us.

On the third pull we got our dispels more organised, marked up the Priests with skull and faired much better on interrupts on Venom Bolt. We used a Mistweaver Monk popping Revival at the end of the phase to clear any remaining debuffs. Again we tanked the boss fair away from the raid between the Gurubashi door and the Drakkari door to give a good charge distance. We HoP'ed/Salv'ed the MT healers or anyone else who got low from any adds on them and stacked the raid up as much as we could to AoE the Warriors and Champions down effectively (remember these do not have an aggro table and fixate on people).

Fourth pull we did even better still and got the boss to hit enrage. This was mainly due to deaths in various phases, most of which I think were on the second door again which we felt was by far the hardest. On the fifth pull we got the kill as you can see here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... FBe-MAddXE

We lost me on the pull as I was told to reposition the boss, even though in hindsight he was probably fine where he was, so the start is a little scrappy. I basically missed my CD on Triple Puncture and our Holy Pala was moving and hadn't got me topped. We went with three tanks, 6 healers, so our Warrior picked him up til I was ressed then we got back into a nice flow as you can see.

Our Bear took the adds, myself and the Warrior helped pick up loose ones when not tanking Horridon and switched the boss between the two of us every door. So I did door 1 and 3, he did 2 and 4. As soon as he butted the last door we pulled him into the middle for the final phase of nuking the Warlord and then the boss.

It is however interesting to hear in the above posts that I could solo tank the boss, but we had no real issues doing things the way we did once people worked out exactly what they had to do. Myself and the Warrior found the 6 stacks we gained per door was no problem to take. Once the boss was in the middle we generally swapped on 3 stacks each due to having three tanks. Though this might not work with a lower geared raid, this being said we did have about a minute left on enrage which will leave some margin for error or gear.

As long as you stay out of shit, avoid charge, tank the boss by the wall between the door you're on and the next one you're going to go to and as soon as the boss butts the door closed run off with your healer to the next position you will tank him you shouldn't have too many issues. Other concerns are obviously nuking down the Dinomancers and Warlord when he comes out, when he did we used Heroism. The main problem we had really was door two, make sure you nuke Priests as prio, interrupt them and dispel, cannot stress that enough. The Monk Revival was very very handy indeed.

Once again, I hope the above helps someone out there.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Belloc » Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:11 pm

A note for Paladin perma-tanks on Horridon: When Horridon starts the process of breaking a door, you have time to help DPS adds. Usually, your raid is probably moving to the next door at this point, so Horridon is going to have to travel a bit to catch up to you. When he does eventually catch up to you, his first attack is going to be a triple puncture. I found that it was very difficult to cast ShoR on him before he used triple puncture during these periods and, as a result, I would get hit really hard (I usually had around 8 stacks of TP at this point... not enough for me to want to bubble/HoP it quite yet).

The solution I ended up going with was to hit ShoR on an add just before the boss caught back up. This only works, however, if you still have an add up when Horridon catches up. If you have no adds up, you either have to mash ShoR on Horridon and hope that it goes off before he uses TP or have an acceptable cooldown up. Alternatively, you can try timing your taunt-HoP/Bubble so that he's taunt-fixated when he reaches you, immuning the TP. More often than not, you should still have at least one add that you can keep up without any danger, so you should be able to get a ShoR off about 1 second before the boss catches up.

I don't expect this to be a major problem for most people, but it did catch me off guard and wiped us once. I imagine that some of you may have run into this issue without even realizing it. Anyway, I hope it helps someone!
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Heracles » Fri Mar 08, 2013 12:14 pm

99sitr wrote:My 25 man is currently hitting a wall with the Drakkari door. I'm solo tanking Horridon while our DK tanks all the adds. He isn't dying or getting low nor are the dps getting clipped by the adds. But when have the first door down to a minimal amount of sand traps. The second door apparently we are having issues with the priests and the effusions. The poison stacks seem to come in CPU te of 3-4 each attempt. We have dedicated interrupters and people dispelling but their just seems to be such an influx of damage at that point.

I'm managing keeping myself and my dedicated pally healer cleansed but decisive is just lighting up like a slot machine during that phase. I know they are focusing the first priest and if its not down by the time the second one pops they are continuing to focus on the first while throwing interrupts on the second. The problem is the effusions just throwing out all the stacking dots.

We have managed to get to the 3rd door but not without losing at least 4-9 people. Then the mortal strike add comes to say hi to me and its GG at that point.

We did have several new people last time but we put a solid 3 hours on the boss and the best was door 3 with plenty dead.

As far as me I am solo tanking Horridon and HoPing the stacks at 6-7 and trading HoP's with my healer and the damage has yet to be an issue like stated above.

I will post logs shortly as I'm on the phone ATM.



Best of luck to those still working on this one.


What kind of saver rotation have you got set up? The second door is a bit of a bitch compared to the other ones which we found kinda faceroll tbh, provided people get on adds and stay out of shit. Just remember it's virtually impossible to dispel everything, try to out heal and dispel what you can, the rest is down to solid DPS on the Priests and Effusions is what's required and EVERYONE has to switch to them. We basically don't touch the boss if adds are up and people really need to get their heads around that fact or you will struggle on this door (well same is true of every door tbh, this one more so though). The quicker the adds die, the easier this fight is. You get PLENTY of time on the boss in the last phase when he takes increased damage.

On that 2nd door we just did out best with dispels, tried to mitigate the damage from the poisons as much as we could with an organised pre-prepared raid saver rotation and ofc interrupts from ranged, melee and healers alike. Too much dispelling = not enough healing and also not enough dispelling means too much damage out put. Find a balance, mitigate what you can and get everyone to step up their game, especially DPS by the sounds of it.

Again as I mentioned in my post above, a Mistweaver with Revival once the adds are dead is Godly, as you then go into the next fight clear of debuffs.

Good luck for your next raid, I'm sure you'll get him!
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Raive » Sat Mar 09, 2013 7:47 pm

I was wondering how people were handling the priests on the second door.

Is your priority just to focus fire the priests until they're all dead (limiting the number of effusions that spawn).
Or do you burn down effusions when they're up to help manage the aoe dot?
I've been thinking next time we get in there to try it maybe of having 1 or 2 assigned interruptors/burst dps switch to the effusions when they spawn and have the rest stick to the venom priests.
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Re: [25N] Horridon

Postby Darielle » Sat Mar 09, 2013 7:54 pm

Second, it doesn't remove anything from the point - the monk's tanking method is not that hot for Horridon. You'd need to Purify just before and after the Puncture to be mostly OK, and you'll still be eating bigger spikes than the average paladin.

In fact, I'm seriously considering using the DS/HoP trick to tank a crapload of doors and let our Monk lolspin through the trash.


The Monk's tanking method works perfectly. The early ones are a joke, and proper use of cycling Guard, Dampen Harm, Zen Meditation, plus the fact that Fort Brew adds to extra stagger and lasts 20 seconds, should work perfectly. They're not really just sitting there hoping Purify will take care of it. If the Monk is letting Shuffle fall off, they're probably in for a bit of hurt, but they should never do that.

I'm not really convinced by anything really being gained from the using of BoP/Bubble on Horridon. You can swap over tanks every time adds are dead with no real issue, and the good thing about swapping tanks is that you maximise use of both offensive and defensive cooldowns on the targets that matter. MAYBE if the other tank is really poor at dodging Double Swipe or bad at keeping their buffs/cooldowns up, or honestly if the Paladin isn't very good at picking up adds so having the other tank on adds always is better, I can see it being a benefit. Otherwise, it works, but I don't see a realistic benefit out of it.
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