Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby KysenMurrin » Wed Aug 08, 2012 10:46 am

It was mentioned in an official forum thread a while back that low level toons were becoming unhittable through Strength, so it makes sense they would have retuned the curve.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby Sabindeus » Wed Aug 08, 2012 11:31 am

Darielle wrote:Yeah, the gems part.


ah yes they did change gems because red gems were too badass
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby theckhd » Wed Aug 08, 2012 11:35 am

KysenMurrin wrote:It was mentioned in an official forum thread a while back that low level toons were becoming unhittable through Strength, so it makes sense they would have retuned the curve.

Possibly, though I'd have expected that to reduce the str->parry conversion, not increase it. They may have reduced it at lower levels and buffed it slightly at higher levels, of course - this could just be the consequence of a new piecewise function. Weird, either way.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby halabar » Wed Aug 08, 2012 11:38 am

Sabindeus wrote:
Darielle wrote:Yeah, the gems part.


ah yes they did change gems because red gems were too badass


and they failed to some degree.

looking at hunter sims, you are more likely to use other color gems, but only to meet hit and expertise caps, after that, it's back to red gems all the time. They need to make socket bonuses stronger if they really want to make true choices.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby Nooska » Wed Aug 08, 2012 11:56 am

halabar wrote:
Sabindeus wrote:
Darielle wrote:Yeah, the gems part.


ah yes they did change gems because red gems were too badass


and they failed to some degree.

looking at hunter sims, you are more likely to use other color gems, but only to meet hit and expertise caps, after that, it's back to red gems all the time. They need to make socket bonuses stronger if they really want to make true choices.


Having just run some BM sims on Zeherahs (dev version) tool, I slightly disagree - if the socket bonus is agility, it is worthwhile to do a hybrid gem, as the socket boni have increase quite a bit compared to gem strength.
Apart from that it is of course a good idea to pick up the socket boni for blue sockets with the gems you want to add for hit, though both hit and exp seem to be annoying amounts due to both gems and secondary stat allocations growing so much (WTB reduced reforging, like "I want to reforge 20 hit rating to 20 expertise") - after spending about an hour and a ghalf on it, the closest I could get without being under cap was; 155 exp over cap and 117 hit over cap - any different reforges would either leave me under cap, though only 15 exp rating which was a gain of ~80dps - at the cost of being dodged(/pet parried) at the most inopportune time (Murphys law applied to raiding) or a straight out dps loss - and its not enough to lose a hybrid gem.

Also, on helms it seems that you want the socket bonus regardless (heroic t14 helm has 180 agi as socket bonus, a gem is only 160).
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby halabar » Wed Aug 08, 2012 12:07 pm

Nooska wrote:Having just run some BM sims on Zeherahs (dev version) tool, I slightly disagree - if the socket bonus is agility, it is worthwhile to do a hybrid gem,...


Not my experience, but I'll take it to a pm to avoid the derail here.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby Darielle » Wed Aug 08, 2012 2:56 pm

Possibly, though I'd have expected that to reduce the str->parry conversion, not increase it. They may have reduced it at lower levels and buffed it slightly at higher levels, of course - this could just be the consequence of a new piecewise function. Weird, either way.


That is ... very interesting.

I used an 87 and 89 to test it because they actually had the Cataclysm gems where my lvl 90 vendored all things for bag space. In hindsight, that was probably a bad assumption.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby theckhd » Wed Aug 08, 2012 3:35 pm

No worries, I made the same assumption when I verified it on an 85 premade yesterday. That's why we test these things, after all.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby Darielle » Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:02 pm

Still, I guess slightly over/under doesn't make much difference in the key thing to take away from it. We were never going to actually gem Strength or anything like that anyway, but with STrength not being trivial, it allows something like a stacking Str trinket along the lines of the SPine trinkets at lvl 90 to be .... an interesting choice.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby theckhd » Wed Aug 08, 2012 6:34 pm

Well, it does make the difference between using STR/STA or Parry/STA in a red slot (assuming you're not using exp/sta). Although with Kings, it's still a pretty close call, and the extra AP from STR may make it the favorite.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby Darielle » Wed Aug 08, 2012 7:17 pm

I can see that for magic encounters, which was the main reason I initially saw the numbers and got a bit excited.

80Str/120Stam has the equivalent of 160Parry/120Stam, and whether we get 75 or 85 Parry from the Str, I don't know if AP can actually make it win out over the remaining 75 or 85 Parry on general melee. With Cataclysm gems, it's a clear win, but MoP gems ... ~. A magic scenario where Parry and ShoR would be of lower value makes the comparison more exciting.

It could make for a decent compromise between dps and survivability too, if it can match or outperform Exp/Sta's dps/survivability boost. The numbers will be able to answer that soon enough.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby theckhd » Wed Aug 08, 2012 7:46 pm

Bleh, that's right, I forgot about the doubling of secondary stats on gems. But it would still be applicable to the trinket comparison you were talking about earlier, for example. Or anything non-gem.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby Ironshaft » Thu Aug 09, 2012 4:42 am

Sir Theck,

I have looked back and seen that you did stat weighting for other tank specs in Cata in addition to Prot Pallies.

Do you, by chance, have the spec weightings for MoP Protection Warriors and Blood DKs? Or do you not have enough info yet to run those simulations?

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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby theckhd » Thu Aug 09, 2012 5:17 am

Ironshaft wrote:I have looked back and seen that you did stat weighting for other tank specs in Cata in addition to Prot Pallies.

Do you, by chance, have the spec weightings for MoP Protection Warriors and Blood DKs? Or do you not have enough info yet to run those simulations?

I don't think I ever did stat weights for other tank specs in Cataclysm, but I did do some analytical calculations for prot warriors earlier in MoP Beta. That was from April though, a bunch of changes have been made since then.

I was going to re-visit the paladin calculations soon (maybe even today) anyway, just to update them. I can try and take a look at warriors and see what's changed. I doubt I'll have time to work on Death Knights though - my plate is full enough with paladin theorycrafting already.
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Re: Mists of Pandaria protection stats.

Postby theckhd » Thu Aug 09, 2012 7:25 pm

Reposting from the CtA thread:
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Can Sanctity of Battle affect Avenger Shield?


Yes.


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