Star Wars; Old Republic

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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby aureon » Tue May 08, 2012 1:48 pm

What do you espect from a mainly story-centered game design?
A normal MMO is chores during levelling, and giggles on max.
SWTOR was the exact contrary. Makes sense tbh. And 1.3 mil subs aren't anything to scoff at - what's it, 2nd sub MMO after WoW?
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Gab » Tue May 08, 2012 2:21 pm

sahiel wrote:Shame to see such a drop but I think it's probably a bit ridiculous to expect a game with 1.3 million paying subs to go free to play. If it drops down to well below a mil, that's certainly likely but given they were 'aiming' for 1.5 mil as their target audience I doubt it'll be even on the table, certainly not until they've had a year or more to try and rebuild their subscriber base, given two new content patches are slated this quarter and an expac possibly near the end of the year.


Not sure where the 'aiming' for 1.5 mil is coming from. Analysts were expecting SW to reach 1.5 million subscribers but now expect subs to level off at 1 million. That's pretty significant.

It'll be awhile before SW goes FTP obviously (if ever) but it's on the right track if history is any indicator. Losing that many subs in such a short period of time is not good.

Also keep in mind that 1.3 mil is generous because that includes all accounts that were on the "one month free".

aureon wrote:What do you espect from a mainly story-centered game design?
A normal MMO is chores during levelling, and giggles on max.
SWTOR was the exact contrary. Makes sense tbh. And 1.3 mil subs aren't anything to scoff at - what's it, 2nd sub MMO after WoW?


2nd like Rift was, Aion was, Conan was, Warhammer was etc...

Don't get me wrong they could turn it around, but at the moment the outlook is pretty bleak.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby anafielle » Tue May 08, 2012 7:34 pm

Shyrtandros wrote:Contrary to what a lot of people believe you actually can see the entire raids performance instead of just your own, and you can see it in real time too. A program like MOX Desktop Parser works great. You just point the program to your log folder and it does the rest just like “Recount” would for WoW. It has an option for a “Pop-out Window” to look similar to Recount.

In order to get it to show everybody you have to do a “Raid Sync” basically the raid leader will generate a “Raid Key” for example MZL_L_1138, everyone drops it into their Parser, Syncs and then when combat begins everyone will show up.

While it requires the extra step of dropping in a raid key it’s no harder than installing a WoW Addon.


Thanks a lot for posting that! I am actually a whole lot happier with that implementation.

To be honest I think that's pretty cool. Contrary to what it might sound like, I'm ok with letting people only see their own performance and protect their own information ..... while letting a like-minded group of people share information when they want to share. If it can really be seen in game as easily as you say, while just everyone basically "agreeing" to it, that's a pretty neat implementation and I agree that it's definitely no more complex than installing an addon. Wow might be a much more happy place in general if everyone had to agree to share their combat information. :) As long as it's as easy as it sounds and not crazy buggy... very interesting implementation. I didn't realize it was sync-able in game as you describe.

I'm tempted to say "well done" and go back for a look.

Unfortunately it sounds like too-little, too late. My own unhappiness with the game had a raider's flavor to it, but I wasn't the only person who thought they didn't put near enough focus on endgame until it was too late. The subscriber drop doesn't surprise me at all. They're completely right about the cause. People got to 50 - maybe they even got two 50s - and the endgame didn't hold them there. There are a lot of ways to implement a compelling endgame, and hard raiding isn't the only way to do it, but SWTOR failed at all of them upon launch and for months.

Also I ended up on Republic side. :( I like Republic. SWTOR doesn't like Republic though.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Pala » Tue May 08, 2012 8:11 pm

We use Mox in our Operations and the little pop out windows work well. You can view the logs later on too. They keep breaking stuff with patches and fix the silly stuff. I like my Sniper and the new Operations are good but I'd rather play TERA Online when not operating.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Winkle » Thu May 10, 2012 7:41 am

Have they fixed Illum yet? I couldn't believe the mess they made of world pvp.

What about rated BG's?
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Shyrtandros » Fri May 11, 2012 7:22 am

Winkle wrote:Have they fixed Illum yet? I couldn't believe the mess they made of world pvp.

What about rated BG's?



They retired Ilum, no more quests or reasons to go there unless you organize a group vs group battle for fun.

Rated WZ's are still not in the game and are still "coming soon".
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Shyrtandros » Fri May 11, 2012 7:24 am

Shyrtandros wrote:
Winkle wrote:Have they fixed Illum yet? I couldn't believe the mess they made of world pvp.

What about rated BG's?



They retired the Ilum pvp area, no more quests or reasons to go there unless you organize a group vs group battle for fun.

Rated WZ's are still not in the game and are still "coming soon".
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Barathorn » Tue May 15, 2012 7:18 am

I cancelled my account 3 weeks ago. I had no reason to log in other than to stare at what could have been. Cracking game but really its a single player game because Bioware set the caps far too low for initial servers thus killing any sense of community because it never had a chance to grow. Still glad I played it but I feel its a wasted opportunity.

I am currently playing a free Ultima Online server pre Renaisance which is brutal, gritty and real while I wait for the Secret World and GW2.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Shyrtandros » Tue May 15, 2012 7:57 am

Barathorn wrote:I cancelled my account 3 weeks ago. I had no reason to log in other than to stare at what could have been. Cracking game but really its a single player game because Bioware set the caps far too low for initial servers thus killing any sense of community because it never had a chance to grow. Still glad I played it but I feel its a wasted opportunity.

I am currently playing a free Ultima Online server pre Renaisance which is brutal, gritty and real while I wait for the Secret World and GW2.


I’m about || close to cancelling out my subscription too. The only thing holding me back is my friends and guildies since I’m the GM. (Yeah that’s REALLY bad.) Although I’m thinking of just MAKING sure they have my Skype, battle.net ID, and of course access to my mumble and just communicating with them all that way. I don’t see why I would bother continuing with SWTOR since now I have D3, LOL & GW2 Beta and if I really wanted MOP beta.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Barathorn » Tue May 15, 2012 8:04 am

If you are going to play GW2 I might hit you up for a guild invite when it starts.

I think quite a few people are waiting for it now and despite my initial reservations it does look to be what I want from a game. The Secret World interests me because it has the same skill progression style as UO but I think it might be a bit samey after a while.

We found with SWTOR anything with voice dialogue just doesn't work one bit when you are on ventrillo with your friends as all that happens is you end up logging out from vent to hear the story narrative which really works at cross purposes to enjoying the game with your friends.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Shyrtandros » Tue May 15, 2012 8:49 am

Barathorn wrote:If you are going to play GW2 I might hit you up for a guild invite when it starts.


I’m not big into the Guild Wars series like my father and his geezers are but they’ve definitely got a guild put together for everyone and you’d be more than welcome to join.  (Woot for having a gamer dad! I hooked him on Asteroids (15?) years ago.

Barathorn wrote:
I think quite a few people are waiting for it now and despite my initial reservations it does look to be what I want from a game. The Secret World interests me because it has the same skill progression style as UO but I think it might be a bit samey after a while.


I can’t say much because I haven’t tried it – however I’ve had a lot of “meh” feedback on The Secret World from everyone.

Barathorn wrote:We found with SWTOR anything with voice dialogue just doesn't work one bit when you are on ventrillo with your friends as all that happens is you end up logging out from vent to hear the story narrative which really works at cross purposes to enjoying the game with your friends.

This is going to be a problem we’re all going to have to learn to work with. Diablo 3, Guild Wars 2 and many other new games are coming with Voice Dialogue.

As a side note.. I love how everyone thought SWTOR was “the bees knees” with their voice dialogue missions when Diablo 2 had Voice Dialogue 14 years for all of their quests. (Albeit voice acting for D2 probably took like an hour.. lol)
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby sahiel » Tue May 15, 2012 12:00 pm

Shyrtandros wrote:
Barathorn wrote:We found with SWTOR anything with voice dialogue just doesn't work one bit when you are on ventrillo with your friends as all that happens is you end up logging out from vent to hear the story narrative which really works at cross purposes to enjoying the game with your friends.

This is going to be a problem we’re all going to have to learn to work with. Diablo 3, Guild Wars 2 and many other new games are coming with Voice Dialogue.

Might I suggest Mumble instead of vent, we started using it and it's far preferable. The sound seems clearer, people who used to lag on vent are lag free, it can auto quieten music you have playing a bit when someone speaks if you choose, it has a simple button to mute both mic and headset from mumble (individually or together) so there's no need to log out for quest convos etc.

All in all I'm really pleased we switched to it, oh and it was half the price of vent as well.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Shyrtandros » Tue May 15, 2012 12:28 pm

sahiel wrote:
Shyrtandros wrote:
Barathorn wrote:We found with SWTOR anything with voice dialogue just doesn't work one bit when you are on ventrillo with your friends as all that happens is you end up logging out from vent to hear the story narrative which really works at cross purposes to enjoying the game with your friends.

This is going to be a problem we’re all going to have to learn to work with. Diablo 3, Guild Wars 2 and many other new games are coming with Voice Dialogue.

Might I suggest Mumble instead of vent, we started using it and it's far preferable. The sound seems clearer, people who used to lag on vent are lag free, it can auto quieten music you have playing a bit when someone speaks if you choose, it has a simple button to mute both mic and headset from mumble (individually or together) so there's no need to log out for quest convos etc.

All in all I'm really pleased we switched to it, oh and it was half the price of vent as well.


Doh! I totally meant to mention this in my last post. We immediately made the switch to Mumble and it’s great because we can drop in the chat box or just make a quick “Listening to RP” statement and pop the speaker off / mic off buttons.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Baelor » Tue Jun 12, 2012 10:11 am

I had a blast getting my Jedi Knight to 50 and gearing him up in operations.
It was even fun running the same hard-mode flashpoint daily for a piece of gear I wanted, trying to beat my fastest speed record with PUG members as I flew through the flashpoint at warp speed, dragging the bewildered PUG's with me.

The problem I'm encountering now is that while the class stories are fun, I've seen the world arc before. I have little desire to re-live the Republic world arc, and I don't want to play Empire. Thus, I'm finding little motivation to play alts, and I've maxed out the PvE progression for my Knight.

The thought of subscription cancellation is dancing around in my head, and having trouble finding reasons to quiet it. And this is coming from a guy who was so jazzed about this game that he volunteered time for a fan site in a vain attempt to get insider info.

I want to love SWTOR, but I don't know if I can.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby sahiel » Tue Jun 12, 2012 3:47 pm

Baelor wrote:The problem I'm encountering now is that while the class stories are fun, I've seen the world arc before. I have little desire to re-live the Republic world arc, and I don't want to play Empire. Thus,


Any particularly strong reason? The Imperial Agent story-line is one of the strongest and most interesting in the whole game imo and that of most of my friends and guild mates who have tried it, definitely worth a go I'd suggest.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Baelor » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:18 pm

sahiel wrote:
Baelor wrote:The problem I'm encountering now is that while the class stories are fun, I've seen the world arc before. I have little desire to re-live the Republic world arc, and I don't want to play Empire. Thus,


Any particularly strong reason? The Imperial Agent story-line is one of the strongest and most interesting in the whole game imo and that of most of my friends and guild mates who have tried it, definitely worth a go I'd suggest.

Most Empire NPC's are douches from what I've experienced. In my head the Empire are the bad guys, and I hate playing the bad guy, even if I can be civilly disobedient by choosing light side options. I'm still working for "the wrong side". Know what I mean?
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Sagara » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:19 pm

Depends. See above for the Imperial Agent: the head council is a grab-bag of douchebags and don't try to hide it. Meanwhile, there are many, MANY decent people even higher up in the structure (I'm thinking about your team leader in the IA story).

To be perfectly honest, the big difference between the Republican and Imperial structure is that Imperial command does not even go through the motions of "trying to help the helpless". I remember many a fuckton of crap being sent my way in the Soldier story, to the point that defection did not seem THAT stupid. OTOH, the Sith do look downright moronic most of the time...

I think my best definition would be "A place with little personal liberties in the name of the group, whose evangelical faction found godlike power by become cackling egomaniacs. They then decided because THEY had power, THEY should decide how the place was run."
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Torquemada » Mon Jun 18, 2012 7:12 pm

Baelor wrote:Most Empire NPC's are douches from what I've experienced. In my head the Empire are the bad guys, and I hate playing the bad guy, even if I can be civilly disobedient by choosing light side options. I'm still working for "the wrong side". Know what I mean?


Fortunately, you get to kill most of those.

As for the problem with launching with too many servers, they're in the process of shrinking down to about 12 or so servers for US, and 11 for Europe. This obviously spells T-R-O-U-B-L-E, but it means that for the first time since I can't remember I didn't spend more time fishing for a group to do the heroic daily missions than I did doing the missions. And it also means Barrens, er, Fleet Chat is back on, with people actually wanting to run shit. Good times while it lasts.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Epimer » Sun Jun 24, 2012 3:15 am

I apologise if this has been answered earlier: are there any particular classes which excel at soloing?

I've just picked up SWTOR with 60 days play time in the hope that it'll keep me occupied until MoP release time. I've no intention of doing much group end-game stuff so I'm only really interested in doing stuff solo.

I appreciate that all classes have soloing capabilities because of the companion system but are there any particular stand-outs that people would recommend?
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Torquemada » Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:43 am

Epimer wrote:I apologise if this has been answered earlier: are there any particular classes which excel at soloing?

I've just picked up SWTOR with 60 days play time in the hope that it'll keep me occupied until MoP release time. I've no intention of doing much group end-game stuff so I'm only really interested in doing stuff solo.

I appreciate that all classes have soloing capabilities because of the companion system but are there any particular stand-outs that people would recommend?


Depends on what role you want to fill, but if you're solo I'm going to assume you plan to go dps to play with the option to respec later. Generally I've found having you healer out means less down time, so assuming that, the only class that starts with a healer companion first is the Bounty Hunter. If you have any desire to tank later on go Powertech, otherwise go Mercenary as it's got much better range and self heals. That said, some of the other dps specs work decently with a tank companion so long as you can toss a heal their way if need be. Examples would be the Inquisitor/Consular when in the Sorcerer/Sage advanced classes, or the Agent/Smuggler as an Operative/Scoundrel.

I'm personally playing through as one of each advanced class, based on the fact that Imperial and Republic are mirrors of each other. So my Warrior is a Juggernaut tank, my Knight is a Sentinel dps, etc. I've personally had the most fun on the Warrior, the Bounty Hunter (Powertech), the Smuggler (Scoundrel), and the Trooper (Commando). I wanted to like the Assassin tank as it's like a Paladin with stealth in terms of mechanics, but I'm just not a fan of how it's been working out. It has a very set rotation that don't care for and while I was a fan of one rotation in WotLK I'm not caring for it in SWTOR.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby econ21 » Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:28 am

I would agree with that recommendation of the warrior tank. I levelled with the mirror (Jedi Knight tank) and had a blast. It is such a clone of a WoW protection warrior, Blizzard could sue but I found it even more fun than my protection warrior. I have a razor naga mouse with 12 buttons and think I mapped about 48 of them (x alt, shift, control). You have a ton of abilities and while people have complained about that, it did make solo levelling a lot of fun for me. After 939 etc on the protadin, it was just great to have such a big tool box and the freedom to pull out of it what you like. (By contrast, I am currently levelling a combat rogue alt and at level 82 still only have about 2 buttons I press.) I particularly enjoyed the animations - the kind of complex, fast moving game style really suits the light saber/martial arts style of a Jedi. You see your character balletically responding to your button mashing; it is most pleasing. I guess the aesthetics are why I enjoyed it even more than my prot warrior.

Bear in mind that you typically solo with an NPC. Most of the time, I went with a jedi dps because I liked her character. In terms of power, we were fragile - strangely for a tank - but full of sound and fury. It was kind of like double dps arena: your dps output has to race your diminishing heal bar. By contrast, on the few occasions I took the healer NPC, I was virtually indestructible but I found the experience dull. Risk of death is a good thing while soloing (someone should tell Blizzard that).

I realise now that I've made a post about aesthetics when you may have been asking about power, but I imagine all classes are powerful enough for soloing so it is more of an aesthetic issue.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Gracerath » Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:33 pm

I would like to hear thoughts on their new LFG system. Does it work for their raids too? I got two months to kill and if the LFG system is halfway decent, I may resub for a short while.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Staatt » Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:28 am

I played around with the LFD tool a bit this weekend, and I was happy about it. I have a recent 50 and a level 25; both dps. It took 30 mins or so to get into flasphoints on my level 25, and probably 10 minutes on my 50. I am not raid-geared so I only queued for local planet content (like Black Hole on Corelia) and flashpoints. The other players were friendly and helpful. I think that pooling from just your server may limit douchebaggery. Also, if you put someone on Ignore, then you will never get paired with them.

It is a little buggy. You can select what role you want to queue with, but, if you aren't the group leader then it overrides your role and you may end up as a healer if your class could be both (I believe this is the case; it happened twice when I was playing with my wife who has a dps trooper). Also, it will teleport you to the flashpoint you queued for but won't teleport you to the planet if you did planetary content. There are obviously workarounds, but I found the first bug pretty annoying (as I'm sure the groups that we got paired with did) until I figured out how to get around it.

I'm all in all happy with it since it's so early after release.
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Gracerath » Tue Jul 31, 2012 12:51 pm

Bye space sword!
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Re: Star Wars; Old Republic

Postby Flex » Tue Jul 31, 2012 1:10 pm

I guess you pay money to buy cartel points and use cartel points to purchase game access?
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