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Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Mists of Pandaria Beta discussion

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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Wed May 16, 2012 12:31 am

I've caught this just as I'm heading out the door, so won't be able to be as thorough as I'd like :)

You've got the gist of it. Funnel chi into maintaining Shuffle uptime, and on Purifying Brew to clear Stagger at yellow or red (you'll never have to do this while questing).

Take Power Strikes, and try to be conscious of the 15s ICD. You need that chi.

Tiger Palm no longer buffs Guard. You won't have enough resources to guarantee 100% Shuffle uptime, 100% Guard uptime and frequent Purifying Brew use, so you need to be choosey about when to use Guard.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Wed May 16, 2012 3:14 am

Thanks for the info!

So, maybe the idea is that you combine guard + shuffle + purifying brew during heavy damage, but to get the chi for that you have to accept periods with no shuffle while you eat some Stagger ticks?

If that's the way it works it looks like the Monk has some powerful tools which, if used properly, enables him to smooth out the overall damage during the fight. Mitigate spike damage by accepting higher damage during lulls in the fight.

Have you tried tanking as a low level Monk? Monks don't get shuffle nor purifying brew until the low 70s, leaving them with leather armor, 20% reduction from Ox stand - and, of course, Guard always active. Is that enough to survive leveling dungeons?

I never played a rogue in cata, and only leveled my feral druid. Haste affects energy regen, right? Which would mean that haste -> more energy -> more chi? Maybe 100% shuffle + 100% guard + sufficient purifying brew will be possible at high gear level (I hope not). Energy is not spent on miss/parry/dodge? Is chi lost on miss/parry/dodge? I'm guessing chi generation/usage is affected by hit and expertise, otherwise brewmasters would dump them.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Skye1013 » Wed May 16, 2012 5:13 pm

As a leveling monk, yes it's enough (provided you aren't surprised by boss mechanics, such as doing the new SM stuff.) Not sure Guard is working correctly (haven't been on in a week, so it's possible whatever I was seeing has been "fixed" if it was even broken to begin with.)

That being said, leveling dungeons are easy anyway. And that's coming from a character that wasn't using BoAs at the time. Now I am, but only because I want to finish leveling and try out some of the new "end game" stuff. I know I could just make a premade, but I'd much rather learn the class mechanics as much as possible through leveling with constant changes and easymode dungeons. That and I hate having to set up a level 85s bars from scratch... did that with a mage, and it was not what I consider fun.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Tue May 22, 2012 3:22 pm

Thanks for the viewpoint on leveling Brewmasters!

I have to say that I'm really looking forward to testing out the Brewmaster. Almost too excited, as I want to play it now, but I got no plans to try the beta :) (Not that I could, as I didn't buy the annual pass.)

When Mists drop I'll head straight for Echo Isles with my baby Troll Monk, set up some /dance macros (he knows Capoeira, don't you know) and head for 90. I like tanking 5-mans and healing raids, so a third tank/healer class is very welcome.

(edit: I wonder if I could get blizz to implement a minor glyph that lets Troll Monks replace the "ready to attack" animation with the ginga animation?)
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby bldavis » Tue May 22, 2012 6:18 pm

i would like that for any race!
be funny seeing a tauren do that!
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Wed May 23, 2012 4:19 am

Damn, had a look at troll monk animations. They're cool enough, especially with Blackout Kick taking the animation straight from the troll dance, but the combat idle animation just looks wrong.

Could somebody with access to the US forums do me a big favor and post a suggestion about changing it to the "ginga" animation from the dance? Either through a glyph for everybody or, failing that, just for (male) trolls? :)

edit: posted this to the eu beta forum:
Alternate (Troll) Monk combat idle animation

As you all know, the male troll dance is based on Capoeira, which is a real-life martial art/dance hybrid. I think it would be awesome if there was an option to incorporate that into (troll) monks combat animations. Specifically, the "shuffle" dance move (step backwards with one foot, reset, then the other) is Capoeira's equivalent of a "ready" stance, called the Ginga. If you've played Tekken you've seen it used by Eddie and Christie while waiting for a round to start.

I would love it if there was a way for troll monks to use that as their combat idle animation - hopefully it's not too difficult technically seeing as the animation is already in the game. Some ways it could be done:

- Male Troll monks have it as baseline, or can replace the current animation with a minor glyph

- All Troll monks have it as baseline or as a glyph option

- Make a minor glyph available to all characters to replace the standard animation with the Ginga

- Or you could take it all the way and make a minor glyph that replaced all special physical attack animations (blackout kick, rising sun kick, combat idle etc) with moves taken from the troll dance.

Maybe a troll learned the art of the monk from the pandaren, but then, being aware that ancient trolls practiced a similar art that today is only used in dance, combined the moves to make his own style? And he's now teaching it to others?

Would it be an interesting option? Would you use it on your monk?
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Sabindeus » Tue May 29, 2012 4:23 pm

Paxen wrote:edit: posted this to the eu beta forum:
Alternate (Troll) Monk combat idle animation

As you all know, the male troll dance is based on Capoeira, which is a real-life martial art/dance hybrid. I think it would be awesome if there was an option to incorporate that into (troll) monks combat animations. Specifically, the "shuffle" dance move (step backwards with one foot, reset, then the other) is Capoeira's equivalent of a "ready" stance, called the Ginga. If you've played Tekken you've seen it used by Eddie and Christie while waiting for a round to start.

I would love it if there was a way for troll monks to use that as their combat idle animation - hopefully it's not too difficult technically seeing as the animation is already in the game. Some ways it could be done:

- Male Troll monks have it as baseline, or can replace the current animation with a minor glyph

- All Troll monks have it as baseline or as a glyph option

- Make a minor glyph available to all characters to replace the standard animation with the Ginga

- Or you could take it all the way and make a minor glyph that replaced all special physical attack animations (blackout kick, rising sun kick, combat idle etc) with moves taken from the troll dance.

Maybe a troll learned the art of the monk from the pandaren, but then, being aware that ancient trolls practiced a similar art that today is only used in dance, combined the moves to make his own style? And he's now teaching it to others?

Would it be an interesting option? Would you use it on your monk?


here I got you this illustrative animated gif of Elena from Street Fighter 3
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Skye1013 » Tue May 29, 2012 7:54 pm

gifs are so hypnotic... or at least ones that are looped so well you don't get that "jerk" between cycles.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Tue May 29, 2012 10:48 pm

Sabindeus wrote:here I got you this illustrative animated gif of Elena from Street Fighter 3


Hey, nice one!

Doesn't look like anybody but me is interested though :(
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby bldavis » Wed May 30, 2012 1:19 am

Paxen wrote:Doesn't look like anybody but me is interested though :(



bldavis wrote:i would like that for any race!
be funny seeing a tauren do that!


:?

i would have posted it, but i avoid the official forums like the plague
Image

Brekkie:Tanks are like shitty DPS. And healers are like REALLY distracted DPS
Amirya:Why yes, your penis is longer than his because you hit 30k dps in the first 10 seconds. But guess what? That raid boss has a dick bigger than your ego.
Flex:I don't make mistakes. I execute carefully planned strategic group wipes.
Levie:(in /g) It's weird, I have a collar and I dont know where I got it from, Worgen are kinky!
Levie:Drunk Lev goes and does what he pleases just to annoy sober Lev.
Sagara:You see, you need to *spread* the bun before you insert the hot dog.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Thu May 31, 2012 10:06 am

bldavis wrote: :?

i would have posted it, but i avoid the official forums like the plague


No worries.

But would you happen to have any ideas for other places to pimp the idea?
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Thu Jun 21, 2012 1:16 am

Had a thought about Power Strikes vs Chi Brew.

The consensus I've seen around the net seems to be that Power Strikes is still better than Chi Brew even after the icd was changed to 20 seconds, as Power Strikes still gives more chi (4/80 sec vs 4/90 sec).

However, as Chi Brew produces 4 chi at t=0 rather than the one chi from the first jab, it takes something like 4-6 minutes before Power Strikes has clearly produced more chi than Chi Brew (Chi Brew is ahead for the first 2 minutes, then they alternate for the next 4). All this given perfect usage on cooldown.

I'm thinking that the on-demand 4 chi should be valuable, as it's easier to have extra Purifying Brews for high damage situations? You can give up some chi that would have been gained from using it on cooldown in exchange for effectively another defensive cooldowns (4 extra PBs, 90 sec cd). And if you want to keep it on cd for maximum chi it gives you extra chi at the start to get Shuffle x2 and Guard up. The benefits of power strikes would be that you never waste the chi (as it creates chi spheres if you overflow, while I guess chi is lost if you use Chi Brew while having chi). I'm not sure how much attention you will have to spare for jabs to make sure that Power Strikes is kept on cooldown.

Looks pretty balanced to me.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Thu Jun 21, 2012 5:52 am

I'll certainly be using an add-on to track the Power Strikes ICD. It's also worth noting that Power Strike's chi generation will almost always be let than the maximum theoretical amount because you won't necessarily always have sufficient energy as the ICD pops, or may have a better button to press at that moment.

My feeling is that because everyone is so focused on feeling resource-starved at the moment, the theoretically higher chi generator is seen to win by default.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Thu Jun 21, 2012 6:41 am

Epimer wrote:My feeling is that because everyone is so focused on feeling resource-starved at the moment, the theoretically higher chi generator is seen to win by default.


My view is that they are so close in practical chi gained that it's far more relevant to look at if you want on-demand chi on a long cooldown or a regular influx of bonus chi. Unless you're talking 6+ minutes of continuous combat (hitting Jab every 20 seconds all the time) Power Strikes doesn't actually produce more chi.
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