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Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Tue May 01, 2012 3:26 pm

Blue post:

  • We've been doing a slight rework of some of the Brewmaster's mechanics. In an upcoming build all attacks done to the Brewmaster will be staggered, and we're adding UI to show you the "level" of your stagger (high, medium or low), so that you can know when you should use Purifying Brew. This design will give you the choice of clearing your stagger stack with Purifying Brew, or continue to push damage into your Stagger stack using Blackout Kick.
  • We're going to attach the Brewmaster to Parry more. Parry will passively cause a counterattack effect causing damage, and using Blackout Kick will now cause your Stagger % (as in, the amount of damage being staggered) and Parry % to increase.
  • We still need to give the Brewmaster better defense against magic. This will either be a passive damage reduction or some rework of an ability.
  • We're going to make defensive cooldowns all "Chi-free", including the talents.
  • We're going to change Spinning Crane Kick to not cost Chi, but Energy/Mana over time.
  • We will do a polish pass on the interrupt (Spear hand strike) and snare (Disable). That said, Disable is a bit superfluous for the Brewmaster because of Dizzying Haze.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby KysenMurrin » Tue May 01, 2012 11:09 pm

I guess that means baseline Stagger (without blackout kick buff) is the Brewmaster's solution to low armor values. Will be interesting to see how the parry thing works out.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Tue May 01, 2012 11:59 pm

Level 86, ungemmed and unenchanted 378 pre-made gear, with a few 384 quest greens. Ten seconds out of every 45:

Image

That's not going to last.

That parry value is 100% uptime, or near enough as to make no difference. The dodge is from a cooldown.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Tue May 08, 2012 3:37 pm

Elusive Brew now increases chances to dodge by 10% for 8 sec instead of 50% for 10 sec.


Now there's a surprise.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Skye1013 » Tue May 08, 2012 3:47 pm

I realize this is the Brewmaster thread, but is there something built into Windwalkers that give them extra chi from jab/expel harm? Because the tooltip definitely says "2 chi" and it's been giving me that (even without the lvl 45 talent that gives extra chi) but the same doesn't hold true for Brewmaster.

Back to being on topic: I'm not sure Guard is working properly atm, as I'm still taking damage with it up. Unless it's just supposed to reduce damage (by 30% or whatever) up to it's shield amount. The tooltip doesn't suggest that, but who knows what they may have done with it. I suppose it could also be a magic/physical damage thing as well.

Also, I've been told there are glyph sellers somewhere in the 85+ area. Is this true for Monks as well? If so, I'm surprised nobody has popped any on the AH for lower level Monks (assuming they're not BoP.)
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby KysenMurrin » Tue May 08, 2012 4:15 pm

Last I checked was a couple builds ago but the vendor in Jade Temple wasn't selling any.

Re: Windwalker, the extra Chi was a passive spell for the spec, but they recently changed it so it's tied to the Tiger stance.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Jaitee » Tue May 08, 2012 5:12 pm

KysenMurrin wrote:Last I checked was a couple builds ago but the vendor in Jade Temple wasn't selling any.

Re: Windwalker, the extra Chi was a passive spell for the spec, but they recently changed it so it's tied to the Tiger stance.


and last i checked the passive extra chi from tiger stance is bugged and you dont actually get it so atm windwalkers are stuck getting half their chi

they moved it there so that brewmasters and mist weavers can get the extra DPS while out doing their dailies and stuff
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Skye1013 » Tue May 08, 2012 5:31 pm

I was getting 2 chi for each of my jabs/expel harms while in WW spec, so it appears to be working as intended. That might not be the case as a BM, but I haven't left Ox stance since I got it, so wouldn't know.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Nooska » Wed May 09, 2012 2:53 am

There is indeed a passive ability for WW that increses chi from jab, its liste do the spec choosing page (or was 2-3 weeks ago at least, when I got the monk I was trying to lvl 10)
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Wed May 09, 2012 1:40 pm

Purifying Brew (the means by which you remove the Stagger stack) has no cooldown, down from 6 seconds, in the current build. It still costs 1 chi. That's a really nice change, but perhaps too strong in very high damage situations since you'll just sit on 4 chi going into a high damage phase and take 50% damage for the next 4 hits then immediately remove the Stagger DoT for each one.

On the down side, I've noticed something odd about Shuffle refresh behaviour which could be a bit annoying if that's how it's supposed to work.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Sun May 13, 2012 5:21 am

A few new changes with the latest build, but nothing major. Purifying Brew has been given a 1s cooldown, but that's purely a quality of life change to prevent you from accidentally wasting chi on a double tap.

Spinning Crane Kick (an AoE move) has been changed to grant 1 chi when used. This is another quality of life change, because with it generating no chi before you would have to choose between Breath of Fire (an AoE DoT) or keeping Shuffle up. Now you don't.

The big change is to the Ox statue. Previously you clicked on it to get Guard, an absorb bubble. Now it puts a bubble on a random party member (but not the Monk himself, although this is currently bugged) every time the Brewmaster does 50% of their health as damage (cumulative, not at once). It's supposedly pretty strong, and probably a bit too good just now. I haven't tested it out yet.

The one big outstanding issue for Brewmasters is now whether the devs intend Shuffle to have 100% uptime or not. At current rates of energy (and thus chi) regeneration, it is possible to keep 100% or near-100% Shuffle uptime - but you won't have any chi left over for offensive or utility abilities, once you take account of Purifying Brew use (to remove the Shuffle stacks).

One of the things that has brought this to the fore is Tiger Palm (single target threat ability, 1 chi) now grants a stacking buff which causes future attacks to ignore armour. Forum posters now seem to feel obliged to keep that buff rolling and hence their resources feel even tighter.

For me, that doesn't seem like a huge deal. If I'm tanking anything that hurts, then I won't take the risk of not having enough chi to keep 100% Shuffle uptime by spending resources on the upkeep of a threat buff. I'll use Tiger Palm when not actively tanking, for the extra DPS when I don't need the mitigation. I like those kinds of choices. It also gives you the opportunity to risk lowering your mitigation for extra DPS on a burn phase or tight enrage timer fight. Choices are good.

Shuffle refresh is still "bugged", as described above. And I think the cleave range on Keg Smash is playing up, since I can hit 3 target dummies in a near-180 degree arc with it now, which I'm certain didn't happen before (and have the logs to prove it from when I was testing Shuffle refresh).

EDIT: I missed out another biggie. Expel Harm (self heal, generates 1 chi and does more damage than your other 1 chi generator) has no cooldown when you're at 35% health or below. This needs to have an internal cooldown or you have basically unlimited chi and strong self-healing at low health. It might do already, I haven't checked, but there isn't one indicated in the tooltip.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Sun May 13, 2012 10:33 am

I did some testing on the free Expel Harm thing.

If it's on cooldown when you dip below 35% health, it won't become instantly available, so in that sense it's worse than the current Blood Tap on live. But it is spammable until you surpass 35% health again. Calling it now: some sort of ICD on the effect is inevitable, since it does good damage and the heal scales with Vengeance.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Skye1013 » Sun May 13, 2012 6:46 pm

Depending on how well the heal scales (and whether your healers are asleep) would ultimately determine how many you could actually chain though. I could see it being OP for Chimaeron type fights where you only have to keep yourself above that certain threshold (unless of course you're eating doublestrikes.)
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Epimer » Mon May 14, 2012 5:01 am

Forget the bit about increased chi generation, I was being dumb. It's just more damage per energy and relatively strong self-healing, and since the cooldown doesn't reset on dipping below the health threshold, it's not a huge deal.
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Re: Brewmaster info and impressions, esp. Pandaren

Postby Paxen » Tue May 15, 2012 2:25 pm

Epimer, could you give a breakdown on how the Brewmaster works at the moment? I've been reading up on it today, but it seems the mechanics have changed weekly or so for a bit now so I'm confused :)

First, is http://www.wowpedia.org/Monk_abilities updated? (Always Stagger, taking 70% damage and putting 30% in the Stagger stack, Shuffle gives +30% Parry and +20% Stagger, Fortifying Brew gives another +20% Stagger)

What's the priority on Chi generators, and how often are they used? Keg Smash > Expel Harm > Jab? Is the energy regen rate for Brewmasters equal to basic Rogue (10 energy per second) or 30% quicker than that? If it's 10 energy/second it seems to me like you could have fire off a Chi generator every four seconds (Keg, Expel, Keg, Jab, repeat, at least a bit into the fight). Is it beneficial to pool energy or is it more important to keep Keg and Expel on cooldown?

What's the main use for chi, Blackout Kick for Shuffle? Can you keep 100% Shuffle while still hitting Guard on cooldown and getting in enough Purifying Brew? Guard lasts 30 seconds with a 30 second cooldown, but I take it it expires when it has absorbed its limit? Do you hit Guard on cooldown or save it for when it's necessary? Is Tiger Palm worth using for the extra % on Guard, or has that been removed from the beta?

Phew, that's a lot of questions :) I'm not asking you to answer them all, just, whatever you feel like. The Brewmaster looks interesting and it's difficult to figure stuff out when I'm not in the beta.
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