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Pandaclysm and the other classes

Mists of Pandaria Beta discussion

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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Worldie » Mon May 07, 2012 3:14 pm

Consider that by taking DI we lose the istant damage by reapplying swp.

Ofc it's not final and blabla, I suppose we'll have to leave to the math nerds to figure out the numbers
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Fortius » Mon May 07, 2012 4:11 pm

Has there been any word on if they're changing the way dots refresh? If it's still as it is now couldn't refreshing via mf also mess up a higher damage dot cast with buffs up? The extra gcds over the fight would probably outweigh that and the quality of life improvement would be nice, but it will be interesting to see if more ticks from harder-hitting dots + well-timed PI (+ the no instant damage Worldie mentioned) pulls ahead in terms of raw dps. Someone else can do the math though.

Twist of Fate could be an interesting choice on add fights depending on internal cooldown.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Skye1013 » Mon May 07, 2012 4:19 pm

With how MF currently refreshes SW:P, it just makes it so you don't worry about what buffs are up, as it's constantly getting reset. I'd imagine taking DI would just continue that. And I haven't seen anything suggesting dots are changing (but then again, I haven't really looked either.)

@Worldie: I didn't realize it had the instant proc, might make me think more about PI (what's the other one in that tier again?)

Another plus to PI is that if needed, we could cast it on someone else (unless they changed that, I'll admit, I didn't read much past the name, assuming it hadn't changed.) Might be useful during a heavy damage phase if a healer needs the extra bump.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Fortius » Tue May 08, 2012 12:52 am

That's what I was getting at - now everyone takes the talent that makes mf refresh pain because there's nothing better and the saved gcds is beneficial. Without DI pain just becomes the new devouring plague - casting when all your procs, etc are going can massively increase the damage it does, even well past the length of the buffs. Throwing PI on top of that seems like it would make it an even stronger choice.

The other option is a 15% heal/damage buff when you damage/heal something below 20%, which will probably range widely depending on encounter design and how it's implemented (icd, etc).
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Worldie » Tue May 08, 2012 8:20 am

I think there's gonna be a lot of theorycrafting about that line of talents.

As a personal thought, I think min/maxers will go for PI (remember as SP you can basically double its duration) while more "casual" players will take DI. Eventually people may spec for the execute thingie if there's Vael-like encounters in T14+
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Skye1013 » Tue May 08, 2012 3:39 pm

A lot is going to depend on the numbers of the instant proc. If anything, it could math out to be neutral unless you have a burn/damage buff phase (spine/hagara.)

The instant proc could just be there to help with multi-dotting, to make up for the lost "dots" from not always being able to rotate your MF between targets. Then again, it could be like imp. DP where if we had the mana regen (and didn't have other priorities ahead of it) we could just spam it for equivalent/better dps than our normal priority queue.

Anyone know if shadowpriest.com is still good, and if not, are there other spriest theorycrafting sites out there that do the math? Obviously, it's still a bit early to do so for MoP, but figured I may as well attempt to track that down now.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Worldie » Tue May 08, 2012 3:45 pm

sp.com has been failing me since a bit and EJ is so and so. I usually grab my math from a few math geek friends.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby rodos » Tue May 08, 2012 5:22 pm

Worldie wrote:As a personal thought, I think min/maxers will go for PI (remember as SP you can basically double its duration) while more "casual" players will take DI. Eventually people may spec for the execute thingie if there's Vael-like encounters in T14+

I think you're right, and I think Blizzard will tune it deliberately to make that the correct choice. The "active" option will give the bigger benefit for those with the skill to use it to its maximum potential, whereas the (more) passive option will give a solid base-line for more casual players, "fun" alts, and those new to the class.

For encounter-specific talents, do we have an indication yet of how easy and/or how expensive it will be to switch out single talents between fights?
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Skye1013 » Tue May 08, 2012 5:28 pm

Right now it requires a Tome of something or other. It's the same cost as Dust of Disappearance atm.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Worldie » Tue May 08, 2012 11:47 pm

Screw what I said, Divine Insight reworked once more
Periodic damage from your Mind Flay increases the damage of your next Mind Blast by 10%, stacking up to 10 times.


More headache for number crunches and less choice, I liked the previous version of those talents more.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby halabar » Wed May 09, 2012 8:06 am

Love the new hunter changes...

Fetch + AOE looting? no need for Looterang taking up a bag slot

Woot for boars and rhinos being viable pets again - they get the 4% damage buff to replace the bleed effects
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Worldie » Thu May 10, 2012 4:11 am

It seembs like they have no idea of where they want to go with shadow priests right now.

Every 2 days they rework half of the procs.

Recent changes:
Shadow Word: Death now grants a Shadow Orb if the target is below 20% health.

Divine Insight shadow effect modified - Periodic damage from your Shadow Word: Pain has a 15% chance to reset the cooldown on Mind Blast and cause your next Mind Blast within 12 sec to be instant cast.
From Darkness, Comes Light Surge of Darkness has been reworked - Periodic damage from your Vampiric Touch has a 15% chance to cause your next Mind Spike to not consume your damage-over-time effects.

Mind Surge (NNF) has been reworked - Reduces the cooldown of your Mind Blast based on your Haste.


I can see why they don't like having SoD trigger the "SWD as if <20%" effect since that effect would be useless once the target is actually below 20% hp, but still. They keep reworking everything every beta patch :S
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby Sagara » Thu May 10, 2012 4:16 am

Well, we also got a few back-to-back profound changes to our own gameplay, so I wouldn't be surprised it's now the priest's turn on the chopping block (see also the Spirit Shell shenanigans).

Still, let's hope they settle on things soon enough - there's still the numbers pass to do.
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby halabar » Thu May 10, 2012 8:10 am

Hmm...

While they are making good changes with hunter abilities, pets? not so much.

Sofar, the only new pet is the crane. Ermm.. might be a good pet for a BE, NE, or female space-goat, but doesn't much go well with the other races.

Otherwise we get 5 or so new tiger skins, and some new turtle skins. (NO, the procupines and silkworms are NOT supposed to be tameable, so those should be going away).

I think all the pet resources went to developing pokewow..

/grumble
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Re: Pandaclysm and the other classes

Postby theckhd » Thu May 10, 2012 8:11 am

halabar wrote:(NO, the procupines and silkworms are NOT supposed to be tameable, so those should be going away).

I wonder why. Porcupines, at least, seem like they'd be reasonable attack pets. No weirder than boars or ravagers. I guess it would be a little odd to see a silkworm charging in to attack a boss though.
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