Remove Advertisements

Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Invisusira's playground

Moderators: Aergis, Invisusira

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Fridmarr » Sat Apr 14, 2012 11:22 pm

I read the book, but haven't seen the movie yet. My wife did both, but told me if she hadn't read the book she would not have liked the movie at all.

To me your comments are very interesting, because they are mostly about things that are kind of...ancillary (at best) in the book, yet undoubtedly prominent for the story telling in a movie constrained to 2 hours. The perspective of the book is very centered on Katniss, if she wasn't specifically around you simply don't know much about it, so it's interesting to hear your take on how some of these events were acted out.

Brekkie wrote:-I don't know why everyone is complaining about shakey-cam. It wasn't really noticeable for me. The ONE scene where it really happened was the initial bloodbath when they are released into the arena, and even then I don't think I really would have been struck by it if I wasn't bracing myself to look for it based on all the negative comments I'd heard.
Obviously, there's no shaky camera in the book, but since Katniss isn't really involved in the blood bath (for long), you don't get much of an idea about what happens. The moments leading up to it, as Katniss is waiting on her platform has quite a bit of detail as you might imagine.

-I would have liked if they had interspersed more views of what the actual TV show was seeing. Some of the best scenes in the movie were when you saw audience reaction, like when Katniss Peace-Out's the camera and all the District 11 guys (including Rue's Dad, a nice touch) Peace-Out the screen back, or when Katniss and Peeta are having a "moment" in the cave, and it cuts to the control room and the big strong manly dude's facial expression is like DAWWWWWW. Those were the most interesting reactions for me, and I wish there was more of them. It sometimes was easy to forget that the entire thing was being broadcast because it was just endless scenes of kids running around in the woods.
While at times Katniss ponders what viewers might be seeing and how they might be reacting, you really don't know for sure. I figured the movie could really make hay with this aspect. I suspect given your account, I'll end up feeling the same way you do.

-On a related note, I liked the themes emphasized by the rating of the Tributes and constantly changing betting-stakes on their success. And absolutely NOTHING was done with this in the movie. After all that set-up, of the training and the evaluations and how important the sponsors were and giving them ratings and earrings-black-dude talking about how he wished he could bet on katniss, they never once brought that back once the games began. I wanted to see Angry Gamblers when kids died, and odds bouncing up and down, and talking heads behind sports desks doing Madden-style strategic analysis. So much that could have done with this, and it was just wasted.
Again, the book is focused on Katniss and her "audition", it does talk about the importance of sponsors and how the ratings really help with that (though you never hear of any direct interaction with one)and of course you ultimately see the effect of the sponsors, the betting is barely mentioned in the book. You know that it exists, but not much more than that.

-To be quite honest, I hope the book's story was written a lot better than the movie, because what this story reminded me of the most was Twilight. And that is not a flattering comparison. You can always tell when it's a woman author writing for teenyboppers because you have these passive-ass, indecisive female characters that all these hawt men inexplicably love, but which they NEVER DECIDE BETWEEN because they are a freaking child and like the attention. I had such hopes for Katniss in the beginning as a strong, likeable female character, and then she bought into the stupid love narrative with Peeta.
HAHA! There's certainly plenty of that. The Peeta thing is quite complex though. The movie may not get into it, but she's not really giving into the Peeta angle. She's doing those things for a very specific purpose, and it's not romance.

I will tell you that as I read the third book, I realized that I didn't care much for Katniss (see Fivelives' post above), and after re-analyzing some of the events of the previous books I realized that she was not the strong heroine that I projected her to be. While that sounds like a complaint, it's really just the opposite, I think it was to the author's credit that she was able to invoke those emotions. It added quite a bit more depth to it overall, certainly more than what I know of twilight (though my knowledge of twilight is, aside from the movies released so far, second hand).

I did attempt to read the first book of the Twilight series, but I just couldn't get into it at all because Bella annoyed the shit out of me. To be fair to Twilight though, from what I know of the books, Bella was actually never undecided it was always Edward, and given how that ends it would be pretty freaking creepy if she had ever really much more than familial love for Jacob.
Fridmarr
Global Mod
 
Posts: 9665
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:03 am

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Brekkie » Sat Apr 14, 2012 11:46 pm

It wasn't really clear to me at the beginning that there could only be one winner. The fact that they pick one boy and one girl from each district seemed to imply it would be team-based, or at least that the two members of each district would be allied, and the game could be won as a pair.
So when Katniss volunteered, I was expecting Gale to volunteer too, and was very surprised when he did not. Then I learned about the one-victor rule, and kind of went "oh...I see. That explains why the boy from district 12 is a character that we are set up to dislike from the start." But then they play the whole love-narrative and do a switcheroo on the rules and say there could be TWO victors again, which just made me go back to thinking Gale should have volunteered, rather than be sympathetic with Peeta. And throughout the ensuing climax they keep cutting back to Gale ruefully watching the "love" scenes and you in the audience sit there wondering why they even bothered introducing his character at all.

They also go through all this effort in the start to develop how strong Peeta is (because he lifts lots of heavy....bread?), foreshadowing very heavy-handedly that his strength is eventually going to come in useful. And then it never does.
Additionally, I thought him being this master camouflage artist who can paint perfect tree bark on his skin "because he used to do the icing on cakes" was somewhat of a stretch. Fortunately for suspension of disbelief, despite heavy foreshadowing, that never came in useful either.

I expected more Tributes to form alliances with each other. It's such an obvious strategy, and control of the massive mound of supplies and weapons sitting there at the starting point constituted such a huge potential advantage it seemed very strange to me that no one except the jerks from District 1 and 2 banded together. Also, I can't count the number of times I wanted to scream "GO RETRIEVE YOUR ARROW, DONT JUST LEAVE IT THERE! YOU ONLY HAVE SO MANY OF THEM!" at the screen.

There was something else I wanted to say, but I can't remember. :(
Edit: OH RIGHT! I thought that calling it "The Reaping!" was a little bit melodramatic. They take two kids, out of the entire district, once a year. The "Plucking" perhaps, but the "REAPING"? They are hardly decimating the population. Yeah, it sucks to have that possibility looming over you, but come on! It's a lottery. You know what the odds of winning a lottery are?

HAHA! There's certainly plenty of that. The Peeta thing is quite complex though. The movie may not get into it, but she's not really giving into the Peeta angle. She's doing those things for a very specific purpose, and it's not romance.

In the movie it isn't really made clear whether she is really falling for him, or whether it's all an act. Except for one vague line in the train going home where Peeta asks what happens now and she says "try to forget everything", but it isn't clear whether that is referring to their "relationship", or, you know, all the DEATH AND VIOLENCE they just survived.

Nor did I feel that the movie really provided any real strategic justification for her to fake it. She didn't once gain any material advantage out of the relationship, other than alliance with Peeta, which would have happened regardless because they both want to live. They only show her getting two gifts from sponsors in the movie, one early on that was totally unrelated to her love-story angle, and the second one which contained medicine for Peeta and nothing whatsoever for her, which she nearly died to acquire. So as an audience member I was left thinking that she was doing the relationship thing for its own sake.
Theckhd wrote:big numbers are the in-game way of expressing that Brekkie's penis is huge.
Brekkie
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:44 pm

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Fridmarr » Sun Apr 15, 2012 9:04 am

SPOILER ALERT FOR THE FIRST BOOK























Wow they left some important stuff out...

In the book, Katniss was rewarded by the sponsors for cozying up to Peeta, it's how she got some broth and the stuff to put him to sleep so she could go get the real medicine.

I suppose you could argue that there was no benefit for her to ally with Peeta given his condition.

Peeta's camouflage ability was used after he was injured, he had covered himself with mud so they couldn't find him. Katniss practically stepped on him before he said something. How did Katniss find him in the movie? I don't think there was an association between his craft and his strength, he just happened to be naturally strong, but also he wasn't constantly on the verge of starvation like many in his district which helped too.

I think that forming alliances would be pretty difficult given how high the stakes are. Every alliance eventually has to break down anyhow.

The reaping...well it's not a simple lottery in the book. As you get older you get more tickets put in, adding to the stress. On top of that, at some point each year you can opt for extra rations if you put in more tickets, and then those get multiplied over the years. Gale and Katniss each opted for more rations, but wouldn't let their siblings do the same, so they ended up with quite a few tickets (Gale had like 64 or something). In the book you got the sense that the population (at least for district 12) was small enough that either you, or someone you know rather well was probably going to be picked. I think the burden would really suck, not to mention the symbolic meaning of the games in the first place. Yes the word "reaping" is an overstatement.

EDIT: You probably should consider reading the book if you think you might be interested. As is typical movies just can't adequately cover everything, and the books themselves are pretty quick reading. Plus if you enjoy the first book, there are two more that the movie didn't touch.
Fridmarr
Global Mod
 
Posts: 9665
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:03 am

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Fivelives » Sun Apr 15, 2012 9:52 am

Fridmarr wrote:I realized that I didn't care much for Katniss (see Fivelives' post above)


Huhwha?

Fivelives wrote:Excellent trilogy. I just devoured the whole thing today - Amazon had an awesome deal on the boxed set of all 3 in hardcover.


That's all I wrote, yo!
- I'm not Jesus, but I can turn water into Kool-Aid.
- A Sergeant in motion outranks an officer who doesn't know what the hell is going on.
- A demolitions specialist at a flat run outranks everybody.
User avatar
Fivelives
 
Posts: 3106
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:55 pm

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Brekkie » Sun Apr 15, 2012 11:07 am

I probably will end up reading the book. I tend to like anything dystopian.

SPOILERZ


In the book, Katniss was rewarded by the sponsors for cozying up to Peeta, it's how she got some broth and the stuff to put him to sleep so she could go get the real medicine.

Oh right, this happens in the movie, but I forgot about it. She feeds all the broth to Peeta anyway, so I kind of dismissed it as not being helpful to her at all. Now that you reminded me though, I do remember that it comes with a little note saying "You call that a kiss?"

Peeta's camouflage ability was used after he was injured, he had covered himself with mud so they couldn't find him. Katniss practically stepped on him before he said something. How did Katniss find him in the movie? I don't think there was an association between his craft and his strength, he just happened to be naturally strong, but also he wasn't constantly on the verge of starvation like many in his district which helped too.

Well, in the movie he does hide covered in some leaves and mud on his face, but to me that didn't feel like he did anything especially skilled, nor that he was in particular danger anyway. When she decides to find him, there's like 4 solid minutes of her following his trail way out into the middle of nowhere away from where every other Tribute presumably was, so it didn't feel like he really saved himself from anything in particular.

For me it just keeps going back to the fact that Peeta never really contributes to Katniss's survival. First he get's captured and then leads the 1+2 jerks right to her (because... how does he know where she is? Do they have some kind of shared strategy that their mentor gave them? Not entirely clear in the movie.) Then when she drops the wasps nest on 1+2 jerks, he runs up to her and is all like "YOU HAVE TO RUN!", but then abandons her when she starts to hullucinate, and it is Rue who actually pulls her out of there and protects her while Peeta... runs off?
Really the only people who help her are Rue, and the boy from Rue's district who saves her from being killed by throwing-knife-girl (when she taking an unnecessary risk in order to get Peeta's medicine), and then let's her go without killing her too, for Rue's sake.

The reaping...well it's not a simple lottery in the book. As you get older you get more tickets put in, adding to the stress. On top of that, at some point each year you can opt for extra rations if you put in more tickets, and then those get multiplied over the years. Gale and Katniss each opted for more rations, but wouldn't let their siblings do the same, so they ended up with quite a few tickets (Gale had like 64 or something). In the book you got the sense that the population (at least for district 12) was small enough that either you, or someone you know rather well was probably going to be picked. I think the burden would really suck, not to mention the symbolic meaning of the games in the first place. Yes the word "reaping" is an overstatement.


Ah, I see, I see. Again, not really explained in the movie. They all just line up and get their blood scanned and press a blood drop on a single ticket each and then lots-of-makeup-lady drew one out of a jar.
Theckhd wrote:big numbers are the in-game way of expressing that Brekkie's penis is huge.
Brekkie
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:44 pm

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Aubade » Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:45 pm

There are quite a lot of little details in the book that would compliment a lot of the movie explaining the whole situation. I think one of them is Katniss' Narrative on Gale and Peeta. Throughout the whole thing she never really falls in love for either of them. She's unsure about both. So it's not that she loves gale, but pretends to love Peeta for the show, She just plain doesn't love either of them. Although I think she really does love gale, it's never mentioned.

Also; The 1 & 2 Alliance (which is more than just districts 1 and 2.) Is really important because it's all the careers. You have to think about it in the position of a tribute that ISN'T a career, you're a guy/girl from some poor district (Careers = Rich districts.) and you have no real "training" Outside of the 2 weeks they give you before the games start. You can try to make the careers percieve you as weak and not worth your time until later, or form an alliance with another tribute that will threaten the career's alliance, causing them to hunt you down earlier. There's also the fact that you KNOW there can only be 1 winner, so what's the point in making an alliance with someone who you can't trust not to slit your throat in the middle of the night while they're on watch?
Image
- Awbade Level 85 Human Paladin - <Tsunami> Frostmourne - Retired.
Deliriously wrote:I prefer the, "Lonely Hand Approach" (trademark pending)
User avatar
Aubade
Moderator
 
Posts: 4877
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 12:51 am
Location: Tacoma, WA

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Fridmarr » Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:48 pm

Fivelives wrote:
Fridmarr wrote:I realized that I didn't care much for Katniss (see Fivelives' post above)


Huhwha?

Fivelives wrote:Excellent trilogy. I just devoured the whole thing today - Amazon had an awesome deal on the boxed set of all 3 in hardcover.


That's all I wrote, yo!

Lol, totally attributed that to the wrong person. I meant thegreatheed.
Fridmarr
Global Mod
 
Posts: 9665
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:03 am

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Aubade » Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:50 pm

Brekkie wrote:For me it just keeps going back to the fact that Peeta never really contributes to Katniss's survival. First he get's captured and then leads the 1+2 jerks right to her (because... how does he know where she is? Do they have some kind of shared strategy that their mentor gave them? Not entirely clear in the movie.) Then when she drops the wasps nest on 1+2 jerks, he runs up to her and is all like "YOU HAVE TO RUN!", but then abandons her when she starts to hullucinate, and it is Rue who actually pulls her out of there and protects her while Peeta... runs off?


Peeta does a lot more for Katniss behind the scenes while he's in the alliance. Since Katniss got a score of 11, The Careers see her as the biggest threat, so the ENTIRE time they're in the games, she is a high high priority to them. Peeta joined them under the knowledge that "he would help them find her" While actually steering them AWAY from her. (Except for the 1-2 times that he was wrong, and they actually DID find her.) Also; the scene where Peeta tells Katniss to GTFO, in the books, Cato was RIGHT there. And that's when Cato Slashes Peeta's leg.

And Rue doesn't help her out of the hallucinations in the book, katniss does that all on her own, and then Rue eventually tells her about the leaves.

I guess the only thing about the games themselves that TRULY dissapointed me is that they didn't show the...Severity of the water/food situation. In the books, they go DAYS without food/water and are constantly talking/looking for it, but in the movie it's just. (oh, I'm hungry, lets get some food.) and it didn't feel as....Desperate.

EDIT: And yes, they do have a shared Strategy, Peeta knows that Haymitch told Katniss to not fight at the cornucopia, and just run for the forest and find water. (Which in the books takes her 3 days and she almost dies of dehydration.
Image
- Awbade Level 85 Human Paladin - <Tsunami> Frostmourne - Retired.
Deliriously wrote:I prefer the, "Lonely Hand Approach" (trademark pending)
User avatar
Aubade
Moderator
 
Posts: 4877
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 12:51 am
Location: Tacoma, WA

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Fridmarr » Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:57 pm

Yeah, during the GTFO moment Peeta pretty much saves her, and that's how he gets injured. His camo probably doesn't protect him because if I remember right, Cato believes he's essentially going to die from his wound anyhow, so it's not worth tracking him.

Brekkie, the thing with the blood on the ticket just simply didn't happen in the book, and to me that's an odd liberty to take in the movie because it totally forces you to think it's a 1 person 1 ticket affair. Which means you miss out on the chilling notion that the Capital is more than happy to give you more food, if you are willing to increase your odds of participating in the games. Just another twisted way to exert control.
Fridmarr
Global Mod
 
Posts: 9665
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 1:03 am

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Brekkie » Sun Apr 15, 2012 5:21 pm

I guess the only thing about the games themselves that TRULY dissapointed me is that they didn't show the...Severity of the water/food situation. In the books, they go DAYS without food/water and are constantly talking/looking for it, but in the movie it's just. (oh, I'm hungry, lets get some food.) and it didn't feel as....Desperate.


Lol yeah, she kills like, 30 squirrels like its not even a big deal. Oh, you hungry? Lemme just shoot another squirrel real quick!

Brekkie, the thing with the blood on the ticket just simply didn't happen in the book, and to me that's an odd liberty to take in the movie because it totally forces you to think it's a 1 person 1 ticket affair. Which means you miss out on the chilling notion that the Capital is more than happy to give you more food, if you are willing to increase your odds of participating in the games. Just another twisted way to exert control.


Yeah that's a really clever dynamic about being able to trade increased food for worse odds.
Theckhd wrote:big numbers are the in-game way of expressing that Brekkie's penis is huge.
Brekkie
 
Posts: 953
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2010 7:44 pm

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Mannstein » Mon Apr 16, 2012 9:37 am

Fridmarr wrote:Peeta's camouflage ability was used after he was injured, he had covered himself with mud so they couldn't find him. Katniss practically stepped on him before he said something. How did Katniss find him in the movie? I don't think there was an association between his craft and his strength, he just happened to be naturally strong, but also he wasn't constantly on the verge of starvation like many in his district which helped too.


Brekkie wrote:
For me it just keeps going back to the fact that Peeta never really contributes to Katniss's survival. First he get's captured and then leads the 1+2 jerks right to her (because... how does he know where she is? Do they have some kind of shared strategy that their mentor gave them? Not entirely clear in the movie.) Then when she drops the wasps nest on 1+2 jerks, he runs up to her and is all like "YOU HAVE TO RUN!", but then abandons her when she starts to hullucinate, and it is Rue who actually pulls her out of there and protects her while Peeta... runs off?(...)

(SPOILER BOOK 1)
As far as i remember (in the book) Petta help her several times:
During his interview he confess her love, and get's her(both) lots of supporters;
He goes into the starting melle, because she ignores the warning of the trainer.(for the non-carrers going into the melle is suicide);
He joins the carrers and i think he makes them go around looking for her (here she overhears the careers discuss that Petta is good with the knife);
After the wasp, he's the first to reach her when she cannot shot, and tells her to go away, when she starts to flee, he faces CATO who's going to catch her and defends her (gets stabb by Cato);

Fridmarr wrote:The reaping...well it's not a simple lottery in the book. (...) In the book you got the sense that the population (at least for district 12) was small enough that either you, or someone you know rather well was probably going to be picked. I think the burden would really suck, not to mention the symbolic meaning of the games in the first place. Yes the word "reaping" is an overstatement.

Brekkie wrote:
Ah, I see, I see. Again, not really explained in the movie. They all just line up and get their blood scanned and press a blood drop on a single ticket each and then lots-of-makeup-lady drew one out of a jar.

I believe that District 12 is something like a very small city/village. i remember 7000 persons? Can be wrong...
Fridmarr wrote:I realized that I didn't care much for Katniss

True, me also... TBH in the frist book Katniss isn't a much of a "true hero".
Gale is as a rebel, a freedom fighter. He always says to get out of the district. And is against the Capitol. She never quites support/agree with him.
Petta before the games, states something like: "If i die i want to die in a fashion that show that i'm against the games and the capitol".

About love between them, at the end of the games in the book they say the rule was changed again and only 1can win.
Petta and Katniss reach for the weapons, he throws his into the lake, she points her's to his heart. I think that showed the reader how deap where her feelings :D

P.S. In the end of the book, she confess what she did was due to being in the games.
An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded.
Mannstein
 
Posts: 384
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 5:40 am

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Shoju » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:12 am

SPOILER MAYBE!






















Ok. So I read the first book, and part of the second at the behest of my son. He wants me to take him and his GF to see the movie.

someone. anyone. Answer this question:

Did they include the Mutant Zombie Werewolves in the movie? Because so help me god if they did I'm going to vomit.














































End spoiler.
User avatar
Shoju
 
Posts: 6349
Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 7:15 am

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Nikachelle » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:16 am

Mutant zombie... werewolves? They've got the genetically engineered dogs in the movie if that's what you mean. Although it's pretty brief.
User avatar
Nikachelle
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 11000
Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2009 10:39 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Arnock » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:42 am

SPOILERZ!!!!!!!!!11!!1eleven








As for "mutant zombie werewolves" in the book, the dogs that attack Peeta, Katniss, and Cato at the end were capable of walking on their hind legs, and were either made to closely resemble the deceased tributes (similar size, stature, hair colour/texture, eye color, etc.) or were somehow reanimated and modified bodies of the deceased tributes, it's not explained fully. In the movie, the dogs appear to be just very large bulldogs, or something along those lines.


At any rate, I finished reading book 1 last night, and I'm about halfway through book two, and I can see why the movie was somewhat confusing to me at first. In the book, there isn't a whole lot of dialogue, and most of the backstory/explanations are given through katniss's internal monologues, I think that the movie might have been better if they had simply let katniss narrate the story.

In the opening chapters of the first book, Kat explicitly states that there's nothing romantic going on between her and Gale, they have more of a close brother/sister relationship. Both of their fathers died in the same mine accident, and they hunt together to provide for their respective families.


As for Peeta, the movie does a terrible job of explaining the history between Kat and Peeta. In the book, when Peeta throws kat the burned bread, it is very soon after kat's father died in a mine accident, and she and her family were close to starving to death. That act of kindess sort of, 'inspired,' her to get off her ass and go out into the woods and start gathering food.

After the reaping, Katniss actively tries to distance herself from Peeta so it doesn't hurt as bad when she might eventually have to kill him, and after the rule change allowing the tributes to team up, she is only acting as if she's in love to try to get sponsors to send them more gifts, though towards the end, she does start to have real feelings toward him.


SPOILERZ FOR BOOK 2


It's only after they return to district 12 that Katniss realizes that she actually had feelings for Gale, and she doesn't feel the same way about Peeta.



[/spoilers]
Image
Courage not of this earth in your eyes
Faith from far beyond lies deep inside
User avatar
Arnock
 
Posts: 3657
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2008 6:36 pm
Location: Everywhere and nowhere

Re: Mockingjay (third book in Hunger Games)

Postby Shoju » Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:29 pm

Arnock's post covers it. That point in the book just ruined it for me. I became completely uninterested in it. I only finished because I was so close to the end, and after a week of not reading it, it was bugging me that I didn't finish.

My son begged me to keep reading book 2, saying it would get better, and the "reaping rules" for the next hunger games just ruined it for me. I stopped reading, and have had 0 desire to pick it back up.

It's a shame, because for a teenage / young adult storyline, it had some things going for it. It wasn't as terrible as Twilight (I read all of those to appease my wife before it was a cultural hit, and she had no one to talk to about it), but that one point in the book killed my interest in the book. And since there are plenty of people for my son to discuss the book with, I'm absolved of having to finish.
User avatar
Shoju
 
Posts: 6349
Joined: Mon May 19, 2008 7:15 am

PreviousNext

Return to Arkham Asylum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: beornus and 1 guest


Remove Advertisements

Who is online

In total there are 2 users online :: 1 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 380 on Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:28 pm

Users browsing this forum: beornus and 1 guest