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Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Warning: Theorycraft inside.

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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Rhiannon » Thu Aug 25, 2011 10:02 am

What to make of this?

Image

Back to Baleroc, and this time wearing 107.95%

Looking at the inferno strike hits I took, two were seemingly unblocked:

[20:53:45.315] Baleroc Inferno Strike Rhia 75664 (A: 41410, R: 111499)
[20:56:07.837] Baleroc Inferno Strike Rhia 150042 (A: 396896, R: 189909)

For comparison, an absorbed/blocked/resisted hit would look like:

[20:57:48.988] Baleroc Inferno Strike Rhia 492022 (A: 59574, B: 574111, R: 138976)

Battle Shout showing as 100% uptime. Log is here.

So, combat log bug or something else?
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Jaitee » Thu Aug 25, 2011 3:56 pm

theckhd wrote:
Schroom wrote:at least in theory the cap for infernostrikes should be at 106.8 not 107.4. the ignored miss is 4.4

Except, as we've been discussing, there seems to be a phantom 1% hit on Baleroc, possibly due to the way they coded his dual-wielding. That would push it up to 107.8%.


i thought inferno stike couldn't miss so wouldnt his bonus hit chance not affect inferno strike?

so wouldnt it be 100% block+dodge+parry after the level reduction stuff which is 101.8 on your character sheet if your running that ctc macro that shows 5% miss rate you would need 106.8 from it
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Schroom » Thu Aug 25, 2011 11:47 pm

@ Jaitee. In theory, as I said, yes. Although as discussed in this thread there seems to be sth wrong with this encounter.
and as Rhiannons very interesting post shows he gets hit by inferno, even with 107,95.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby theckhd » Sat Aug 27, 2011 9:15 am

Credit to Mel for pointing this out: The combat table values are probably stored as unsigned values. That would mean that the ignored miss is really 5%, not 4.4%, and that pushes it up to 102.4+1+5=108.4%. He says he's never observed a hit in his ~109% set, nor have I in my 108.5%-ish set (though to be fair, I haven't looked that closely because I wasn't expecting any, I'll try and go over some old logs to check today).
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Codegen » Sun Aug 28, 2011 5:11 pm

According to this log from yesterday's raid http://tinyurl.com/3mt3hyo our Inferno Blade tank got 2 unblocked hits (kill try) with 108,56% ctc.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby theckhd » Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:19 am

First unblocked hit:
Code: Select all
[23:39:19.645] Baleroc Inferno Strike Taveth 207247 (R: 153516)
[23:39:19.863] Super Riptide Taveth +3821
[23:39:19.926] Super Earth Shield Taveth +5812
[23:39:19.926] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +300
[23:39:19.926] Tallo Greater Healing Wave Taveth +46989
[23:39:19.926] Tallo Riptide Taveth +11019
[23:39:20.051] Pibrox Healing Touch Taveth +*56336*
[23:39:20.051] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +*4739*
[23:39:20.317] Super Earthliving Taveth +2375
[23:39:20.348] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +79
[23:39:20.348] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +70
[23:39:20.598] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +2369
[23:39:20.723] Tallo Earthliving Taveth +2200
[23:39:20.723] Tallo Riptide Taveth +*5615*
[23:39:21.270] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +2369
[23:39:21.676] Super Greater Healing Wave Taveth +39978
[23:39:21.879] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +2369
[23:39:21.879] Super Riptide Taveth +2698
[23:39:21.957] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +144
[23:39:21.957] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +80
[23:39:21.957] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +70
[23:39:22.020] Baleroc Inferno Strike Taveth 107617 (B: 48350, R: 216622)
[23:39:22.020] Pibrox Healing Touch Taveth +29567
[23:39:22.332] Super Earthliving Taveth +*4818*
[23:39:22.551] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +2369
[23:39:22.660] Tallo Earthliving Taveth +2223
[23:39:22.660] Tallo Riptide Taveth +2838
[23:39:22.895] Super Greater Healing Wave Taveth +39675
[23:39:23.098] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +2369
[23:39:23.223] Tallo Greater Healing Wave Taveth +*45436* (O: 23955)
[23:39:23.645] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +0 (O: 144)


Damage taken between overheals: 314864
Healing between overheals: 318727
Discrepancy: -3863

For some reason, there's a 3k discrepancy in the log that I can't sort out, but that's too small to account for a block on the first hit.

Second one:
Code: Select all
[23:41:39.613] Codegen Holy Radiance Taveth +0 (O: 750)
[23:41:39.988] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +0 (O: 131)
[23:41:39.988] Baleroc Inferno Strike Taveth 318612 (A: 24113, R: 571210)
[23:41:40.003] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +*3159*
[23:41:40.425] Wujekeldi Holy Light Taveth +95675
[23:41:40.503] Codegen Holy Radiance Taveth +667
[23:41:40.847] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +128
[23:41:40.847] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +165
[23:41:40.847] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +131
[23:41:41.019] Pibrox Lifebloom Taveth +1579
[23:41:41.238] Wujekeldi Word of Glory Taveth +211188
[23:41:41.597] Wujekeldi Beacon of Light Taveth +5920 (O: 12317)
[23:41:41.628] Atropa Vampiric Embrace Taveth +0 (O: 80)
[23:41:41.628] Codegen Holy Radiance Taveth +0 (O: 750)


No discrepancy here, 318612 damage and healing between overheals.

Looks like both of these are legitimate, no buffs appear to have fallen off during the fight (though as a result, there's no confirmation that he had Well Fed, Mark/Kings, or flasks/elixirs - hopefully his 108.56% was checked immediately prior to the pull?).
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Codegen » Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:26 am

theckhd wrote:Looks like both of these are legitimate, no buffs appear to have fallen off during the fight (though as a result, there's no confirmation that he had Well Fed, Mark/Kings, or flasks/elixirs - hopefully his 108.56% was checked immediately prior to the pull?).

Starting from 4th or 5th pull that night he had 108,56% ctc on each try unless he died midfight.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Ventras » Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:59 am

So, can't we confirm a safe percent for block capping on this encounter? Should we stack up to 109% and pray? :lol:
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Awyndel » Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:52 am

Sorry to derail from this, but I'm all sorts of confused about unhitable now. Are we still taking dodge/parry/block from the sheet and adding 5% miss to get 102.4? What's this about 4.4% miss?

I understand Baleroc works differently.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Torias » Wed Aug 31, 2011 7:53 am

Bosses reduce all your stats (Dodge, Parry, Block) as well as your chance to be Missed by 0.6%. Normally we don't account for that and just add that 4*0.6% onto the total we're aiming for, hence 102.4% (or 100% + 4*0.6%). The reason it's come up here is because as Baleroc is a boss he only actually has 4.4% miss to remove from consideration, so the normal convention of not adjusting for the level discrepancy and balancing around 102.4% is slightly misleading.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Kihra » Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:30 am

Ventras wrote:So, can't we confirm a safe percent for block capping on this encounter? Should we stack up to 109% and pray? :lol:


There is no reason to block cap Inferno Blade. In fact doing so typically comes at the expense of either avoidance or health. Cooldowns can easily cover Inferno Blade. It's one of the least dangerous parts of the fight. Stick with ~103.5% and you'll be fine.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby baff » Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:14 pm

I was at 109.1% last night, and still had one unblocked inferno strike - and no, it wasn't a full absorb.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Greengo » Thu Sep 01, 2011 12:50 am

baff wrote:I was at 109.1% last night, and still had one unblocked inferno strike - and no, it wasn't a full absorb.

Same here, at 110%.
...
And one more unblocked inferno strike, this time at 111%.

Kihra is absolutely right. It's not worth trying to block cap against inferno.
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Minibell » Fri Sep 02, 2011 9:02 am

Greengo wrote:
baff wrote:I was at 109.1% last night, and still had one unblocked inferno strike - and no, it wasn't a full absorb.

Same here, at 110%.
...
And one more unblocked inferno strike, this time at 111%.

Kihra is absolutely right. It's not worth trying to block cap against inferno.



Sounds true, but as a former programmer, these kinds of bugs annoy me. Bug it all to hell. ;)
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Re: Nerfed block chance on Baleroc encounter?

Postby Tengenstein » Fri Sep 09, 2011 2:40 am

As A warrior With Shield Block up i've had the following parse;

[20:52:53.360] Tengenstein casts Shield Block
[20:52:55.878] Baleroc Inferno Strike Tengenstein 70471 (A: 427, B: 31853, R: 15857)
[20:52:58.283] Baleroc Inferno Strike Tengenstein 42708 (A: 11670, B: 24431, R: 46910)
[20:53:00.667] Baleroc Inferno Strike Tengenstein 90619 (A: 743, B: 41047, R: 36780)
[20:53:03.245] Baleroc Inferno Strike Tengenstein 114158 (A: 16986, R: 36429)
[20:53:03.343] Tengenstein's Shield Block fades from Tengenstein

Being that SB should raise my CTC To about 114% unbuffed assuming he can't miss somthing is definetly up.
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