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[10] Ragnaros

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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Fetzie » Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:59 am

It is possibly worth mentioning that glyphed Holy Wrath and Hammer of Justice can also stun the scions that spawn in the second transition. Clever positioning can let HW stun multiple sons and the scion.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Geaux » Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:40 am

What strategy is everyone using for phase 3? My guild can get to phase 3 on a regular basis with everyone up, we just can't seem to figure out the best way to handle the rocks tumbling around and killing people. Our best attempt is 5% to the kill on normal. Is there a easy to use method, we kite them back and forth through the middle and take turns, but i feel like the phase lasts way too long and after 45 sec or so into it we start losing people like dominos.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Nothan » Mon Aug 08, 2011 9:28 am

Well after a good number of attempts we saw the living meteor phase once and we wiped at 8% until the RP. Partially was because half the raid didn't know what was going on with the meteors and some bad kiting I think cost us a kill. The best way I handled my meteor on my hunter was to kite it side to side and knocking it back and making sure you don't knock it into the tanks most importantly. There was several times the other fixated person was right next to me and then their meteor fixated me when I got cornered right after they knocked their meteor back and very narrowly escaped, but I didn't have much choice but to knock it dangerously close to someone. The phase did not feel too long even though at the end we only had half the raid alive. It also didn't help that 2 of the people are playing from overseas with awful latency :(
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Galiks » Mon Aug 08, 2011 9:48 am

Geaux wrote:What strategy is everyone using for phase 3? My guild can get to phase 3 on a regular basis with everyone up, we just can't seem to figure out the best way to handle the rocks tumbling around and killing people. Our best attempt is 5% to the kill on normal. Is there a easy to use method, we kite them back and forth through the middle and take turns, but i feel like the phase lasts way too long and after 45 sec or so into it we start losing people like dominos.


Honestly the best strategy for handling P3 can be seen from the Heroic Ragnaros kill on their 25 man. They have two separate camps stacked and continually knock the meteor back towards where the scions spawned without ever having to move. So, ideally you could have two camps of 5 players at two of the circles adjacent to Ragnaros with one player dedicated in each camp to knocking the closest one backwards. I'm fairly certain if someone with a high range attack hits it when it immediately comes into range each time, then they will be able to consistently keep it out of the group if that do it each time (it goes immune to knockback for either 3 or 4 seconds..).

That is somewhat difficult to coordinate and definitely not needed for normal DPS requirements, so the basic strategy we use is everyone just spreads out across the room to maximize DPS to a position near their Sons of Ragnaros spot. We stress to the raid to never be south of a meteor as we always push the meteors away from Ragnaros (south) if possible. It's not too complex, just kite them away from the group no matter what your job is (preferably away from Ragnaros towards the center), and have a melee with a ranged attack or someone in melee range pop them further backwards. Honestly, it may help to have a few people just controlling the meteors over ventrilo and chasing them around the room if you're really having problems since we all know you can't rely on everyone to hit the knockbacks. DPS isn't really an issue here unless you're down players going into it.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby fafhrd » Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:38 am

Geaux wrote:What strategy is everyone using for phase 3? My guild can get to phase 3 on a regular basis with everyone up, we just can't seem to figure out the best way to handle the rocks tumbling around and killing people. Our best attempt is 5% to the kill on normal. Is there a easy to use method, we kite them back and forth through the middle and take turns, but i feel like the phase lasts way too long and after 45 sec or so into it we start losing people like dominos.


We never really made any strat for it, there's a lot of room to spread out and kite in, at least on 10. There's no raid damage, so DPS are free to go wherever they want, and healers just need to keep heals up on the tanks. We try to avoid dragging them across melee, and if that's inevitable we call out a warning to whoever's in the way. Other than that, everyone just spreads out, kites their meteor as long as they can, then hits it with something at the last minute to punt it somewhere that it won't land on top of someone else (usually towards the middle of strip we stand on).
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Epimer » Mon Aug 08, 2011 1:31 pm

I feel really stupid for even having to ask this, but are people actively tanking the Molten Elementals or just healing through them wailing on various different people? Our DPS are doing their standard "blow up everything before a tank has even touched it" strategy to dealing with add fights and I was wondering if other people are just AoE thing the hell out of them too.

I kind of feel that if DPS is sufficiently high then the adds should be down in a very few seconds anyway, but ours aren't dying that quickly.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Belloc » Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:34 pm

I usually lay down a consecrate to grab them, HotR them, and then holy wrath. I don't think most of them survive beyond the stun.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Finkum » Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:57 pm

As the Molten Elementals each fixate on a random person (at least according to the Dungeon Journal, and my somewhat limited experience confirms it), it's not really possible to tank them effectively. Our priest claims that Fade allowed him to drop aggro though, so it could be that they just start with high threat on a random target.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Rokh » Mon Aug 08, 2011 11:15 pm

That is correct, they have no threat table and just target someone and go to town... they are slowable and stunable though, so what my group normaly does is i use holy wrath stun when they all get into melee range, then we have a druid warstomp when the adds hit about 50% hp.. this keeps them stunned for almost their entire lifespan.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Donahu » Tue Aug 09, 2011 2:06 am

How long is Phase 3 supposed to last? We're getting there "regularly" now but just aren't pushing it through. I like the idea of two camps of 5 and just knocking meteors around. I think that'd work for the individuals that we have. Either way, we'll get him next week, just sad we didn't kill him this week to get some heroic modes worked on.

Here's our WoLogs for Sunday and Monday night. If anyone wants to poke and prod around the attempts and see if they notice a pattern of improvement that can be made I'd appreciate it.

Sunday - Had internet issues so I wasn't in the raid until way late.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/q2qd5aqjo664st4f/

Monday - Started off great with a P3 on first attempt but fell apart for awhile before getting it back together.

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/4edit28fhnrnujhu/
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Belloc » Tue Aug 09, 2011 7:34 am

Phase 3 should typically last no longer than 3 meteor spawns.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Winkle » Tue Aug 09, 2011 9:11 am

I think most people aim for no ore than 3 meteor spawns. The 1st meteor spawns about 15 seconds into P3 and then you get a meteor every 50 seconds there after.

To avoid the 4th meteor spawn you need to do 122k raid dps which isn't terrible considering you should be saving hero for this phase + pots + executes/killshots/Hammers etc.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby fafhrd » Tue Aug 09, 2011 9:34 am

Winkle wrote:I think most people aim for no ore than 3 meteor spawns. The 1st meteor spawns about 15 seconds into P3 and then you get a meteor every 50 seconds there after.

To avoid the 4th meteor spawn you need to do 122k raid dps which isn't terrible considering you should be saving hero for this phase + pots + executes/killshots/Hammers etc.


We actually blow hero before that, on the transition with scions+sons. Our first kill did have us getting a bit overrrun by meteors in a long P3, but subsequent kills have been quicker and cleaner.

I'm really not understanding what all the worry about P3 is for, at least on 10. There is very little going on, 80% of the raid can turret the boss for most of it, then 70% when a 3rd meteor spawns. The transitions are much more hectic times.
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby Tebin » Sun Aug 14, 2011 4:04 pm

Hey guys, we're just at the point now of wiping on the seeds phase, and I've got some questions...

i) Should the tank be staying at melee range if rag sets the ground in the inner 1/3 of the room on fire? Will he still melee them if they're in the mid 1/3?

ii) How does the mechanic for the hammer with the waves work, in terms of where he does it? He appears to do it in two spots on the ground, but is it random or done on the side with the most raid members?

iii) Regarding second phase with sons, how are you guys getting the scions to the tanks? We've currently got our setup as each DPS killing an add, each tank killing an add, and two healers killing an add, leaving the third to spot heal/finish anything that gets too close to the hammer.

We've got two paladin tanks, and two hunters. I guess the hunters could MD the scions to a tank? Do they hit hard enough to need OT'd quickly?

EDIT: For reference, tomorrow's composition:

Prot pala
prot pala
resto druid
resto shaman
holy priest
fire mage
hunter
hunter
demo warlock
frost DK

EDIT2: Also, do the traps stop spawning on p3?
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Re: [10] Ragnaros

Postby fuzzygeek » Sun Aug 14, 2011 4:42 pm

i) His melee range is larger than the ring effects (which are slightly larger than the actual burn graphic). Stay in melee range, but don't stand in the fire.

ii) Randomly targeted

iii) Scions spawn before sons. We have our tanks handling positions 1 and 8 (last adds on the ends). With two paladins, just have each tank just toss a shield at an add when it spawns, and they'll have time to get to their add before it spawns. They don't hit that hard, but should be tanked. Let the hunters focus on killing the raid-wiping mechanic.

Edit: no more traps after P1.
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