Interesting Lore Discussion Thread

[lythac]

Nice to see the Forsaken have humour.

Also after watching Happy Feet, you would want to punch a penguin.

[Sagara]

Oh and I wanted to quote you on that one - go and listen to Paletress at the Argent tournament, the Three are definitly presented. It's an interesting piece of lore in itself, btw - the first mass we see in the game?

Good catch, I forgot about that.

However from the same NPC...

Undercity Champion says: I punched a penguin on my way in here.
Argent Confessor Paletress says: Oh, my. Do you feel remorseful, at least?
Undercity Champion says: Nah, not really. I just wanted to see the look on your face.
(At this point Paletress turns around and leaves the confessional area. After the Undercity Champion stops laughing, he waves at her and goes back to his seat.)

Yeah, he's a pretty nasty piece of work that one

Still, Paletress does drive the point home - she doesn't go all Light-smashing around (which she proved perfectly capable of in the instance). Restraint must be our master word (yeah, big words from a BE ) if we don't want to fall.

Now, to be perfectly honest, I would have driven the lesson home if I were her, probably going Harry Dresden on his butt (a scene I adored in the book "Blood Rites")

Q: Lucky for you, she's good people.
UC: *laughs*
Q: Unlucky for you, I'm not as much.
*Fist to the face, chop down 3 limbs*
Q: *while attaching limbs to the belt* There's needle and thread back at the Horde camp. If you crawl there, I'm sure they'll help you attach those back. Oh, and next time? The head goes off. Bye!

Hell, we're Paladins, sometimes people need to remember we CAN back up our threats and sermons. But because this one Forsaken acts like a d*ck, doesn't mean they're all beyond the Light.

[Dantriges]

The UC probably dared to behave like this because the Argent Crusade called for peace at the tournament.

[Sabindeus]

Oh and I wanted to quote you on that one - go and listen to Paletress at the Argent tournament, the Three are definitly presented. It's an interesting piece of lore in itself, btw - the first mass we see in the game?

Good catch, I forgot about that.

However from the same NPC...

Undercity Champion says: I punched a penguin on my way in here.
Argent Confessor Paletress says: Oh, my. Do you feel remorseful, at least?
Undercity Champion says: Nah, not really. I just wanted to see the look on your face.
(At this point Paletress turns around and leaves the confessional area. After the Undercity Champion stops laughing, he waves at her and goes back to his seat.)

Yeah, he's a pretty nasty piece of work that one :lol:

Still, Paletress does drive the point home - she doesn't go all Light-smashing around (which she proved perfectly capable of in the instance). Restraint must be our master word (yeah, big words from a BE :D ) if we don't want to fall.

I'm not sure that I see any reason for that to be true just because Paletress, a Priestess who belongs to the Argent Crusade and has turned her back on the Alliance, acts that way.

Hell, we're Paladins, sometimes people need to remember we CAN back up our threats and sermons. But because this one Forsaken acts like a d*ck, doesn't mean they're all beyond the Light.

No the fact that the Light actively sears their flesh and causes them pain is what means they're all beyond it.

[Sagara]

Truly? Massive interaction with the Light has caused some reactions beyond mere pain - there's something inside the rotting flesh. And once again, you're mistaking undeath and the undead.

Undeath is our anathema, the undead are beings touched by that anathema. It's possible that undeath does not force evil - undeath tempts to evil by torturing those who suffer it.

I'll posit a wild guessing: what if the pain that the Light causes is a reaction of undeath to the presence of Light? Being burned away by the light, undeath torments its host to have it flee or destroy the Light. I it so hard to believe that one can go beyond the petiness undeath causes and become the master of one's un-life?

[Sabindeus]

The only correct choice for an undead person to make is to be put out his misery. Undeath is not life, it is not living.

[Sabindeus]

Truly? Massive interaction with the Light has caused some reactions beyond mere pain - there's something inside the rotting flesh. And once again, you're mistaking undeath and the undead.

Is this referring to something specific?

[Sagara]

Truly? Massive interaction with the Light has caused some reactions beyond mere pain - there's something inside the rotting flesh. And once again, you're mistaking undeath and the undead.

Is this referring to something specific?

Lore Q&A from a couple of weeks ago, i'll go and dig it in a moment.

[Sagara]

Found:

Q: Are there long-term effects on an undead who is in regular contact with the Holy Light in a positive way?

A: It is difficult to say, as there are no known records of undead wielding the Holy Light before the Third War. There are reports, however, that some Forsaken have slowly experienced a sharpening of their dulled senses of touch, smell, etc., as well as an increase in the flashes of positive emotions that have otherwise become so rare since their fall into undeath. Unfortunately, this may be the cause of the Forsaken priesthood's increased attempts at self-destruction; regaining these senses would force the priests to smell their own rotting flesh, taste the decay in their mouths and throats, and even feel the maggots burrowing within their bodies.

[Aerron]

Found:

Q: Are there long-term effects on an undead who is in regular contact with the Holy Light in a positive way?

A: It is difficult to say, as there are no known records of undead wielding the Holy Light before the Third War. There are reports, however, that some Forsaken have slowly experienced a sharpening of their dulled senses of touch, smell, etc., as well as an increase in the flashes of positive emotions that have otherwise become so rare since their fall into undeath. Unfortunately, this may be the cause of the Forsaken priesthood's increased attempts at self-destruction; regaining these senses would force the priests to smell their own rotting flesh, taste the decay in their mouths and throats, and even feel the maggots burrowing within their bodies.

So what this is telling me is ... if they were fully/truly aware of their condition, they would seek to end it.

Fair enough.

[Sabindeus]

Found:

Q: Are there long-term effects on an undead who is in regular contact with the Holy Light in a positive way?

A: It is difficult to say, as there are no known records of undead wielding the Holy Light before the Third War. There are reports, however, that some Forsaken have slowly experienced a sharpening of their dulled senses of touch, smell, etc., as well as an increase in the flashes of positive emotions that have otherwise become so rare since their fall into undeath. Unfortunately, this may be the cause of the Forsaken priesthood's increased attempts at self-destruction; regaining these senses would force the priests to smell their own rotting flesh, taste the decay in their mouths and throats, and even feel the maggots burrowing within their bodies.

So what this is telling me is ... if they were fully/truly aware of their condition, they would seek to end it.

Fair enough.

Yep, pretty much. That's what I took away from that Q&A. Basically it looks like Sagara and I made veeeery different conclusions from reading the same material as I didn't recognize what he was referencing here. There's something inside the rotting flesh all right... maggots.

[Sagara]

Found:

Q: Are there long-term effects on an undead who is in regular contact with the Holy Light in a positive way?

A: It is difficult to say, as there are no known records of undead wielding the Holy Light before the Third War. There are reports, however, that some Forsaken have slowly experienced a sharpening of their dulled senses of touch, smell, etc., as well as an increase in the flashes of positive emotions that have otherwise become so rare since their fall into undeath. Unfortunately, this may be the cause of the Forsaken priesthood's increased attempts at self-destruction; regaining these senses would force the priests to smell their own rotting flesh, taste the decay in their mouths and throats, and even feel the maggots burrowing within their bodies.

So what this is telling me is ... if they were fully/truly aware of their condition, they would seek to end it.

Fair enough.

Yep, pretty much. That's what I took away from that Q&A. Basically it looks like Sagara and I made veeeery different conclusions from reading the same material as I didn't recognize what he was referencing here. There's something inside the rotting flesh all right... maggots.

Yeah, I noticed "positive emotions"
That's the spin - the Light CAN help. Okay it's horribly painful. Okay, it's probably a suicide. But, hey! At least they HAVE a chance!

And besides, that's the whole point: the Forsaken can go beyong their usual petiness. There are lots of string attached, but the choice is there.

[Dantriges]

Seems to me that a Forsakenhas the choice between being filled with negative emotions, dulled senses and well the small joys of life are missing, too or you gain normal perceptions and feel positive emotions sometimes with the added benefit of feeling your own decay.

It´s a quality of unlife, issue. i would rather prefer to be dead than undead. That´s not something worth existing for.

And if these aren´t just exaggerations, this undead state doesn´t seem permanent or very long anyways. Rotting flesh, burrowing maggots indicate that your body will decay sometime, probaby pretty soon.

[alayire]

It seems to me at least that the Elves and the rest don´t share so much in culture/common goals, etc. The blood elves probably don´t like the humans but it seems to me that they don´t have this huge amount of hatred that the orcs have against the humans. Disliking someone doesn´t mean you bash his head in.

awwww Alliance bias alert!

I mean it's obvious you are Alliance biased, but Orcs burning with hatred against humans? pardon my french but that's a load of bullcrap. that didn't happen even in the wars, Orcs were burning with legion blood against everything. It had nothing to do with the humans at all.

[Passionario]

Seems to me that a Forsakenhas the choice between being filled with negative emotions, dulled senses and well the small joys of life are missing, too or you gain normal perceptions and feel positive emotions sometimes with the added benefit of feeling your own decay.

It´s a quality of unlife, issue. i would rather prefer to be dead than undead. That´s not something worth existing for.

And if these aren´t just exaggerations, this undead state doesn´t seem permanent or very long anyways. Rotting flesh, burrowing maggots indicate that your body will decay sometime, probaby pretty soon.

And I'd rather be an elemental ascendant than a human.

Human bodies get sick, hungry and tired. They wither and eventually they die. Furthermore, the blessed Fire which is the source of all life (hello Alexstrasza) and the true spark of immortality (hello phoenixes) is actually harmful to these fleshy abominations. Human bodies that come into direct contact with fire are burned and disfigured, often with permanent or lethal results.

BRB, joining Twilight Hammer.

[Mcduffie]

Seems to me that a Forsakenhas the choice between being filled with negative emotions, dulled senses and well the small joys of life are missing, too or you gain normal perceptions and feel positive emotions sometimes with the added benefit of feeling your own decay.

It´s a quality of unlife, issue. i would rather prefer to be dead than undead. That´s not something worth existing for.

And if these aren´t just exaggerations, this undead state doesn´t seem permanent or very long anyways. Rotting flesh, burrowing maggots indicate that your body will decay sometime, probaby pretty soon.

And I'd rather be an elemental ascendant than a human.

Human bodies get sick, hungry and tired. They wither and eventually they die. Furthermore, the blessed Fire which is the source of all life (hello Alexstrasza) and the true spark of immortality (hello phoenixes) is actually harmful to these fleshy abominations. Human bodies that come into direct contact with fire are burned and disfigured, often with permanent or lethal results.

BRB, joining Twilight Hammer.

New class alert: Elemental Ascendant.

[KysenMurrin]

I'd like to see that. Fire aspect for dps, either Earth or Water as healer, any element could be designed as another dps spec (we are missing an air-based caster dps, I guess). Could be a third Mail-wearing class. Will probably never happen, heh.

[Dantriges]

It seems to me at least that the Elves and the rest don´t share so much in culture/common goals, etc. The blood elves probably don´t like the humans but it seems to me that they don´t have this huge amount of hatred that the orcs have against the humans. Disliking someone doesn´t mean you bash his head in.

awwww Alliance bias alert!

I mean it's obvious you are Alliance biased, but Orcs burning with hatred against humans? pardon my french but that's a load of bullcrap. that didn't happen even in the wars, Orcs were burning with legion blood against everything. It had nothing to do with the humans at all.

The quests in Wrath where Orc forces assaulted both the Alliance and the Scourge? Result: Alliance and Horde killed, Scourge wins.

[Levantine]

How the hell are you going from Horde attacks Alliance to "huge amount of hatred that the orcs have against the humans"?

[Skye1013]

I'd like to see that. Fire aspect for dps, either Earth or Water as healer, any element could be designed as another dps spec (we are missing an air-based caster dps, I guess). Could be a third Mail-wearing class. Will probably never happen, heh.

I think that would be too similar to shaman... fire/lightning dps, water/earth heals.

[KysenMurrin]

I think it could be distinct enough - have things equivalent to forms for the specs to each have an element, which would keep specs very individual. An Air based dps spec could easily be very different from existing characters, if you avoided giving them Lightning attacks: build it on wind bursts, vortices, maybe involve slows. I guess the healing side might wind up too similar, since Shaman already have Earth Shield and Healing Rain, which reduces the options for a new class.

But I'm dragging this off topic, so lets leave the speculation on non-existent classes behind.

[Passionario]

If Blizzard decides to turn Sylvanas into the next Staghelm, who could become the next leader of the Forsaken?

My personal nominee is the ghost of King Terenas.

[Skye1013]

If Blizzard decides to turn Sylvanas into the next Staghelm, who could become the next leader of the Forsaken?

My personal nominee is the ghost of King Terenas.

Long "live" the king?

[Sagara]

If Blizzard decides to turn Sylvanas into the next Staghelm, who could become the next leader of the Forsaken?

My personal nominee is the ghost of King Terenas.

THe girl in the early Forsaken quests whose name eludes me right now.

Hateful of herself, with a large helping of parental abuse to seal the deal. Badass AND completely psycho!

[Levantine]

Lilian Voss?