[10] Beth'tilac

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[10] Beth'tilac

Postby Geaux » Fri Jul 01, 2011 7:03 am

Wanted to share with everyone some insight on this fight. We got the kill last night in 5 attempts on 10 man which seems to be much easier.

Comp:
MT: Warrior Tank
MT: DK Tank
DPS: Frost DK
DPS: Survival Hunter
DPS: Fire Mage
DPS: Destruction Warlock
DPS: Shadow Priest
Heals: Disc Priest
Heals: Resto Shammy
Heals: Resto Druid

I can't go into all the details of the encounter but I can give some advice on what made the encouter easier for us...which may help anyone working on this for progression.

1.) You only need to send 1 tank and 1 healer on top of the web. Sending an extra DPS up to get more leadway on the boss was silly because when she landed for phase 2 the spiderlings always seemed to healer her back to 100% anyways. Also the extra DPS on the bottom makes killing the drone in a timely manner much easier.

2.) I watched a video online that said that in phase 2 when Beth gets to 10 stacks that you need to start rotating AOE CD's to stay alive. This was complete BS...I would reccomend rotating AOE CD's when beth gets to around 30% HP or less as the raid damage during that time will be very significant. Beth was probably in the 50-70 stack range when we started rotating CD's (Don't quote me on that because we didnt watch her stacks and call it out....I just know that 10 stacks came very quickly in phase 2 and the damage was easily healed through early on ). Tanks will also need to start using CD's as she starts to hit like Grul did back in the BC days when he would get around the 20ish stack of buff. Use heroism near the end of the fight for the DPS boost but ALSO because the healers will need it to sling the heals out faster to keep people alive...it gets pretty intense.

3.) You don't have to kite the drone away from the spiderlings. It is easy to just tank them in the middle near your grouped up raid (faced away of course so they dont get spewed with fire) and the ranged can burn spiderlings down well before they get near the drone. This fight definately favors ranged dps. We also noticed that if you taunt the spinners they would slide to the ground and the tank could pick them up and they could be killed quicker with spash damage from DPS on the drone. I sometimes ended up tanking the drone and 3 spinners at a time. I reccomend trying this...your melee DPS will love you for it.

Happy Hunting...hope this helps anyone having trouble on this boss.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby frontallobe » Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:25 am

We got our kill last night as well. Here are some things I took away from it.

Comp (12/12 normals only guild)
-------------
Pally tank
DK tank

kitty
rogue

mage
hunter
hunter

priest
shaman
pally


Spinners
==========
1. Send the DK up top. It's just too OP to have the pally tank on the ground with RF pulling down two spinners at once.

2. Don't use RF on the spinners until they are all the way dangled as some times they will have the top team targeted and your RF will be out of range. (remember it works on a player, not on a mob) Once they dangle they typically switch to the ground healers.

3. Don't worry about tanking the spinners. There melee damage is crap - our mage tanked a few. Save your taunts for the danglers.

4. My goal was to gather them up against the drone with damage not taunts. When this happened our rogue switched from Drone to spinners but he never ran looking for a spinner.

5. Mage's sole job was spinner duty. If they were dead (you get 6 per transition) then he switched to drone but never to spiderlings. We had large problems with everyone trying to help everyone else with their jobs. Once they focused and trusted each other the DPS got to acceptable ranges.

6. Hunters sometimes could help with a distracting shot / growl on the pet to pull them down. We did ditch this and put them solely on spiderlings but may be an option for your raid.

7. The first two spinners will be taunted by your top team if they can. DK taunted one down.. did some damage until the web popped then went up. We had a pally healer so she was able to taunt hers down as well and pop right up.

Drones
============
I let the drone come to me. Running out the group just didn't seem too valuable. One spit may hit the raid as he comes in but we found that worth the trade off. Tank away from raid.

Have your melee dps (pref one with a aggro dump because you'll be using all your taunts on spinners) We loved a rogue on this one: Tricks + Aggro dumps. Good stuff.

Be ready to kite a little bit if the spinners happen to be near by but don't go nuts.. a few yards usually did it for us.

Spiderlings
============
1. We played a lot with how to do this best. We ended with two ranged (both hunters for us) nuking them, then switching to spinners, then to drones. Calling out spiderlings birthing direction (east, west, etc) seemed to help as well. Make sure to slow them blah blah.

Top Web
============
We sent our DK tank, Pally Healer, and Kitty up top. They were able to get her down to 80% when she landed. Each time they dropped down they would help get a drone down, taunt some spinners, and repeat.

Phase 2
============
Our #1 priority right before P2 was to nuke the spiderlings so she did not heal. This can be perfected with proper focus.

I off tanked a drone while they did that. The DK tank picks up Beth. Rest of us kill the drone. Now we're all on Beth.

This is a typically burn phase with tank swapping. DBM doesn't seem to be reporting kiss so both tanks worked hot mic and just called it. We didn't move though. We would just taunt back and forth at 45 degree angles and coordinate CDs with healers.


Utilize CDs for raid AOE in between transitions.
==============
We used disc barrier
Tank divine guardian
And Pally aura mastery.

My CD and Barrier were back up by the time final phase came into play so we used them again. Etc.

Hope this helps
Frontallobe

Some WoL numbers:
DTPS DK: 16k
DTPS Pally: 10k

HPS across all healers about 15k
DPS 13k - 18k depending on persons role.
Last edited by frontallobe on Sat Jul 02, 2011 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Tebin » Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:56 am

We tried this the other day and didn't get anywhere, and I think it was partially due to us putting 2 dps up top, so the ground got swamped with adds. We were goign to try just 1 dps up top, or potentially none, so it's encouraging to see other guilds following this approach.

Do either of you have a raidlog for your kills, or some indication of the DPS your...DPS were outputting? This fight feels somewhat gearbound, and my guild didn't really stomp heroic modes last tier, so we're not exactly able to out-stat this fight.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Chicken » Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:02 pm

My guild settled eventually for one DPS on top as well. I don't have a linkable raidlog available for you, but I do know what (though not how much) each of our DPS were doing approximately:

- Our DPS Warrior was the DPS who went up. He helped kill the first two Spinners before jumping up.
- Our Enhancement Shaman helped on Spinners, but would prioritize DPSing Drones if any were up.
- Our Mage and Moonkin focused on keeping the Spiderlings under control. Helping out on either Spinners or Drones if they had a bit of spare time (They usually didn't).
- I (Destruction Warlock) focused on killing any remaining Spinners first, and then focused on Drones after. I also helped out with the occasional Shadowfury on the Spiderlings, and helped make sure they were all dead after Beth'tilacs third Smoldering Devastation. I also started the fight by casting a Bane of Havoc on Beth'tilac because that was some nice free damage on her.

We ended up with Beth'tilac at 70% when she came down, and never had more than a single Drone up.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Geaux » Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:18 pm

I recall our healers saying they were pulling about 15k HPS last night when it was all said and done. I do not have a log avaliable, last night we lost a raid member who usually handles the logs for us...she quit wow so we went log-less. By not sending a dps up top on 10 man it was a slight disadvantage to start with beth at 100% however the trade off was that when she came down there were no extra adds left to finish burning off so we had all out DPS going balls to the wall on beth the second she came down. Like I said we attempted this fight on the fly and this was the quick makeshift strat we came up with and succeded with going into the fight pretty unprepared.

As a estimate of our DPS all I can say is about 8/10 of the raid members were 5/13 heroic for T-11 and the other 2 were 1/13 heroic. If that gives any idea to our gear level. This is also coming from a semi-hardcore guild that has had 0 experience on the PTR and only raids 3 nights a week.

If we do this again next week on 10 man I will make sure we get some logs to provide.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Aerron » Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:30 pm

Geaux, any idea what the average range was for your DPS on that kill?
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Geaux » Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:58 pm

I couldnt tell ya as I have been to lazy to redownload recount since the patch. I would say on average here is a good estimate of there single targert DPS that I have seen in easy bosses with no gimmicks.

Detahknight: 20-23k
Warlock: about 18-20k
Mage: 20-24k
Shadow Priest: 16-17k
Hunter: 18-19k

I will ask around my guildies and see if anyone has an unwiped recount and get back to ya with an accurate snapshot if I can.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Geaux » Fri Jul 01, 2011 2:15 pm

Ok per your request I texted a friend of mine who luckly hadnt cleared his recount logs...I asked him to get me some screenshots of the data if this helps anyone as a raid check.

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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby frontallobe » Sat Jul 02, 2011 2:34 pm

Our raid team was 12/12 with some FL trash farming pre beth that week. Between the 10 of us only the pally had one piece of heroic gear. (healer)

So, in short, this id definitely doable with a 359 team. It was challenging and took us 2 nights with 21 wipes. Mostly learning the notes I put above.

Here's the WoL from our kill. Notice how low our dps was. Practice + coordination can overcome this fight but it's damn close. A few heroic pieces would go a long way on Beth.
http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-n ... 851&e=9272
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Epimer » Mon Jul 04, 2011 5:09 am

For reference, here is the log for our 10 man kill last night. We were 4/13 heroics pre-patch and the average gear level of the raid was ~362. The Holy Paladin in the parse is an off-spec who's only healed a raid twice before, so was struggling a bit. The Frost DK is also a re-roll so a little undergeared.

Our top team was me, the Holy Paladin and the Rogue. I'd get down at least two Spinners (HoR + RD, with RD sometimes getting two) and the Holy Paladin got one more. I think our burn phase was from 90% down but I'm not sure (80% on transition + one spiderling consumed); I've not checked the logs closely enough to figure it out.

I think the kill was our second time into P2. The first time we didn't pre-arrange a raid cooldown order and died at around 20%. Even our kill attempt doesn't appear to have an Aura Mastery, so we could have done better. From ~25% down we used Divine Guardian, Rallying Cry + Tranquility (x2) and then she fell over dead with all 10 of us still standing. Our superstar Resto Druid (damn him for partially retiring from raiding!) was peaking at nearly 40k HPS though, so it was a little hairy.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Lumenactio » Mon Jul 04, 2011 7:02 pm

Curious what percent people are entering phase 2 on the boss?

We entered her once on 87% after she ate a spide and we wiped at 2%, so she was at like -8% in reality.

I can't really tell from the various logs. We used an arcane mage up there. We originally were using a rogue, but after a couple attempts it became obvious the Blade Flurry on the Drone smashing the spinners at the same time would make P1 much easier.


Also, we found that the spiderlings don't need to get to Beth for her to eat one. If there are any up when she drops, she noms on one from what seemed like any range. So 10s before the last Devistation, I'd pull the mage down from upstairs and all dps from the last drone who always seemed to be around 40%. Soon as that last spidering spawn spawned, which is right as she's casting her devistation, I'd make the whole raid except me and a healer bum rush the little sodders and squish them into bug guts, then come back and finish the drone which I tanked out to the side while they stacked up behind Beth's abdomen. Soon as the drone was dead, I got in with the raid, we popped hero and went to town on her.

Soon as I started having the raid bum rush that last group of spiderlings and make sure they were all dead before she came down for P2 we killed her the next attempt. The mage was able to get her to 76% or so by the transition. We prob could have gone for a bit longer. Fight ended with all 10 up and us at 100% health. Healers had about 15% mana left.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby domipal » Tue Jul 05, 2011 1:08 am

We had 2 people up top, Arcane mage and fury warr, with a frost dk, destro lock, and surv hunter on the bottom. We had beth to like 84% by the time p2 started and she didnt heal at all. Just popped hero immediately and burned her down, killed her at about 30 stacks of frenzy, but it seemed like a cakewalk. 2 shot the boss, the first wipe being hte tank falling off hte web lol.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Tebin » Tue Jul 05, 2011 1:13 am

Got this last night, so thanks for the help everyone :D

Had a warlock up top for the first two of three phases, which took her down to 83% or so. As you said, Lumenactio, killing the spiderlings for p3 transition was key. She appears to laserbeam them all when she lands for about 10% each.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby 2Cute2BeStr8 » Tue Jul 05, 2011 8:53 am

We kind of were able to cheese it with just uber tanks, I'd say average Ilevel of the raid was prob 362-266. We just burned her from 100 percent to 0. It would have been nice to do it the right way, but like. Honestly she just kept eating spiders. No matter what we did that last wave of spiderling was coming and everyone knows to dps em, but I try to pull her away from them and she just gobbles em up.

Any suggestions for the spiderlings with all the dps on bot.

Even not sending 1 dps up would be manageable burning her from just tank damage.
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Re: [10] Beth'tilac

Postby Glowry » Tue Jul 05, 2011 10:22 am

We did it last Wednesday on alts that were pretty under-geared (sub 359 avg). Our 2 tanks couldn't really survive past 17 stacks during the burn phase. The way we downed it was sending 1 DPS up to bring Beth'tilac down to around 70% before the last phase. She pushes into the last phase after 3 web phases, and right before doing so, she spawns a wave of spiderlings. You have about 10 seconds to burn these guys down before she lands, and her range to eat them is something ridiculous like half the room. When this last wave of spiderlings spawns, we pop hero, everyone drops what they were doing and we go all out on that wave of spiderlings. We ended up pushing the last phase with a drone up at about 50% health, but Beth'tilac was at 70%.
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