Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

Postby mclem » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:37 am

Gracerath wrote:I can safely say that I have never once pugged a heroic in Cataclysm. I've always had a group of friends to run with. (I have pugged some normal 85's on my alt warrior though, but never a heroic) This change will probably have me running some randoms through out the week in addition to my normal heroics with friends.

I've only done a complete PuG in Cataclysm once.

It was Grim Batol.

It was fine.

Am I just freakishly fortunate?
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

Postby Aanar » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:38 am

knaughty wrote:Been, there, done that: EQ had a 6-player group. Result was four DPS, not extra tanks or healers.

It was more like one tank, one healer, one puller/dps, one cc/haste/mana regen, one slower/dps, which left you with only 1 random dps slot. If you were a ranger, have fun shouting for a group all night...

[The irony for much of the early game was that rangers had crappy damage, but had a taunt button (why?), but took so much damage they couldn't tank at all]
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

Postby Hrobertgar » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:41 am

Personally, I think this may be very successfull at reducing wait times. Right now, tanks are usually underrepresented, and presumably this would increase the supply by some at least modest amount. Since tanks are in such huge shortage for 5man groups even a modest increase in supply can lead to a dramatic shortening of wait times.

Yes, there is a risk of more 'tankable' dps classes queueing as 'tank' and pulling some BS, so I would like the CtA to verify that ther person has a tank spec. However, if too many slob tanks queue, then healers will become most needed and get the bonus. OR, possibly the max queue time for dps would drop below the threshhold and CtA would go away until the shortage resumed.

(A guildee told me a tale wherein a plate dps queued as a tank, and immediatley indicated they needed a 15min afk. Since you cannot kick someone so soon, the group was on hold without its 'tank'. Once a dps finally left in frustration after eating the full queue time, the 'tank' suddenly solved his afk issue and requeued as dps. When my guildee wrote a ticket to try to get the guy banned he got some lame response like 'congrats on finding a way to beat the system' So, I can see the risk of plate classes and druids gaming the system with a false queue, and I am not certain how much the system as currently described addresses that risk.)

I have a healer main, and a tank secondary as well as some dps classes. I would prefer to get the pets and mounts on my healer, and have actually passed/sold rare raid mount drops on my tank before to let other people get what they were after so desperately. But hey, a little extra $$ from the goodie bags will go along ways for some ppl, that perpetually complain about being broke, to queue an extra time or two. And again, Blizz states that CtA is only in effect for the least represented role once queue times exceeed a threshhold amount. The bonus may not allways apply to tanks and may not always be in effect.

I do however like the idea of making the bags BoA and openable only by someone of that elvel or higher. (Rather than level 85 specifically as the blue post stated they were considering expanding this for lower levels as well.)
Never Pug a random Troll Heroic, always wait for the guild group.

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Hrobertgar - 85 Tank - human
Hrobernia - 85 Arcane - human
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

Postby Aerron » Fri Apr 08, 2011 7:46 am

A little more detail on Blizz's choice to make the bags BoA:

Dungeon Finder Call to Arms - Clarification
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Source)
We’ve been following discussions and reading feedback on the Dungeon Finder Call to Arms feature, and appreciate everyone’s opinions on the topic. We wanted to share a few items though that supplement the recent announcement:

The additional reward for completing the Dungeon Finder Call to Arms (called the Satchel of Exotic Mysteries) will be Bind on Account; able to be freely sent to other characters on your account once you receive it.

An error existed in the announcement regarding flasks and potions being picked based on your spec. This is not the case. If someone earns a Satchel of Exotic Mysteries, and if it rolls the random chance to provide a potion or flask, it will be a randomly selected. This helps ensure a broad array of available flasks and potions for all characters.

We also wanted to clarify, mounts that have a possibility to be found in a Satchel of Exotic Mysteries are found with the same rarity as if you had slain the dungeon boss that normally drops them.
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

Postby Dashdar » Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:12 am


It's still not tempting enough to make me solo queue instead of a guild run. I think it would be worth it is the pets/mounts would exclude the ones you have, and if it always came with an item that repaired your gear for free (with a despawn time limit if not used).

I also want to know how much gold. I might be able to make more farming for 45min than running a 5 man.

I still think it's just a blah system and doubt that BoA bags was even their original intention.
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

Postby theckhd » Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:15 am

Repost from the 4.1 thread:

Theck wrote:Channeling Knaughty for a second:

To those who say that this won't entice tanks to queue for LFD: you're wrong. It may not entice you, but luckily for blizzard not all tanks are you. Consider this anecdote.

A shaman in trade chat was offering 500g for a tank to run the daily heroic for him. Thirty minutes and one TotT later, I was 500g richer. He was also the highest DPS and did most of the marking/hexing (I rarely bother to mark in heroics, too used to running with guildmates that instinctively attack the right target), but the two pugs we got were both pretty low. The warrior apologized in advance and noted that he just hit 85 and barely qualified for heroics in the first place, and asked for feedback on how he was doing. He was very pleasant. The mage was OK, DPS was average but sheeping skills were lacking. He and the shaman were bickering back and forth for most of the run, but I forget what it was about (probably DPS or sheeping).

This is the first mostly-pug I've run in a few weeks. I really enjoy tanking on Theck, but I just have no incentive to do so. I don't need Valor Points, reputation, 5-man drops, or chaos orbs. I do on my Warlock (rep, anyway, and orbs), but I can't tank on her.

However, I do like gold, and to a lesser extent mounts. Yes, I have 300k gold and make 1-2k per day on the AH, but there's a limit to how much time you can convert to cash that way per day, at least with Ench/Engi. Plus, playing the AH is boring as shit. I like tanking, dammit. This isn't World of Accountingcraft, it's World of Warcraft. Which means "World of Smashing-things-in-the-face-with-my-shield-craft."

To make 500g outside of the AH, I could:
  1. Solo Magtheridon (until 4.1) - 500g for about 20-25 mins of time. Also sort of boring.
  2. Grind dailies - a few hundred gold for 30 minutes? Also sort of boring.
  3. Tank a random for someone - 500g+random daily gold+VP+I_get_to_smash_things_in_the_face_with_my_shield. Not boring.

Hell yes I'd take option #3 if it was there. I just did last night. If that was available to me through the dungeon finder at any time, I'd run a lot more randoms. 500g might be a bit more than they're offering, but they're also throwng in some gems/mounts/etc, and making them BoA so that I can send the Raven or Chocobo that I already have on Theck to an alt.

A superb tank controls the instance run. I have never been on a terrible pug run, because I don't let them be terrible.
  • Low DPS? No problem, it just makes me look better on recount.
  • Weak healer? No problem, I've got WoG, SoI, and enough cooldowns to freeze an elephant. Who needs a healer.
  • Crappy CC? Round 'em up and Consecrate. c.f. previous note on cooldowns.
  • DPS splitting targets? Taunt and be awesome enough to hold both of them. HoJ, alternating taunts, worst-case use BoP. I have guildies that do this on occasion because I don't bother to mark targets. But I never let them die, so I'll be damned if I'll let a random PuG DPS die to aggro.
  • DPS pulling the next pack for you? Doesn't happen, because I'm already on that shit. Healers get to drink before the first pull and before each boss, if they need more I'll go WoG mode.
Is this the case for most tanks? Maybe not, I get a bit of a thrill out of shit hitting the fan and saving the day. But its tanks like me that they want queuing for more randoms, and this is one good way to do it. Give me an incentive to do something I enjoy doing, and I'm damn well more likely to do it. Right now 5-mans lack those incentives for any tank that's already done with his Valor Point objectives.
"Theck, Bringer of Numbers and Pounding Headaches," courtesy of Grehn|Skipjack.
Simcraft 6.x, Call to Arms 6.0, Talent Spec & Glyph Guide 6.x, Blog: Sacred Duty
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Re: Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms

Postby Sabindeus » Fri Apr 08, 2011 8:22 am

sorry for not getting to this yesterday

http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com/ ... =viewtopic

Consolidate discussion please. I'd merge the topics but I think it would turn out looking rather schizophrenic and a lot of the same points have been made in both places.
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