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Any interest in a Heroic Raid CTC List?

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Any interest in a Heroic Raid CTC List?

Postby Cragwell » Thu Apr 07, 2011 3:30 pm

I am finding that as I am working through the heroics that CTC is becoming more important to me in the heroic tier. To the point that I am taking items like the Halfus DPS shoulders and considering them BiS because their CTC is greatest in the 372 ilvl category.

I have done some napkin math and came up with the following conversion rates:

Agi/304.508 = Dodge %
(Dodge or Parry Rating)/176.719 = Avoidance %
Mastery/79.68 = Block %
Strength/706.875 = Parry %

I would put together a spreadsheet and do a CTC BiS list if there is interest. I would also like my math double checked on those conversion rates. I do know that Dodge and Parry have diminishing returns, but I beleive it too complicated to try to incorporate those. To be able to do that one would have to know exactly what the gearout is for each one using the list.

Edit: Clarified subject as raid related. - Digren
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic CTC List?

Postby lythac » Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:15 am

Combat ratings can be found here - http://elitistjerks.com/f15/t29453-comb ... cataclysm/

Pre Kings -
Dodge 176.71899
Parry 176.71899
Agi 304.50762639
Mastery 79.68
Strength 706.87596
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic CTC List?

Postby Cragwell » Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:11 am

Which reminds me that I should probably weigh in Kings or MoTW as assumed. Doubt many raids are running without that covered. Anyway, that still doesn't indicate any interest :)
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic CTC List?

Postby Digren » Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:00 am

Due to the diminishing returns on dodge and parry, any given list is valid for one data point - someone wearing that list. I think what might work better for you is an ideal model for a heroic max-CTC set.

Take a look at the heroic farming gear set I made for heroic / stage three tanks:
http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com/ ... ic#p612214
http://chardev.org/?profile=53394

It's not block capped - just 88.3% or so CTC. If you can suggest improvements to this set that make it better for heroic farming - by pushing CTC higher without sacrificing anything needed for heroics - then I can update this set to match your recommendations. That might serve your purpose well while avoiding the changing value of dodge and parry.
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic CTC List?

Postby lythac » Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:13 am

Think he means Heroic Raid gear (372) rather than Heroic Dungeon (346-359).

The spreadsheet would need to do include DR, else no one would use it.
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic Raid CTC List?

Postby Awyndel » Sat Apr 16, 2011 4:09 am

Myself I use a ratio between CTC AND stamina. This is what I use to make my block cap set. Since health on it is fairly low, and avoidance is not really reliable in such a case. I use the gem/trinket slot costs to compare, because that is where i can switch some stamina back in when i'm overcapped.
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic Raid CTC List?

Postby Cragwell » Tue Apr 19, 2011 8:46 am

I am talking about 372 gear, yes.

Also its impossible to account for DR as you have to know every piece a character is using. While DR has an effect its generally a small one and (Mastery Rating)+(Dodge/Parry) pieces almost always win in the CTC comparison.

Actually an easy general guideline to follow is;

(Mastery + Dodge/Parry) > (Mastery + Hit/Exp) > (Mastery + Agility) > (Dodge + Parry)

I think that general rule is close to flawless in CTC for all 372 items. Trying to think of an exception.
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic Raid CTC List?

Postby lythac » Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:14 pm

Cragwell wrote:Also its impossible to account for DR as you have to know every piece a character is using. While DR has an effect its generally a small one and (Mastery Rating)+(Dodge/Parry) pieces almost always win in the CTC comparison.


For me currently I need 21.55% more parry rating compared to the undiminished figure (and my Parry is super low - 12.66%).

If you are doing this in a spreadsheet it is not too difficult to stick the formulae in and have editable cells for parry/dodge/mastery rating which can be read from charsheet/armory. Whilst 102.4% is only possible in near BiS you can take a simpler option and input *"typical" values for dodge(13.5%?)/parry(16.5%?) for someone reaching blockcap with current 372 gear.

Lastly how do you judge the BiS CTC gearset?

1) 102.4% CTC > increasing HP
2) 102.4% CTC > increasing avoidance

Whilst not too much of a concern for this tier of raiding (where very few sets will get you there) once we are able to **surpass 102.4% by a sizeable margin the option to increase HP or avoidance will become a choice.

* I have no idea what typical dodge/parry for those with 102.4%, looking through the 102.4% thread most only posted that they had reached it.
** Unknown if Deathwing Radiance will be introduced.
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Re: Any interest in a Heroic Raid CTC List?

Postby Awyndel » Wed Apr 20, 2011 12:24 pm

I just compare CTC to health on an item.

Mastery/agility outperforms mastery/threat by quite a bit btw, it's only slightly below master/avoid
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