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Heroic Valiona and Theralion 25

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Heroic Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby exiledknight » Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:30 am

Just wanted to see how everyone who has killed this has handled two things, currently 99% of our pulls we are essentially wiping around 40%, which coincides with the second valiona ground phase and the second blackout.
How many people are you sending to the twilight realm and when? Currently our sub rogue goes down and stays until he needs to pop and and clear, and then phases with the tank as soon as he hits 5. Other than that we are sending down a holy pally and lock, and a holy pally and mage, they are killing 3-4 adds before they come up(so at the point we are wiping they have killed 6-8 adds, plus whatever our rogue has killed).

I feel as if the dmg from rift blasts coupled with the blackout is what is causing the wipes, at the end of the night we set up a tranq rotation where our feral did his after the 3rd deep breath, a boomkin did theirs with a spriests hymn right after the 1st blackout, and we have our resto druid along with our other spriest doing the same after the second, however when the blackout comes off we lose, 5-6 people. We are already 7 healing it, thinking of switching to two tanks to kill a few more adds in the twilight realm to help lessen the dmg, and potentially just having those 3 blackouts run off by themselves and die. Any suggestions?
Last edited by exiledknight on Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby Brutalus » Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:13 am

I'd definately advise sending all the blackouts but the first two in the fight to just die, it just isn't worth risking more people at a point where the raid is taking a lot of damage anyway due to the rift blasts. I'd use two tanks as well to give yourselves a bit of breathing room for an entry when it's needed (leave one tank at 4 stacks ready to taunt). We send in:

1st inside phase: 1 spriest, 1 warlock, 1 holy paladin

2nd inside phase: 2x mage, 1 holy paladin

3rd inside phase: repeat of first

The rogues (we have 2) go in on the first and stay in forever - if they die or have to leave then they enter at the next convenient time. If we had more warlocks I'd probably send them in, the more you have to clear the inside out quickly the better, since the rift blasts are what makes and breaks the fight. We also have the two dks on backup in case someone can't go in because they're dead/too far away/still have stacks.
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby exiledknight » Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:03 am

Are you guys killing all the adds while the teams are in there or just a certain number? We were killing 3 per plus whatever the rogue could do alone, was thinking of doubling this number up, or should we push for even more than that?
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby Brutalus » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:13 pm

I'm not totally sure on that - we've killed almost all of them, unless one spawns really far away in some gimp location, by the time the casters leave on the first one. On the second one we don't usually get them all down and I can't be sure of the number we do, but I'd imagine it's 3-5, a bit less since they're moving from deep breaths and there's typically more up than at the beginning of fight.

We didn't put too much emphasis on killing them all - we just sent in whichever ranged dps we could who didn't continually die inside and hoped they'd kill as many as possible. At least in my opinion, the more you send in the better, as long as you're sure they're going to come out alive - don't risk them dying. The fight isn't really overly healing intensive as long as you're killing them off when you can and you aren't dealing with blackouts after the first phase.

In direct response to your question, it would probably be good to double it, and if you can and if you trust your dpsers to do that then go for it, but I would emphasize quantity of players being sent in rather than having one stay in for prolonged periods of time. In any case you can try it and see, but you should probably take a look at a try without blackout in later phases to better assess where your problems with the fight are now - overwhelmed by quantity of adds or quantity of dead inside-team.
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby exiledknight » Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:26 pm

Right now the issue is the number of adds, looking at the blackout dmg the second time valiona is on the ground its pretty much identical to the first time as is the twilight blast. The rift blast in that time frame causes the dmg incoming to skyrocket, most likely I will just add a second dps to each team, we already have 3 who have proved they wont die down there unless the healer screws up and I am extremely profcient at moving around in there quickly without ebing hit. Letting those blackouts die if GS and their own cds dont save them and lowering the rift blast dmg should make it a pretty quick kill tonight. Thanks for the help.
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby PsiVen » Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:29 pm

I think GS would only save a tank with every cooldown at once or a shadow priest with Dispersion; anyone else would take far more than 200% of their HP in damage. But the impact of letting 3 blackout targets die is likely to be lower than having to heal through the split blackout + twilight blast damage, especially if you can BR them.

(Title needs a 'Heroic' btw)
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby baff » Thu Mar 31, 2011 4:36 am

At some point, we just let the players with blackout go off to the side and die. I'm pretty sure its from the fourth blackout of the encounter. Also, our 2 rogues come up about 10 seconds before there are 5 stacks on tank even if they aren't close to dying, and go down again. We only send other players (other than the rogues) down once, during the first transition phase.
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby exiledknight » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:20 am

PsiVen wrote:I think GS would only save a tank with every cooldown at once or a shadow priest with Dispersion; anyone else would take far more than 200% of their HP in damage. But the impact of letting 3 blackout targets die is likely to be lower than having to heal through the split blackout + twilight blast damage, especially if you can BR them.

(Title needs a 'Heroic' btw)


Yeah the tooltip on was wrong when I looked it up on wowhead(or I looked at the wrong one)but you are correct in that only a Shadow priest with Dispersion could live. Fixed the title as well thought for sure I had it in there.
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Re: Valiona and Theralion 25

Postby Meloree » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:17 am

exiledknight wrote:
PsiVen wrote:I think GS would only save a tank with every cooldown at once or a shadow priest with Dispersion; anyone else would take far more than 200% of their HP in damage. But the impact of letting 3 blackout targets die is likely to be lower than having to heal through the split blackout + twilight blast damage, especially if you can BR them.

(Title needs a 'Heroic' btw)


Yeah the tooltip on was wrong when I looked it up on wowhead(or I looked at the wrong one)but you are correct in that only a Shadow priest with Dispersion could live. Fixed the title as well thought for sure I had it in there.


Pre-nerfs, we still only had one rogue in raid, so we ended up doing this:
1st group goes down with dazzling flames, consists of Rogue, SP, Warlock, Boomkin, Holy Paladin - the multidotters just throw up as many dots as they can in a few seconds, and then head out, while the rogue stays and kills as much as he can.
2nd group goes down with tank 5-stack (offset by 3, due to use of bubble) - Fury warrior, ret paladin, holy priest. They kill as many as they can (normally fully caught up on adds by the end of this).
3rd group takes next tank 5-stack - Rogue again, SP, Warlock, Warlock, Resto Druid - same as the first time, just hurt everything, let the rogue kill as much as can be killed.
4th group is first group, they go with the dazzlings.

We still do that now, post-nerf, although it's total overkill.
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