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DPS For Heroics

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DPS For Heroics

Postby Flex » Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:07 am

What should DPS classes be doing before moving into heroics? Or is "Run normals until there's nothing left for you in them." a good rule?
We live in a society where people born on third base constantly try to steal second, yet we expect people born with two strikes against them to hit a homerun on the first pitch.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Nikachelle » Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:15 am

You want a rough damage per second estimate?
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Flex » Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:16 am

Nikachelle wrote:You want a rough damage per second estimate?


Prtty much.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Nikachelle » Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:19 am

I don't normally look at boss fights, since I leave Recount on for total damage done. But my dps whom I've been running heroics with for the past week or so are all over 9k, closer to 10k, with a lock coming in around 13k because he abuses hellfire.

With bosses, it's hard to judge since there's a lot of "go kill adds" in this expansion, but they're roughly around 15k, maybe a bit over, on a Patchwerk type boss.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Belloc » Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:23 am

6k dps in heroics is bare minimum and won't be enough for most bosses. Healers will be seriously strained by the end of the fight (which will usually be a wipe).
8k dps is a decent spot to be in for most bosses.
10k+ higher is good dps.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Flex » Wed Dec 15, 2010 10:25 am

aight, our DPS who are DPS main spec are at or close to that, I think our lowest is a hunter who feels he shouldn't be doing heroics and pulls about 8K.

Current issue is woo small guild getting everyone on at once. Apparently one of the shamans has the dirtiest house ever.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby d503 » Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:35 am

Flex wrote:aight, our DPS who are DPS main spec are at or close to that, I think our lowest is a hunter who feels he shouldn't be doing heroics and pulls about 8K.

Current issue is woo small guild getting everyone on at once. Apparently one of the shamans has the dirtiest house ever.


A big change our hunter did spec Survival and reforge all crit. He went from 8k to 12k really quickly.

IMO, weak DPS so far are:

Shadow Priest
Mage (mana constraints)

It could be that we just have shitty mages, but I haven't seen one of them pull 10k yet.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Nikachelle » Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:49 am

d503 wrote:IMO, weak DPS so far are:


Mage (mana constraints)

It could be that we just have shitty mages, but I haven't seen one of them pull 10k yet.

I think it's your players not their class. The two mages I run with on a regular basis are never below 11k on a boss fight. If EVEN that low.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Invisusira » Wed Dec 15, 2010 11:54 am

d503 wrote:It could be that we just have shitty mages, but I haven't seen one of them pull 10k yet.

Are they arcane? That's the only spec I've really seen mana issues with. But arcane is pretty much all ABOUT managing your mana perfectly now. A lot of *ahem* simpletons *ahem* pick arcane because lolarcane blast spam wins the dps charts... until they go oom 10 seconds into the fight.

If they're having mana issues, try frost. It's the least mana intense of the specs, and atm there's no "holy shit damage" spec that significantly trumps the other two.

Something else to note - all three specs work differently than they did pre-4.0. So if your mages are still using their Wrath rotations, they're doing it wrong.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Flex » Wed Dec 15, 2010 12:35 pm

d503 wrote:
Flex wrote:aight, our DPS who are DPS main spec are at or close to that, I think our lowest is a hunter who feels he shouldn't be doing heroics and pulls about 8K.

Current issue is woo small guild getting everyone on at once. Apparently one of the shamans has the dirtiest house ever.


A big change our hunter did spec Survival and reforge all crit. He went from 8k to 12k really quickly.


One hunter is survival and hit 14K on the first boss in normal GB. Another is Marks and flirts around 8K on bosses but needs some pimpin'.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby claisa » Thu Dec 16, 2010 3:04 am

i believe survival is the current highest dps spec of all dps classes at the mo. Our mage who is a goddamn pro player with his spec has demonstrated that arcane is now pointless. The nerf bat after 4.0 sillyness of arcane has definitly come into effect for it leveling to 85.

Burst dps seems very important for the multiple add rushes that appear. Being able to switch to correct target super quick is of high important. Being able to nuke adds down in seconds before they grow in health makes fights a lot easier.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby econ21 » Thu Dec 16, 2010 3:33 am

As a casual player who has only run one heroic so far, I asked one of the better players in our guild what was the standard for dps in heroics and he said it had not notceably increased over Wotlk, languishing at around 5k. I found it very hard to understand given the gear upgrades (e.g. higher base weapond dps), but I guess ratings have dived as people level.

Mind you, 5k dps was at the top end of wotlk heroic PUGs I ran, with 2.5k being more like the average.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Hokahey » Thu Dec 16, 2010 3:44 am

econ21 wrote:As a casual player who has only run one heroic so far, I asked one of the better players in our guild what was the standard for dps in heroics and he said it had not notceably increased over Wotlk, languishing at around 5k. I found it very hard to understand given the gear upgrades (e.g. higher base weapond dps), but I guess ratings have dived as people level.

Mind you, 5k dps was at the top end of wotlk heroic PUGs I ran, with 2.5k being more like the average.


:shock:

You should definitely be expecting substantially higher than 5k DPS from anyone in a Cataclysm Heroic.
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Worldie » Thu Dec 16, 2010 5:03 am

Nikachelle wrote:You want a rough damage per second estimate?


From personal experience, i noticed that you must be looking for about 35-40k party dps (including tank) in order to defeat most soft-enrage mechanics (which does include healer's mana).
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Re: DPS For Heroics

Postby Belloc » Thu Dec 16, 2010 10:00 am

econ21 wrote:As a casual player who has only run one heroic so far, I asked one of the better players in our guild what was the standard for dps in heroics and he said it had not notceably increased over Wotlk, languishing at around 5k. I found it very hard to understand given the gear upgrades (e.g. higher base weapond dps), but I guess ratings have dived as people level.

Mind you, 5k dps was at the top end of wotlk heroic PUGs I ran, with 2.5k being more like the average.

The player you asked was 100% incorrect. I was putting out at least 8k in my first heroic (almost certainly more on bosses). It has only gone up since then. The other people I'm playing with are putting out comparable DPS, so it's not just warlocks.

By the time you've done a few random heroics, 10k should be easily possible.
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