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Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

SPOILERS Discussion about the Cataclysm Beta SPOILERS

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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:22 pm

If HotR stays at 8 secs like in the beta, might as well not use HotR at all if using HotR prevents you from using CS for the next 8 secs since both share a cooldown. It makes more sense to tab-CS.
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Sabindeus » Tue Aug 03, 2010 1:23 pm

Klaudandus wrote:If HotR stays at 8 secs like in the beta, might as well not use HotR at all if using HotR prevents you from using CS for the next 8 secs since both share a cooldown. It makes more sense to tab-CS.

I doubt that would happen.
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:05 pm

Sabindeus wrote:
Klaudandus wrote:If HotR stays at 8 secs like in the beta, might as well not use HotR at all if using HotR prevents you from using CS for the next 8 secs since both share a cooldown. It makes more sense to tab-CS.

I doubt that would happen.


If that doesn't happen, then we would be switching a CS with a HotR even on single targets every time its off the cooldown since HotR hits harder than CS at this stage (don't know yet the exact numbers in cata)
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Minarva » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:12 pm

You can guarantee that in this current direction CS will hit harder than Hammer on a single target. How this deviates from "really Shield and Hammer just seem to be single-target and multitarget versions of the same ability, especially without block scaling", especially with holy power on Hammer puzzles me, but still...

P.S credit to Tippo for running the numbers on a spreadsheet. I forgot to credit you when I posted on the official forums, but your quick work was awesome.
Last edited by Minarva on Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:15 pm

Minarva wrote:You can guarantee that in this current direction CS will hit harder than Hammer on a single target.

P.S credit to Tippo for running the numbers on a spreadsheet. I forgot to credit you when I posted on the official forums, but your quick work was awesome.


Interesting, Now I'm even more curious
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Minarva » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:16 pm

GC posted:

Hammer of the Righteous -- Now generates Holy Power but shares a cooldown with Crusader Strike. Almost all talents that affect one or the other will affect both. The intention is you use Crusader Strike -> Shield of the Righteous for single target and Hammer of the Righteous -> Shield of the Righteous for multitarget.

So without CS hitting harder on a single target this will never happen.
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Shathus » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:31 pm

What about something that mimics Saurfang's Blood Power (or points... whatever), so the more you have, the more damage/healing you do with all abilities. I'm not sure specifics of an implementation, but like now, some abilities generate HoPo, others consume it so spending the whole fight at max HoPo would be an overall lose since you'd be neglecting important spells, but just in general, you get the feeling of 'charging' up and releasing that energy (bonus points if we glowed at max HoPo). Perhaps we'd have to stack higher than 3 for this to really work right, but to me it's the same concept, just a little cleaner as you're not trying to force abilities on people?

You want Holy Power because it makes everything you do better, but you have to use it (auto-attacking + non HoPo consuming abilities aren't as good over the fight if you try to store it the whole time), but especially for ret and holy, you COULD save it for an extra GCD or two if something you know about to happen (add spawn, BIG_NUKE_OF_DOOM, etc) and that extra damage/healing would be beneficial.

For prot, perhaps the higher your HoPo is, it still raises your block% or mitigation or something, so if you have a big threat lead, you can choose to skip using some power for a couple attacks and have higher mitigation chances until your dps catch up and then burn the remaining power to have your abilities hit harder and get a bigger lead.

It all made sense in my head, dunno if it got conveyed and I'm sure there are some holes in the idea, but... thoughts?
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby holythief » Tue Aug 03, 2010 6:07 pm

Shathus wrote:What about something that mimics Saurfang's Blood Power (or points... whatever), so the more you have, the more damage/healing you do with all abilities. I'm not sure specifics of an implementation, but like now, some abilities generate HoPo, others consume it so spending the whole fight at max HoPo would be an overall lose since you'd be neglecting important spells, but just in general, you get the feeling of 'charging' up and releasing that energy (bonus points if we glowed at max HoPo). Perhaps we'd have to stack higher than 3 for this to really work right, but to me it's the same concept, just a little cleaner as you're not trying to force abilities on people?

You want Holy Power because it makes everything you do better, but you have to use it (auto-attacking + non HoPo consuming abilities aren't as good over the fight if you try to store it the whole time), but especially for ret and holy, you COULD save it for an extra GCD or two if something you know about to happen (add spawn, BIG_NUKE_OF_DOOM, etc) and that extra damage/healing would be beneficial.

For prot, perhaps the higher your HoPo is, it still raises your block% or mitigation or something, so if you have a big threat lead, you can choose to skip using some power for a couple attacks and have higher mitigation chances until your dps catch up and then burn the remaining power to have your abilities hit harder and get a bigger lead.

It all made sense in my head, dunno if it got conveyed and I'm sure there are some holes in the idea, but... thoughts?


This sounds to similar to DK's runic power for them to consider it for paladins, interesting twist for DK's though?
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby Sharlos » Tue Aug 03, 2010 9:24 pm

Keeping Holy Shield and Inquisition exclusive wouldn't be particularly difficult. Just make the Holy Shield buff not come up if inquisition is active.
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Re: Shield of Righteousness possibly going away

Postby d503 » Wed Aug 04, 2010 10:15 am

Minarva wrote:You can guarantee that in this current direction CS will hit harder than Hammer on a single target. How this deviates from "really Shield and Hammer just seem to be single-target and multitarget versions of the same ability, especially without block scaling", especially with holy power on Hammer puzzles me, but still...

P.S credit to Tippo for running the numbers on a spreadsheet. I forgot to credit you when I posted on the official forums, but your quick work was awesome.


Hahaha, no need ;) I saw my crappy math and was amazed that it was quoted...just proves that I should be doing more work at work, and less excel spreadsheet tomfoolery ;)

Thanks for the shoutout.
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