Comprehensive List of Boss Parry Haste (v4.0.3)

Warning: Theorycraft inside.

Moderators: Fridmarr, Worldie, Aergis, theckhd

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Racolus » Thu Mar 18, 2010 9:50 pm

Well, a warrior I pugged with lastnight in ICC25 claimed that expertise is very important again as he got 'parry-hasted' like hell in H10ICC.

I really doubt if it is true, and I said they should have been disabled. You felt being beat the crap out you because they hit harder.

Can anyone confirm this table still true in heroic mode?
Racolus
 
Posts: 91
Joined: Sat May 31, 2008 5:09 pm

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Rhiannon » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:17 pm

Looking at Halion logs from tonight, strongly suspect he parry hastes:

[23:16:45.094] Halion hits Rhia Parry
[23:16:45.471] Rhia hits Halion Parry
[23:16:46.043] Halion hits Rhia 15777

[23:17:41.344] Halion hits Rhia Parry
[23:17:41.453] Argonion Eviscerate Halion Parry
[23:17:41.994] Rhia hits Halion Parry
[23:17:42.338] Halion hits Rhia Parry

[23:17:59.111] Halion hits Rhia 21835 (B: 2038)
[23:18:00.464] Rhia hits Halion Parry
[23:18:00.784] Halion hits Rhia 27103 (B: 2038)

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-l ... eave%22%29 if you'd like to have a look through yourself.

Edit: ignore last example, parry occurs too late in the swing to affect it anyway really, another example instead:

[23:19:08.013] Halion hits Rhia 23118
[23:19:08.196] Argonion hits Halion Parry
[23:19:08.972] Vashti Blood-Caked Strike Halion Parry
[23:19:09.062] Halion hits Rhia Dodge
Last edited by Rhiannon on Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Rhiannon
 
Posts: 1061
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 8:17 am

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Wrathy » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:27 pm

Rhiannon wrote:Looking at Halion logs from tonight, strongly suspect he parry hastes:

[23:16:45.094] Halion hits Rhia Parry
[23:16:45.471] Rhia hits Halion Parry
[23:16:46.043] Halion hits Rhia 15777

[23:17:41.344] Halion hits Rhia Parry
[23:17:41.453] Argonion Eviscerate Halion Parry
[23:17:41.994] Rhia hits Halion Parry
[23:17:42.338] Halion hits Rhia Parry

[23:17:59.111] Halion hits Rhia 21835 (B: 2038)
[23:18:00.464] Rhia hits Halion Parry
[23:18:00.784] Halion hits Rhia 27103 (B: 2038)


Thats definitely to be expected with the prominent burst damage being magical, but thanks for the confirmation!
Dakiros wrote:Hear that sound? Its Wrathy breaking Wowhead and Wordpress while he quickly comes up with the Rival set.

Avenging Wrathy - A Protection Paladin Blog
Wrathy's Guide to Gear Sets

Image
Wrathy
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 548
Joined: Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:17 pm

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Rhiannon » Wed Jun 30, 2010 8:31 pm

Eh, the breath isn't really particularly scary. More getting pummelled by 30k hits (some of those I pasted were with cds running) at 1 second intervals while healers are dancing around in a circle. Breaths are actually a bit of a break.
Rhiannon
 
Posts: 1061
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 8:17 am

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Xanthoren » Wed Jul 14, 2010 9:18 pm

Here is what really scares me about halion's parries:

[00:02:35.348] Halion hits Xanthoren Dodge
[00:02:36.693] Xanthoren Blood Corruption Halion Parry
[00:02:36.789] Halion hits Xanthoren Parry
Xanthoren
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:59 pm

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Rhiannon » Wed Jul 14, 2010 10:20 pm

It's been known for a long time that the DoT application/refresh that occurs with each swing when you have seal of vengeance also has to go through its own roll on the melee hit table to determine if it connects or not. See this thread for more.
Rhiannon
 
Posts: 1061
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 8:17 am

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby cryst » Fri Jul 16, 2010 4:01 pm

Rhiannon wrote:Eh, the breath isn't really particularly scary. More getting pummelled by 30k hits (some of those I pasted were with cds running) at 1 second intervals while healers are dancing around in a circle. Breaths are actually a bit of a break.


Following conventional parry-haste mechanics, as I understand them:
If the next attack would normally occur within 20% of your weapon speed after the parry, there is no effect.
If the next attack would normally occur between 20% and 60% of your weapon speed later, it happens 20% of your weapon speed later instead.
If the next attack would normally occur more than 60% of your weapon speed later, the time until your next attack is reduced by 40% of your weapon speed.

Has this changed since I last looked?

Assuming it hasn't, with Halion's debuffed swing speed at ~1.8s, the fastest his next swing can come is 1.8-(1.8*0.4)= 1.08s later. But then, this happened:

Code: Select all
[21:30:18.431] Halion hits Tank 38575
[21:30:18.494] Rogue Mutilate Halion Parry
[21:30:18.666] Rogue hits Halion Parry
[21:30:18.822] Halion hits Tank 8309 (O: 31272)
[21:30:19.525] Tank dies

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/b3ij ... 821&e=8835

0.391s between consecutive swings. Do multiple parries stack parry-haste effects? The autoattack registers too late to have any effect anyway, no? Or is that just some hiccup from latency and combat log entries not catching up to actual events?
cryst
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 53
Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 12:13 am

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Xenix » Fri Jul 16, 2010 4:24 pm

Yeah, the first parry pushes it to 60% and the next one pushes it to 20% since it's now below 60%.

Swing timer = 100% of base speed
----- Parry 1 (say ~S/T=90%): Swing timer reduced by 40% (rule 3 that you posted)
Swing timer ~ 50% of base speed
----- Parry 2 (say ~S/T=40%): Swing timer reduced to 20% (rule 2 that you posted)
Swing timer = 20% of base speed

Any further parry-hastes wouldn't do a thing until he hit you. (rule 1 that you posted)
Kimurellia - Holy/Protection Paladin - Scions of Destiny - Eredar-US
User avatar
Xenix
 
Posts: 244
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:56 am

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Starscythe » Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:25 pm

Question about Sindy:

anyone have issues with sindy's parry-haste besides us? our guild had to make our pally tank build up a specific "expertise set" just for sindy because he would get gibbed randomly. (my prot warrior alt was a sad panda when H put 10 finally dropped the expertise sword...)


Question about Halion:

Does he parry-haste?
DK: like a pally, but better in every way.
Starscythe
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:08 pm

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby theckhd » Thu Jul 29, 2010 6:27 pm

Starscythe wrote:Question about Halion:

Does he parry-haste?

I believe so, yes.
"Theck, Bringer of Numbers and Pounding Headaches," courtesy of Grehn|Skipjack.
MATLAB 5.x, Simcraft 6.x, Call to Arms 6.0, Talent Spec & Glyph Guide 5.x, Blog: Sacred Duty
User avatar
theckhd
Moderator
 
Posts: 7806
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:06 pm
Location: Harrisburg, PA

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Rhiannon » Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:17 pm

He could have just read a whole two posts up >_<.
Rhiannon
 
Posts: 1061
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 8:17 am

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Mert » Wed Aug 04, 2010 5:58 pm

As others have mentioned, I'm pretty sure Halion has parryhaste enabled. However, I suspect he may get a Gormok-style nerf at some point in the future (in the Shadow realm at least) because, on Heroic, the angle between the oncoming cutter and the cutoff point for what the game considers to be the back of Halion is extremely accute and wiping to the Shadow tank being pretty much insta-gibbed is not really a lot of fun.

I wouldn't necessarily bank on it, what with so much going on with the beta and all but I wouldn't be surprised if they turn it off a little further down the line.
User avatar
Mert
 
Posts: 217
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 8:38 pm

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby Mert » Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:39 pm

NOTE: I'd like to offer some advice to Starscythe on the Sindragosa fight but it has ended up being a little off-topic for this thread. Perhaps a moderator could split this topic so we can continue the discussion in the T10 subforum? Otherwise, sincere apologies for wandering off-topic but I'd like to help if I can.

Starscythe wrote:anyone have issues with sindy's parry-haste besides us? our guild had to make our pally tank build up a specific "expertise set" just for sindy because he would get gibbed randomly. (my prot warrior alt was a sad panda when H put 10 finally dropped the expertise sword...)


I've not found it to be a problem during phase one as the damage is fairly predictable and it's pretty static so the melee are able to position themselves effectively and, aside from the occasional Instability affecting two tank healers at once, you're pretty much at your full healing capacity too.

Where it certainly does become a problem is in phase three - the amount of damage here can be quite intense and spiky and, with half your healers generally out of line of sight, it definitely rewards strong co-ordination. However, threat is generally not a problem my the time you're that far into the fight. Therefore, rather than build a specific Expertise set, I just use a slightly reduced rotation with a couple of simple macros. Generally it goes something like this:

Code: Select all
10 Hand of Reckoning
20 Avenger's Shield
30 Holy Shield
40 Judgement
50 Consecration
60 Chill out a bit, maybe throw in a Saronite Bomb if you're feeling fruity
70 GOTO 30


Anything that would normally cause you to start autoswinging has a "/cast Spellname; /stopattack" macro. The only other real consideration then is to ensure Judgements of the Just and Vindication (or equivalents) are kept up by other raid members. The Attack Power debuff can be provided by Vindication (Prot/Ret Paladins), Curse of Weakness (Affliction Warlocks), Demo Roar (Bears) and Demo Shout (Warriors) and the Melee Haste reduction can be provided by Judgements of the Just (Prot Paladins), Icy Touch (Death Knights), Thunderclap (Prot/Arms Warriors; Fury would have to stance-dance to use it) and Infected Wounds (Feral Druids).

One thing to consider is that while you're tanking, it's very likely that the other tank is busy clearing their stacks or running so bear in mind when considering whether your raid setup contains the right classes. Also bear in mind that not all instances of the debuff are created equal but as long as it's there in some form you shouldn't need to min/max it - besides, if you do proc Vindication it'll overwrite a weaker AP debuff anyway as they don't stack. We use a Ret Paladin spec'd into Vindication and an Unholy DPS Death Knight using Icy Touch as part of his regular rotation.


So, to reiterate - use Phase 1 to build early threat. Keep Tricks and MD on the tank as much as you can, have the MT use the relative safety of this phase to pop damage-increasing talents like Wings and get Salvs on anyone who's creeping up threat-wise once she gets to ~45% health or so. Then have your tanks make a specific low-threat/no parryable attacks rotation with /stopattack macros on anything that'd normally cause an autoswing. Unfortunately Warriors and Druids have a slightly harder time of this than Paladins and Death Knights in removing their parryable output but if they've done their job and built enough threat in the early stages, it should be achievable by any of them.

This allows them to not have to gimp their survival stats by using lower iLevel gear without fear of being Sindygibbed. Hope this helps :)
User avatar
Mert
 
Posts: 217
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 8:38 pm

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby mclem » Fri Oct 15, 2010 5:34 am

I'm seeing something that looks for all the world like parry haste is back on *Ignis*, of all enemies:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-m ... 413&e=5609

Code: Select all
[20:38:29.338] Athara hits Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:29.637] Aaryki Heroic Strike Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:29.990] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 21143 (O: -1, A: 672)
[20:38:30.427] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 20402 (O: -1)
[20:38:30.758] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 6640 (O: 3108, B: 4178)
[20:38:31.459] Aaryki dies


I think the actual *death* is due to the healers not being comfortable with their new systems, but ignoring that; is that a Parry-haste? I don't recall Ignis hitting that rapidly in the past.

(Also, I'm not seeing any Strength of the Creator buffs on him, strangely; I'm wondering if older content is a bit bugridden, because it really does feel like we're getting pounded right now.)
mclem
 
Posts: 447
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2007 6:12 pm

Re: Comprehensive List of Bosses With Parry Haste Enabled (v2.0)

Postby theckhd » Fri Oct 15, 2010 6:36 am

Just isolating his hits on you and his parries:


[20:38:26.639] Loranas Blood Strike Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:26.720] Edêa Aftermath Ignis the Furnace Master Immune
[20:38:26.897] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 15815 (O: -1, A: 1060)
[20:38:26.989] Zli Templar's Verdict Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:28.430] Loranas Blood Strike Ignis the Furnace Master Dodge
[20:38:28.855] Mirror Image Frostbolt Ignis the Furnace Master Miss
[20:38:29.049] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Miss
[20:38:29.338] Athara hits Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:29.637] Aaryki Heroic Strike Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:29.990] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 21143 (O: -1, A: 672)
[20:38:30.427] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 20402 (O: -1)
[20:38:30.758] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 6640 (O: 3108, B: 4178)

Looking at the rest of the log, his swing speed seems to be between 1.8 and 2.0 when he's not getting parry-hasted, but there are other instances where he seems to be hasted without a parry, and instances where he parries but isn't hasted:


[20:38:08.599] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Dodge
[20:38:10.601] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Dodge
[20:38:11.240] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Dodge
[20:38:11.489] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 19265 (O: -1, A: 392)

[20:38:11.802] Zli Seals of Command Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:12.318] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 14145 (O: -1)
[20:38:13.221] Aaryki hits Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:13.614] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 11702 (O: -1, A: 391, B: 5183)
[20:38:13.845] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 17085 (O: -1)

[20:38:14.291] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Dodge
[20:38:18.175] Ignis the Furnace Master Flame Jets Aaryki Resist
[20:38:20.118] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Miss
[20:38:20.227] Zli Seals of Command Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:22.135] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Dodge
[20:38:22.253] Zli Seals of Command Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:22.672] Zli Seals of Command Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:24.075] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki Dodge

[20:38:25.835] Athara hits Ignis the Furnace Master Dodge
[20:38:25.864] Zli Seals of Command Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:25.923] Aaryki Revenge Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:26.079] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 16140 (O: -1, A: 1060)
[20:38:26.319] Greeanmage Arcane Blast Ignis the Furnace Master Miss
[20:38:26.639] Loranas Blood Strike Ignis the Furnace Master Parry
[20:38:26.897] Ignis the Furnace Master hits Aaryki 15815 (O: -1, A: 1060)
[20:38:26.989] Zli Templar's Verdict Ignis the Furnace Master Parry

It's tough to say, this could be combat log latency at work. The first four swings of that section are pretty suspicious. 2 seconds between the first two dodges, but 0.6 and 0.2 seconds between the next two swings.
"Theck, Bringer of Numbers and Pounding Headaches," courtesy of Grehn|Skipjack.
MATLAB 5.x, Simcraft 6.x, Call to Arms 6.0, Talent Spec & Glyph Guide 5.x, Blog: Sacred Duty
User avatar
theckhd
Moderator
 
Posts: 7806
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 3:06 pm
Location: Harrisburg, PA

PreviousNext

Return to Advanced Theorycraft and Calculations

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Who is online

In total there is 1 user online :: 0 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 380 on Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:28 pm

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest