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Threat Sucks

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Apr 15, 2010 9:38 am

Dear Maintankadin Gurus,

So the dude I tank with is a warrior. Here's his Armory: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... eliriously
And here's my armory: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... =Sabindeus

He consistantly generates like, 10-15% more TPS than I do in both 10 and 25 mans. This is without any sort of MD/ToT going on. I even made a DK respec in ICC10 last night because I wanted the 13% magic buff. So he lost Icy Talons and I gained Ebon Plaguebringer and he STILL outthreatted me.

Furthermore, I find that our feral druids can catch up to me, coming within 90% on omen, and sometimes pulling aggro if they get lucky, even on pure tank and spanks. Here's a druid's armory: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... &n=Darsong

Also here's some WoL parse: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/f1hs2lz0a41o52gw/

What am I doing wrong? Yes, I know how to 969. Are warriors just straight up better now or am I doing something horribly wrong and not realizing it?


Your pal,
Sabin
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby theckhd » Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:22 am

Rotation looks fine, at least from a brief perusal of your Festergut parse. You can check ability usage yourself with the expression editor and this syntax:
Code: Select all
sourcename="Sabindeus" and spell in ("Hammer of the Righteous", "Judgement of Vengeance", "Shield of Righteousness", "Avenger's Shield", "Holy Shield", "Consecration")

I compared it to this parse of my own, and I don't see any serious discrepancies as far as ability breakdown (mostly looking at Saurfang). The one thing I did notice is that you don't seem to have a big DPS ramp on Festergut to correspond to the stacks (compare to my parse to see what I mean). I'm not sure why that is though (were you not taking 9 stacks?).

Spec is fine threat-wise. The only other thing you could do to your spec to increase threat is pick up points in Reckoning, but that seems like an extreme solution.

There doesn't seem to be anything special about your prot warrior, as far as I can tell from that parse (assuming he's the one you're talking about). He seems to be roughly equivalent to you as far as DPS output goes, though it obviously varies fight to fight a bit.

Do you happen to have a 2.6-speed DPS weapon you could swap in? An accuracy-enchanted Gutbuster (esp. the heroic version) would give you a huge DPS/TPS boost.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Marblehead » Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:29 am

Leaving aside the fact that warriors got a significant threat boost some weeks ago, after looking at the logs, I will take a wild guess and say latency or frame rate. There aren't any big differences in gear that would imply a tps advantage.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby lythac » Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:39 am

Sabindeus wrote:Also here's some WoL parse: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/f1hs2lz0a41o52gw/

What am I doing wrong? Yes, I know how to 969. Are warriors just straight up better now or am I doing something horribly wrong and not realizing it?


You are aware for DBS you had Vigilance on for some fights and off on others?

Try 4 73% uptime
Try 6 92% Uptime
Try 7 100% Uptime
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Marblehead » Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:42 am

That's why I have macroed HS as following:

#showtooltip Holy Shield
/cast Holy Shield
/cancelaura Vigilance

:twisted:
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Nikachelle » Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:47 am

Marblehead wrote:That's why I have macroed HS as following:

#showtooltip Holy Shield
/cast Holy Shield
/cancelaura Vigilance

:twisted:

I might have to do that.

Sab... I've tanked with Delirously in a VOA run, and aside from the insane threat (which I attributed to a few things... namely MD, ToT and his superior gear), I'm pretty positive that that was the run I commented to Invis that the warrior was putting Vigilance on me. I had to keep clicking it off. I'm not POSITIVE it was Deliriously, but I think it might've been him.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Apr 15, 2010 11:08 am

I usually notice when he has Vigilance on me. I'm not talking about those instances, often we use Vigilance to minimize catastrophe in Taunt fights like LDW and Saurfang and Festergut. I'm not really concerned about those. But when he pulls off me on Marrowgar when I don't have Vigilance it makes me raaaaaaaaaaage but unlike a warrior I can't convert rage to threat.

Theck: Yeah I have a heroic gutbuster, but I put Zerking on it for lols trash/heroics. Maybe I should consider swapping the enchant so it becomes less risky for tanking actual bosses.

I think I also need to make a TJH rule for him receiving Misdirects to make sure he's not bribing the hunters.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Apr 15, 2010 11:21 am

Marblehead wrote:Leaving aside the fact that warriors got a significant threat boost some weeks ago, after looking at the logs, I will take a wild guess and say latency or frame rate. There aren't any big differences in gear that would imply a tps advantage.


I know my FPS is better than his. Latency is of course a crapshoot.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby theckhd » Thu Apr 15, 2010 11:38 am

Sabindeus wrote:Theck: Yeah I have a heroic gutbuster, but I put Zerking on it for lols trash/heroics. Maybe I should consider swapping the enchant so it becomes less risky for tanking actual bosses.

You might be able to get away with just using the zerking weapon. :P

I've done it on a few fights where the healers looked bored.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Meloree » Thu Apr 15, 2010 12:38 pm

Warriors produce stupid TPS right now. So do DKs. We're not on top anymore. That's life.

So long as you're not threatcapping DPS, it's a total nonissue. Tank DPS is pretty close to in-line, and that's really the important part, in my opinion.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Deliriously » Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:36 pm

Sup guys?
Sabin Alphius wouldn't take the 500g I offered him for MD :(


But hmm what I do to generate threat is spam devastate and heroic strike. Then I hit shield wall, Revenge, and Shockwave when they're off cooldown.

Really I don't find myself close to you unless it is a fight where you and I are both taking constant damage and it allows me to have unlimited rage. Even then I think it's just me getting lucky crits or me using some OP warrior tricks. We usually pull about the same TPS.

And then the deal with our ferals, they're just really good. I don't think they use cower since that's a lolz GCD missed no moar dps. And we know darsong is all about the dps.

all in all...warriors are fine l2p :P
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby fuzzygeek » Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:53 pm

I think it's the typical Blizzard Tuning hamhandedness. Warrior DPS and TPS too low. So buff them both. DPS now inline. Wait, increased DPS also buffed the buffed TPS? Whups.

They've had a tendency to double-address problems since 1.x (hey let's put all warrior abilities on the same 30m CD AND put a big DON'T HIT ME I AM SPIKY sign on retaliate AND put a cap on charges!).

That being said, if it's inline, great. If it's way out of line, I'm sure they'll address it eventually. There's no question prot warrior dps was sucking hind teat for a very long time.
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby blakk » Thu Apr 15, 2010 2:59 pm

Deliriously wrote:Sup guys?
Sabin Alphius wouldn't take the 500g I offered him for MD :(


But hmm what I do to generate threat is spam devastate and heroic strike. Then I hit shield wall, Revenge, and Shockwave when they're off cooldown.

Really I don't find myself close to you unless it is a fight where you and I are both taking constant damage and it allows me to have unlimited rage. Even then I think it's just me getting lucky crits or me using some OP warrior tricks. We usually pull about the same TPS.

And then the deal with our ferals, they're just really good. I don't think they use cower since that's a lolz GCD missed no moar dps. And we know darsong is all about the dps.

all in all...warriors are fine l2p :P

cower does not lower enough threat. it's lolable with how little it lowers. it's like 1100 threat...........
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:06 pm

Deliriously wrote:Sup guys?
Sabin Alphius wouldn't take the 500g I offered him for MD :(


But hmm what I do to generate threat is spam devastate and heroic strike. Then I hit shield wall, Revenge, and Shockwave when they're off cooldown.

Really I don't find myself close to you unless it is a fight where you and I are both taking constant damage and it allows me to have unlimited rage. Even then I think it's just me getting lucky crits or me using some OP warrior tricks. We usually pull about the same TPS.

And then the deal with our ferals, they're just really good. I don't think they use cower since that's a lolz GCD missed no moar dps. And we know darsong is all about the dps.

all in all...warriors are fine l2p :P


noooooooo he followed me here! :(
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Re: Threat Sucks

Postby Deliriously » Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:28 pm

I'm jacking your threads almost as much as I jack your threat hahaha
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