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[DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

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[DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Anubisknight » Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:14 am

Hello folks,

I was looking for some help on analysing some WWS logs, specifically that of a DK - Broodus (Frost DPS). I have no idea on how to play a DK but he is a guildy and needs some help in getting his DPS up to par with his gear. I'd appreciate it if someone who has an experienced DK alt could tell me what he (Broodus) is doing wrong.

Here is a link to the raid log:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/ian464ph1oerldd0/

I'd like to say that this was his first time in ICC 25, so that may have been one of the reasons of his underperformance, but it doesn't seem to be the primary reason.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Grehn|Skipjack » Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:27 am

Now, granted I know nothing about how to read WWS logs, but if it's anything like reading a Recount readout, it looks like he's just standing around auto attacking, pressing perhaps a glyphed Howling Blast, and Frost Striking.

I would wait for someone who actually knows what he's talking about to give a proper answer though.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Boyfriend » Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:40 am

Compare:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/ian4 ... 040&e=3309
[your friend]

with

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/l2vb ... 419&e=4697
[frost-dk from my guild]

Differences:

Your friend should use unholy and frost runes for obliterate only, use icy touch and plague strike only once to initially apply diseases, only use howling blast on rime procs, refresh diseases with pestilence before they run out.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Gerunna » Mon Apr 12, 2010 8:02 am

Checked out his Armory page:
  1. Hit rating is way high considering he took Virulence.
  2. 14 expertise skill is way too low. For a human using swords he needs 147 rating on his gear to eliminate dodges.
  3. Only two pure +strength gems on his gear even after using a Nightmare Tear to activate the meta. In the short term he might be better off replacing some of those orange and purple gems with pure +expertise gems until his gear can cap it unaided. After that go to +strength gems, focusing first on those items with weaker socket bonuses.
  4. Glyphs need work. He really ought to ditch the Plague Strike glyph for Frost Strike, and Disease is probably a better candidate than Icy Touch.
  5. Talents are mostly okay. He'd probably see good results from taking points from Killing Machine and/or Black Ice to max out Endless Winter and get Unbreakable Armor (a big wtf? when I saw he skipped that).
As for his log parses, holy Howling Blast! On a single target fight like Marrowgar, there's no way HB should be his #2 damage source, especially after the Rime bug fix. It really looks like he's using HB as his go-to FU spell and then mixing in Icy Touch/Plague Strike, Death Strike, and Oblit when HB's on cooldown.

TL;DR: You really ought to send him a link to the EJ Frost dps thread to get a better explanation of what his spell priority list should look like.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Anubisknight » Mon Apr 12, 2010 8:14 am

Thanks for the quick responses folks. I'll tell him about the issues you pointed out and will also direct him to the frost DK thread at EJ.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Marblehead » Mon Apr 12, 2010 8:19 am

Your guy either he has 1k ms latency or he doesn't press his buttons. On Festergut, the most static fight for melee DPSers, he was hitting his abilities about every 2.5 seconds, while the gcd is 1.5 second. That's at least 30% loss of dps.

Furthermore, he should get Glyph of Diseases so he can refresh his diseases with Pestilence and also take the Endless Winter talent for 4% more strength. Also, as it was said before me, he should use Obliterate mainly and Howling Blast only on procs. Additionally, he should glyph Frost Strike and use it a hell lot more to dumb runic power.

I'm no expert in Frost DKs, but some thing are common sense.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby lythac » Mon Apr 12, 2010 8:31 am

% of melee attacks parried on DBS-

Aelis - 0.5%
Cybella - 0.7%
Zeverina - 0.8%
Broodus - 4.4%

I guess you can get parried when he turns and casts. However this little string -

[20:50:46.562] Broodus hits Deathbringer Saurfang Parry
[20:50:48.859] Broodus hits Deathbringer Saurfang Parry
[20:50:53.468] Broodus hits Deathbringer Saurfang Parry
[20:50:56.593] Broodus hits Deathbringer Saurfang Parry

Is not caused by the boss turning and casting.

Tell him to DPS from behind.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby blakk » Mon Apr 12, 2010 2:36 pm

His spec is missing UA. 20% str with a 33.3% uptime is mega dps. Like many people have said before he is using his runes for the wrong spells. Top three damage should be melée, obliterate, and frost strike. Usually in that order but sometimes not. He should swap glyph of plague strike to glyph of frost strike. It's suprising if I use howling blast at all an entire fight. It should only be used if all your runes are on cooldown and your rp is under 32. Or if you want the splash damage. Icy touch and plague strike should only be used to refresh diseases every 20-21 seconds. UH pairs for obliterate and blood for blood strike. He would also vet great benefit from going into H FoS and H HoR for the axes or maces.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Anubisknight » Tue Apr 13, 2010 8:14 am

Thanks again everyone for the suggestions. Really appreciate it.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Mozen » Fri Apr 23, 2010 5:37 pm

Sorry to tack on to this thread, it's something also related to Frost DPS.

I was chatting to a fellow DK in our guild about Frost DPS, and I was told that frost DPS needs to conserve Rune Power for Killing Machine procs so that the proc can be used immediately on Frost Strike.

I would have thought that a regular Frost Strike is better than nothing, though he did have a point that conserving RP like this is likely to give us more Frost Strike crits. Looking at the parse from Boyfriend's guild DK, it wasn't clear whether Ackralól was conserving RP for KM procs. So has anyone being doing it?
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Gracerath » Sat Apr 24, 2010 2:11 am

I dunno about conserving RP for KM procs, it just has the highest priority. If your diseases are up and your runes are on CD and you have >32 RP, then you use frost strike, regardless if you have a KM or not. However, if you have a KM proc and >32 RP, frost strike is what you should be using regardless of what runes are available or what diseases are up. Especially if you have 2 DK's since the uptime on frost fever should be nearly 100% between the 2 of you, to make use of tundra stalker.

Of course I haven't been frost since mid-ToC25 and I only take a peek at the EJ frost thread once a week but I think thats correct.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby blakk » Sat Apr 24, 2010 9:01 am

Conserving rp means you will have empty gcds which will lower your dps. You should always be pressing something. RP is like energy or rage. It should never cap unless something big happens. (like ams a big magic shot)
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby Mozen » Tue Apr 27, 2010 6:24 pm

Okay, cool. Thanks for the answers.

Yeah, conserving RP means significant empty GCDs (from my experience). I've since respecced to put in 1/2 Chill of the Grave, so it may improve a little. I was also wondering if my DPS was just capped by my gear, and they weren't really aware that I'm basically one tier below them when they compared my DPS to people in a mix of 264s and 245s.
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Re: [DK][PVE] - Need help analysing WWS logs.

Postby blakk » Wed Apr 28, 2010 9:10 am

If you want to compare gear and performance look at my dk. Then look at either Abbas (dk) or elitist (spriest) on grizzly hills. I do better dps than Abbas and about even with elitist. We all do between seven and nine thousand dps depending on the fight.
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