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Extended training guide

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Extended training guide

Postby Eredor » Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:09 am

I've begun tanking in September and it was also the first time I've had a Paladin.

So while I'm quite satisfied with where I am now (basically our guild's new MT as many people quit with 3.2 / for Aion / studies, including our 2 main tanks - that's why we are quite late on ToC) and while I know the basics quite well (rotation, ...) I am well aware that I have lots to learn as a Paladin tank.

That's why I would be very indebted to maintankadin's experienced tanks if they would share experience on skills, and how and when to use them.

A few examples.

Hand of Protection
I think I'm not using it enough.
Especially on the Faction's champion I want to use it on a healer but generally I am too far away or too late.
What's your strategy on this fight and generally?

Hand of Sacrifice
How often do you use it? When?

Hand of Salvation
When do you use it? Do you have a mouseover macro to go back to the rotation asap?

Thanks.
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby inthedrops » Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:20 am

It sounds like you're saying that you have a hard time targeting the people in your raid quickly. For all of the abilities you mentioned, it helps to know who typically needs it.

I don't use mouse over macro's personally, I've never tried as I've never been comfortable with that concept. It seems easy to target the wrong person. I'm sure others can do it with 100% reliability but I don't have that confidence in myself.

I rely on any combination of three methods to target people in the raid.

1. Know in advance who will need it and where they will be (this comes with experience raiding with the same group)
2. Use Grid. And know in advance where the "critical" people are on the Grid window so that you can quickly select them. Before each pull I usually scan Grid names and their locations as a short term reminder.
3. Use focus macro's or named target macro's.

Example:
I have a set of macro buttons that I place underneath my focus target bar. These macro's only work on my focus target. If you have the ability to plan ahead knowing who will need an ability, then this is a safe approach.

Sometimes you don't know who will need an ability. For example, HoP'ing people on Anub phase two. For this I don't rely on anything but my own eyesight. I always make sure I know who is being chased and spot them quickly (boss mods mark them). I have HoP bound to a safe key that I'll never hit by accident (the minus key on my numpad).

Mostly though, I am constantly scanning the Grid window to know who needs attention. And I keep the abilities you mentioned on a little button bar just above my Grid window. This way I can quickly select them in Grid and manually click the ability they need with my mouse. My reaction isn't great but it's usually fast enough.

Some people use Clique in combination with grid which is a great tool! But I prefer to have to click the abilities you mentioned manually because of the habits I developed over time.

As far as when to us the abilities, I don't have a good answer. For HoP on champions, I just use it when I know a clothy is in trouble. Usually this means they are CC'd/slowed and the Warrior or Rogue has them targeted. In raids I prefer to save Sacrifice for an emergency cooldown. For Salvation you usually know who might benefit from it so I just keep an eye on threat levels and Salv anyone that's not a hunter. Doesn't get used too much to be honest.
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby Tetsuo » Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:06 am

sound advice that. grid is my must have tool for raiding. doesn't take up much room and can show so much information in that small area (who has aggro is the big one like).

inthedrops wrote:Some people use Clique in combination with grid which is a great tool! But I prefer to have to click the abilities you mentioned manually because of the habits I developed over time.


I'm one of these people. I have all my hand macros bound to clicks.
One look at grid and a healer has aggo - ctrl+left click = healer now safe with hand of protection
dps pushing aggro a little too much - shift+left click = hand of salvation

Personal preference at the end of the day. I took up using clique when i was on add duty on sarth+drakes and it made my life a hell of a lot easier, you might not find it so good for your playing style.

good luck either way though :-)
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby Alpha » Tue Dec 15, 2009 10:54 am

I'm glad you take this up, since hands are a powerful tool, you should make good use of. Hand of Protection on the other tanks on beasts, HoP'ing the first slow moving lock or priest going down on FC, salvation on the trigger-happy mage on vezax, hand of sacrifice on the MT as an additional cooldown, etc., all this can be crucial for the succes of your raid.

I use mouseover macros, doing a lot of PvP, and I don't have time to target my healer or dps mate and then targetting back. It's essential that you hotkey all your hands, along with the rest of you abilities (hotkeys on EVERYTHING, I R SRS!) and learn them.

A little tip in PvP especially, is to make a macro to use sacrifice or protection on your healer with 1 click without targetting or anything. That can make the difference.

If you don't have them hotkeyed, that's prolly why you aren't using them :mrgreen:

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Re: Extended training guide

Postby kaanman36 » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:00 am

I use clique also for my hand spells. I also use it for cleansing.

right click = cleanse
shift+right click = hand of salvation
ctl+right click = hand of protection
shift+left click = hand of freedom

I have keybinds for self casting cleanse and hand o freedom. I only use clique for my raid/party members.
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby Spectrum » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:31 am

Grid and mouse-over macros FTW.

I don't use Hand of Salvation that much as I usually just yell at the DPS to use their threat dump. The people I have to watch for threat are our hunter and rogue who can threat dump on their own, and our warrior who only gets aggro when he decides to start off with bladestorm right as I pull, in which case HoSalv isn't going to help.

HoP is my third taunt often. I keep it handy. I also use it on the healers a lot when they get aggro in fights with adds. Since I use grid, I can always see who else in the raid has aggro.

HoSac is one I probably use the most. I use it almost any time I see that the other tank needs a hand and I can spare a little health. I isn't much, but it helps out, I assume. This happens whenever we have a single-tank fight and I'm not tanking, or when there's a lull. I'll use it to absorb some damage if the other tank is hold Gormok at the moment, if my valk is doing the bubble, or just whenever.
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby Arcand » Wed Dec 16, 2009 2:51 pm

Spectrum wrote:...warrior who only gets aggro when he decides to start off with bladestorm right as I pull, in which case HoSalv isn't going to help.


Hand of Protection works great, though. Wasting their big DPS cooldown for them and hurting their standing on the ego meter is what I call 'hitting them where they live'. :twisted:
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby Spectrum » Wed Dec 16, 2009 4:59 pm

Arcand wrote:Hand of Protection works great, though. Wasting their big DPS cooldown for them and hurting their standing on the ego meter is what I call 'hitting them where they live'. :twisted:


Our rogue has gotten pretty good at spotting HoP and clicking it off to resume DPS. If I catch the melee DPS getting close I like to BoP them to give them some negative reinforcement for sneaking up in threat.
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby Meloree » Wed Dec 16, 2009 7:57 pm

Spectrum wrote:
Arcand wrote:Hand of Protection works great, though. Wasting their big DPS cooldown for them and hurting their standing on the ego meter is what I call 'hitting them where they live'. :twisted:


Our rogue has gotten pretty good at spotting HoP and clicking it off to resume DPS. If I catch the melee DPS getting close I like to BoP them to give them some negative reinforcement for sneaking up in threat.


DI, imo.
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby Arcand » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:37 am

That'll teach 'em! :D
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Re: Extended training guide

Postby blkthunder » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:07 am

HoP = for healers only or to cleanse something bad from a tank in transitions.
HoSac = mitigation buff for the MT when im OT
HoSalv = defensive cd for me as i seldom have aggro problems.
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