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Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

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Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby Rituality » Sat Jun 20, 2009 4:26 am

as the title states, just a simple question that popped up in my mind after reading the patch notes. should build up quite a lot single target threat as soon as the 5 debuffs are stacked.

thx in advance for the replies.

Made your title a little more clear. - Modus
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Re: Will Reckoning be worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoC?

Postby Tomyris » Sat Jun 20, 2009 4:39 am

Only time will tell. We simply don't have enough information yet.
Hard pressed on my right. My center is yielding. Impossible to maneuver. Situation excellent. I attack.
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Re: Will Reckoning be worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoC?

Postby Smartos » Sun Jun 21, 2009 12:40 pm

I doubt command will be worth it. Vengeance should still be better if they don't destroy it completely.

Edit: Ok, Command != Corruption ...
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Re: Will Reckoning be worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoC?

Postby TokenElf » Tue Jun 23, 2009 7:05 am

Rituality wrote:as the title states, just a simple question that popped up in my mind after reading the patch notes. should build up quite a lot single target threat as soon as the 5 debuffs are stacked.

thx in advance for the replies.



Please change this to SoV.

No one here uses SoC in reference to Seal of Corruption. Too confusing. It started as Vengeance in TBC and most of us just call it SoV. Similarly it has always been SoB and not SoM for Blood. ;)
SoC is command.

As it stands, nope, reckoning is still not going to be all that great. You are better off with crusade still as that will still get you between 3-6% more damage per swing, per tick, per HS block, HotR, ShoR, and on white damage. Compare to just more white and SoV damage on the hit and it is very unlikely that Reckoning wins out.
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Re: Will Reckoning be worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoC?

Postby Macktruck » Tue Jun 23, 2009 5:15 pm

Well, we can move the 1-3 pts from DS/DG to Reckoning and not lose any pts from crusade.

Way I spec now

http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xm ... 0000000000

Granted, I do use DS/DG for a lot of fights like XT Hardmode, especially in 10-man when I OT sparks, but as people get more and more gear, it is still effective, but I'm seeing it's not AS needed. Though Freya and Mimiron Hardmode, it's quite a blessing.
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Re: Will Reckoning be worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoC?

Postby Wolvar » Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:08 am

As it stands, nope, reckoning is still not going to be all that great. You are better off with crusade still as that will still get you between 3-6% more damage per swing, per tick, per HS block, HotR, ShoR, and on white damage. Compare to just more white and SoV damage on the hit and it is very unlikely that Reckoning wins out.


I'm not sure how you come to that conclusion given the SOV change. On the face of it, 33% more weapon damage as holy PLUS full weapon damage as white on each Reckoning proc seems to me to be a lot more than a 6% increase... but as has been already mentioned, you can get 3 or 4 points in reckoning and still have 3/3 crusade.
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Re: Will Reckoning be worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoC?

Postby majiben » Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:20 am

Low uptime on reckoning on a small portion of our threat is unlikely to compete with a 3% increase on all our threat.
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Re: Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby Wolvar » Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:29 am

Reckoning already makes weapon damage a lot more significant portion of our DPS/threat if you have it now. 33% increase in damage as holy and PER HIT would likely make weapon damage at or near the top of the threat list with reckoning. We'll have to test it I suppose, but it certainly doesn't appear to me as cut and dried as you make it sound.
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Re: Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby Jasari » Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:40 am

Wolvar wrote:Reckoning already makes weapon damage a lot more significant portion of our DPS/threat if you have it now. 33% increase in damage as holy and PER HIT would likely make weapon damage at or near the top of the threat list with reckoning. We'll have to test it I suppose, but it certainly doesn't appear to me as cut and dried as you make it sound.


Reckoning is still low man on the totem pole according to my calculations
Code: Select all
Talent  DPS   TPS
1HWS   87.0  218.
TbtL   45.7  127.
Crus   29.2   73.2
Conv   18.3   43.5
SotP   22.3   61.7
Reck   15.4   28.0
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Re: Will Reckoning be worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoC?

Postby badgermonkey » Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:03 am

Macktruck wrote:Well, we can move the 1-3 pts from DS/DG to Reckoning and not lose any pts from crusade.

Way I spec now

http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xm ... 0000000000

Granted, I do use DS/DG for a lot of fights like XT Hardmode, especially in 10-man when I OT sparks, but as people get more and more gear, it is still effective, but I'm seeing it's not AS needed. Though Freya and Mimiron Hardmode, it's quite a blessing.


1 minute improved Sacred Shield is too good to pass up (I reckon), and bubble + DS is awesome on a lot of Ulduar fights (Brundir in flying mode lets our dps do some ranged instead of leggign it :P )

Dropping mitigation to take threat, when we're already leading the way on threat, isn't worth it.
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Re: Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby jere » Fri Jun 26, 2009 10:47 am

Jasari wrote:
Wolvar wrote:Reckoning already makes weapon damage a lot more significant portion of our DPS/threat if you have it now. 33% increase in damage as holy and PER HIT would likely make weapon damage at or near the top of the threat list with reckoning. We'll have to test it I suppose, but it certainly doesn't appear to me as cut and dried as you make it sound.


Reckoning is still low man on the totem pole according to my calculations
Code: Select all
Talent  DPS   TPS
1HWS   87.0  218.
TbtL   45.7  127.
Crus   29.2   73.2
Conv   18.3   43.5
SotP   22.3   61.7
Reck   15.4   28.0


Are those per talent point or for the fully talented talent.
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Re: Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby Jasari » Fri Jun 26, 2009 12:14 pm

Those are per talent point. However they're outdated now.

I did new calculations after factoring in what we know about the new SoV:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=20823&start=585#p455370
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Re: Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby Golith » Mon Jul 06, 2009 8:15 pm

The question i have is if the threat of SoC will be greater per swing than SoV. Granted this would require a faster weapon, but it might be worth looking into, imo.
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Re: Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby majiben » Mon Jul 06, 2009 11:24 pm

Only if you completely disregard the DoT which will be ticking away happily.
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Re: Reckoning worth it in 3.2 with the changes to SoCorr/SoV?

Postby steadypal » Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:04 pm

well


last i heard 5/5 sotp did not effect the 5stack hit...




if you had to choose between reckoning vs crusade then its crusade all the way



but since most builds will have vindication, might as well put 6 more into ret for crusade amirite,,



UNLESS< this is big, if sotp is just bugged on ptr and 5/5 sotp is supposed to effect 5stack SOV if thats the case, a 5/XX/12 build might be better...
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