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Spell Mitigation Comparison

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Spell Mitigation Comparison

Postby arilink » Sun May 10, 2009 8:16 pm

This post was created as information to clean up with some ancient and yet persistent prejudices.

Class specific modifiers:

Paladin:
x0.94 - Talent: Improved Righteous Fury
x0.94 - Talent: Guarded by the Light
x0.97 - Talent: Shield of the Templar
x0.97 - Glyph: Divine Plea
x0.83137924

Warrior:
x0.90 - Stance: Defensive Stance
x0.94 - Talent: Improved Defensive Stance
x0.846

Deathknight (Unholy):
x0.95 - Presence: Frost Presence
x0.95 - Talent: Blade Barrier
x0.94 - Talent: Magic Suppression
x0.84835

Deathknight (Frost):
x0.93 - Presence/Talent: Improved Frost Presence (additive)
x0.95 - Talent: Blade Barrier
x0.8835

Druid:
x0.88 - Talent: Protector of the Pack
x0.88


Exterior Buffs:

x0.97 - Talent: Blessing of Sanctuary or Vigilance
x0.97 - Talent: Renewed Hope


Total Mitigation:

Paladin: 21.78%
Warrior: 20.4%
Deathknight (Unholy): 20.18%
Deathknight (Frost): 18.87%
Druid: 17.2%


Notes:
At least 128 resistance (aura, totem, ...) versus a particular school of magic grants an additional guaranteed 10% mitigation (Source).
Deathknight's Blade Barrier uptime might drop below 100%.
Deathknight's spell mitigation might become inflated by abilities such as Anti-Magic Shell.
Paladin's Divine Plea uptime might drop below 100%.
Paladin's Ardent Defender situationally grants additional 30% mitigation.
Exterior Buff Analysis: http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com/ ... =2&t=22642
Lailani - Paladin
Vixi - Deathknight
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Re: Spell Mitigation Comparison

Postby Elsie » Sun May 10, 2009 9:12 pm

DK icebound fortitude, DK frost armor, DK icebound fortitude...

While they're CDs they're not exactly analogous to Divine Protection and Shield wall since, well, there's three of them.
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Re: Spell Mitigation Comparison

Postby toothdecaykills » Mon May 11, 2009 7:54 am

Elsie wrote:DK icebound fortitude, DK frost armor, DK icebound fortitude...

While they're CDs they're not exactly analogous to Divine Protection and Shield wall since, well, there's three of them.


However, the data presented here is mostly for passive spell damage mitigation. Although there is mention of certain active forms of mitigation, it doesn't contain all of them or even certain random mechanics like Spell Deflection in Blood. There are also several that are limited to direct damage spells but do not work for area of effect spells for that matter.
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Re: Spell Mitigation Comparison

Postby Gamingdevil » Mon May 11, 2009 8:26 am

BoS/Vigilance and Renewed Hope don't stack.
If it is weak, kill it before it gets stronger. If it is strong, weaken it.
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Re: Spell Mitigation Comparison

Postby Garath.Gorefiend » Mon May 11, 2009 10:18 am

arilink wrote:This post was created as information to clean up with some ancient and yet persistent prejudices.

Class specific modifiers:

Paladin:
x0.94 - Talent: Improved Righteous Fury
x0.94 - Talent: Guarded by the Light
x0.97 - Talent: Shield of the Templar
x0.97 - Glyph: Divine Plea
x0.83137924

Warrior:
x0.90 - Stance: Defensive Stance
x0.94 - Talent: Improved Defensive Stance
x0.846

Deathknight (Unholy):
x0.95 - Presence: Frost Presence
x0.95 - Talent: Blade Barrier
x0.94 - Talent: Magic Suppression
x0.84835

Deathknight (Frost):
x0.93 - Presence/Talent: Improved Frost Presence (additive)
x0.95 - Talent: Blade Barrier
x0.8835

Druid:
x0.88 - Talent: Protector of the Pack
x0.88


Exterior Buffs:

x0.97 - Talent: Blessing of Sanctuary or Vigilance
x0.97 - Talent: Renewed Hope


Total Mitigation:

Paladin: 21.78%
Warrior: 20.4%
Deathknight (Unholy): 20.18%
Deathknight (Frost): 18.87%
Druid: 17.2%


Notes:
At least 128 resistance (aura, totem, ...) versus a particular school of magic grants an additional guaranteed 10% mitigation (Source).
Deathknight's Blade Barrier uptime might drop below 100%.
Deathknight's spell mitigation might become inflated by abilities such as Anti-Magic Shell.
Paladin's Divine Plea uptime might drop below 100%.
Paladin's Ardent Defender situationally grants additional 30% mitigation.
Exterior Buff Analysis: http://maintankadin.failsafedesign.com/ ... =2&t=22642


I have to admit that I wasn't aware that the damage reduction from renewed hope stacked with BoSanc or Vigilance, but your really missing the point when comparing magic mitigation.

None of us argue that paladins are not alright (or more than alright) on pure passive mitigation of incoming magic.

What we have discussed, ad nauseum, is the lack of short term cooldowns to further mitigate incoming BURST magic damage.

Right now, we have ONE useable cooldown to reduce incoming damage and that is DP...its on a two minute cooldown.

We have nothing else WE can use, short of, wasting one of our glyph slots and gimping our threat gen by using the HoS glyph.

Druids have barkskin (1 min cooldown) and survival instincts (cant remember cooldown is either 2 or 3 min).

DK's have Icebound fortitude (1min cooldown) and AMS (45sec cooldown)

Warriors have Last stand (2min cooldown with glyph) and shieldwall (talented and glyphed 2min cooldown)

Granted, we are pretty close to warriors in current mitigation capabilities for un-interruptible/non-reflectable burst magic damage.

But, once warriors get T8.25x4 bonus, they have a 20% magic damage reduction ability on a 40sec cooldown...

So, lets take your base numbers and just work in the use of cooldowns on a 1 minute or less timer.

Paladin: 21.78%
Warrior (w T8.25 x 4): 36.3%
Deathknight (Unholy) using IBF: 36.1%
Deathknight (Frost) using IBF: 35.1%
Druid (barkskin): 33.8%

I have no idea whether or not DK's can stack AMS and IBF, so excluded AMS from calculation but assuming its absorbing 75% of damage up to 50% of health, even if the DK only had 40k buffed, AMS would/could bring their effective magic mitigation as high as 80% all by itself assuming an incoming burst of less than 33k

I raid regularly with a Feral druid. On slow hitting bosses, they are almost always absorbing a portion of the incoming damage with their new savage defense ability, so that also acts to increase their effective magic mitigation. Last time I checked, warriors and paladins still could not block incoming magic damage.

So, back to your post.

While it is true, that paladins have the best passive magic mitigation, we also have by far the worst active magic mitigation.

Warriors have the second worst until they get 4 pieces of T8. Once they get that, they leapfrog druids into second place.

DK's have the best magic mitigation always, as long as they use their cooldowns.
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Re: Spell Mitigation Comparison

Postby Steve » Mon May 11, 2009 10:40 am

Magic attacks that give rise to EH-like considerations and analysis are overcome via cooldown usage and not passive spell damage reduction.

I'm not sure what the point of the original post is, but its irrelevance in the light of practical considerations leads me to believe it is agenda driven.
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Re: Spell Mitigation Comparison

Postby jere » Mon May 11, 2009 1:19 pm

Gamingdevil wrote:BoS/Vigilance and Renewed Hope don't stack.


They aren't supposed to, but I tested it right before 3.1 came out and Renewed hope did stack with both (thought Vig/BoSanc didn't stack with each other). I am guessing after they moved it from grace that they forgot to prevent it from stacking.

Now I haven't checked since 3.1 came out, so they might have fixed it, but it recently did stack with Vig/BoSanc (which it shouldn't).
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