[25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

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[25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Corman » Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:57 am

We wiped 4 times last night on this boss, making absolutely zero progress.
We would normally make more attempts but we started very late due to the patch, wiping several times on the trash leading up to him and a few stupid wipes earlier (Someone pulling Flame Leviathan early and engaging without the towers down).

Note: I had no addons for this fight and anticipate having DBM with timers and stuff maybe making this a bit easier.

So my questions are this:

Most strats I can find so far suggest moving in and out of the scorches.
Is it accurate that there are just two scorches max so I would need 3 positions to rotate? The scorches seemed rather large, is 180 degrees enough to contain all three so that he doesn't face the raid?

How many healers should be focusing on myself / the offtank (s) / the raid? Obviously with flame jets the raid needs some healing.
On our first attempt, despite my warnings regarding this guy supposedly hitting up to 30k (My max hit taken was 26k), I had a single designated healer (paladin). On our second attempt, I believe a priest was added but I died on the first flame jet anyway. Should 2 be sufficient? Should a HOT style healer be added and would that be effective considering how hard he hits for? We never got to kill or even moltenize a construct but how hard will they hit the offtank?

Since flamejet to my knowledge only knocks the heal UP (along with me) and only back 2 feet or so, can they cast instants when they get knocked up into the air? I don't think my pally healer has ever used holy shock that I can recall but I could stress that he should just cast it the instant he's knocked up to at least ensure I get something while he's floating (i presume HL/FoL is out of the question due to movement).

Is there any special gearing consideration for him? Raid buffed I'm about 42K so stacking more EH in exchange for avoidance is an option but I would guess suboptimal. While there's fire damage, it seems my incoming damage is heavily physical so my normal high armor, high eh, avoid set should work best. <Yes, when I get home I'm changing my spec to the 0/53/18 spec and adding glyph of divine plea if available>.

How long is the fight overall? I presume there will be several flame jets and I would be unable to string CDs to survive them? LoH/DS/Pot+TicTac.
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Petrus » Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:29 am

1. Your paladin should DEFINITELY be using holy shock
2. Ignis was fairly bugged last night - meleeing the people he was putting in slag pots, thus oneshotting casters, and not having his damage buff removed when you killed an add, so you could do the fight as intended and eventually he'd still be hitting the Ignis tank for 40k or so. I was addtanking and during one of the wipes he came over and melee'd me for 33500 + about 1500 blocked.
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Maridian » Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:46 am

The unremoved buffs issue was hotfixed last night, per a blue post. Not saying the OP didn't encounter it, just that it's fixed (or should be) now.

The strategy I have seen suggested three tanking positions, but from the description of the fight four would be possible, to my mind. I believe three is recommended because the scorch duration is such that the first one fading is a sign that the third one is incoming shortly.
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Funtodin » Wed Apr 15, 2009 10:55 am

We had a few attempts yesterday as well but pretty much without any proper strat. We'll probably try out this positioning tonight. it should be good enough that the melee won't have to move and the casters will be out of danger from skorches.

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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Splug » Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:02 am

Funtodin's diagram is a reasonable strategy; you only need a 90 degree arc for the scorch.

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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Corman » Wed Apr 15, 2009 11:56 am

Thank you all for the input. Seeing as we only "really raid" 3 nights a week (Tuesday Thursday Sunday), I might grab a few of our better players and try a 10 man foray tonight just for practice on strategy/positioning execution. Might get a few badges in the process too so I can get my Libram of Fail for my achievement.
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Rasmfrackn » Wed Apr 15, 2009 12:31 pm

mmm... that's good MS Paint.
/approve
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Glorr » Thu Apr 16, 2009 1:29 pm

Yes, there was a fix for the buff drop. However, he's still meleeing randomly on slag pots. Too much to hope for a fix by tonight? Yes, you can instant-cast in the air, if you're not spell locked.
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Tyrsilon » Thu Apr 16, 2009 11:37 pm

Hi People,

My first time posting.

A useful tip is if you face the boss such that scorch drops into the water. The scorch gets 100% resisted. And you will see an emote that says "scorch is extinguished by the water"

so if you think along those lines, positioning comes really easy if you've tanked him before and you can have 2 constant scorch patches up. Instead of 3.

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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby trellian » Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:15 am

It's not even possible for him to have 3 scorches up at the same time is it?
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Corman » Mon Apr 20, 2009 8:57 am

While I suggested to our Raid Leader to utilize the water method, they thought I was doing fine on the 3 scorches and continued to do that method... for 2.5 hrs. Sadly, we were short nearly 10 of our normal players and had people who have never really raided before in the raid. Basically, whatever tank did not have our GM (a very good holy pally) healing them, tended to die. We had two healers on each tank (1 OT, 1 MT). We forwent 3 tanks because we didnt have the heals to spread around. we had 1 healer on slagpot though we have almost NO survivals of slagpot victims except when said holy pally was on it or two people concentrated. A few healers complained I went down "fast" but admitted they took their eyes off me to add to raid healing and looking at the logs I simply wasn't getting heals imo. If I didn't avoid, 25K + 25K = dead.

Definitely, though, flame jets did not cause my death other than the first time this time. Our holys held their shock in reserve for flamejet and it worked great. We also made sure we had other instants avail.

So my questions are:
How many and what types of healers would anyone recommend?
What distribution of healers across which roles?

Side note: We did a 13 minute Sarth (from zone in to finish) with 20 member half alt clear which made me realize how ridiculously easy the previous content was and I'm not complaining at all that Ulduar is easy 8)
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Janduin » Mon Apr 20, 2009 9:13 am

Corman wrote:Side note: We did a 13 minute Sarth (from zone in to finish) with 20 member half alt clear which made me realize how ridiculously easy the previous content was and I'm not complaining at all that Ulduar is easy 8)


We've been farming 25-man Sarth for Illustrations with 8-man alt/main mixes for a few weeks now. It takes us considerably longer than 13 minutes :) but the fact that it is possible at all (and easy) is yeah, pretty ridiculous.
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Re: [25] Ignis the Furnace Master Questions

Postby Chunes » Mon Apr 20, 2009 10:37 am

The strategy we found to work nicely was to simply have the MT rotate Ignis just enough so that the the MT himself was not standing in a scorch zone.

The benefits of this are:
- Scorch area is more condensed = less running around for OT’s if a scorch expires before an add goes molten
- Scorch areas will “favor one side” longer if they are allowed to overlap (less running for OTs = better)

With a “4 square” setup of the flame patches, in a worst case scenario, a south scorch zone goes out prior to an add going molten and the OT has to drag the add north to the newer scorch, recoup any lost stacks of “heat” then proceed to the water. With overlapping scorch zones, the tank will lose little or no heat stacks on the golem and still have a shorter run distance to the southern pool. The end result = not losing time on adds and minimizing the dmg buff to ignis.

Here's what i mean by worst case scenario (moar paint ftw, Scale is likely innacurate, but the concept is the same):

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Better case scenario:
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