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Reliquary of Souls

Naj'entus, Supremus, Akama, Gorefiend, Gurtogg Bloodboil, RoS, Sharaz, Council, Illidan

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Reliquary of Souls

Postby dhan619 » Tue Oct 02, 2007 8:47 am

(Taken from Bosskillers)

Essence Of Suffering ("EoS") - Phase One
Aura of Suffering
Healing effects reduced by 100%. Regeneration effects reduced by 100%. Armor reduced by 100%. Defense reduced by 500. Applied on the whole raid. Lasts until the boss switches to the next phase. Yes that means there are no heals in this part of the fight. Spell damage weapon time!

Fixate
A player gains aggro when marked with this debuff. Cast every 5 seconds on the closest target.

Enrage
Every minute, approximately, EoS will Enrage and start dealing a lot more damage (between 3000 and 4000 per strike). Enrage is a reliable timer, and the Bigwigs mod covers it, so it is worth having at least one raid member with it installed. Lasts for 15 seconds.

Soul Drain
Randomly targetted spell which deals damage and drains mana: 2,500-3,400 damage/mana drained every 3 seconds. Lasts 30 seconds. Dispellable.

Essence Of Desire ("EoD") - Phase Two
Aura of Desire
Damage taken when damage dealt (50%). Healing increased by 100%. Decreases maximum mana over time. Lasts until the next phase switch. Takes 160 seconds to drain your raid's mana completely.

Deaden
Increases damage taken by 100% on the target. Lasts 10 seconds. Cast every 30-35 seconds on the primary aggro target. Can be Spellreflect-ed and interrupted.

Spirit Shock
Disorient-type attack that deals huge damage (9,200 to 11,000) on the main aggro target. Each time EoD successfully casts a Spirit Shock, the cast time decreases and the spell disorients the target for 5 seconds, thereby causing a tank switch. Must always be interrupted. 1 second cast time. Cast every 5 seconds.

Rune Shield
EoD will cast a self-shield (it's easy to spot as it's really shiny), that can be Devoured (Felhunter) and Spellsteal-ed. It must be removed from her as soon as possible, as it absorbs around 40k damage and gives immunity to melee. Lasts until removed.

*This doesn't looks like a good idea for a paladin to be tanking this phase.


Essence Of Anger ("EoA") - Phase Three
Aura of Anger
Deals shadow damage over time. Increases damage dealt. Effects increase over time. This dot starts off at 103 damage per tick and increases by 103 each time it ticks. ie.

1st tick: 103
2nd tick: 206
3rd tick: 309
4th tick: 412
etc...

Spite
Randomly targetted on individuals in the raid. After 6 seconds of immunity to all damage, you will get hit by 7444-7556 nature damage. You need to take a Major Nature Protection Potion from the Cauldron of Major Nature Protection before the six seconds are over, or you'll die to either the combined damage of the nature damage and the Aura of Anger.

Soul Scream
Deals 2,500-3,400 shadow damage, mana burns for 4,000-6,000 and burns rage too: every rage burned adds 100 damage. Area of effect in a large frontal cone. For example a tank with 50 rage will typically get hit for 11,000 damage:
3,000 damage from initial effect + (80 x 100) = 11,000 damage

Seethe
Increases threat generated by 200%. Lasts 10 seconds. Only cast when the boss switches target, either from aggro pull or Taunt. It is therefore possible to avoid Seethe ever being cast.



Now phase 3 is the part I'm particularly interested and want to talk about. This looks like possibly an awesome place to place the paladin tank. But, I couldn't find anywhere if Soul Scream reflected damage back to the tank with mana as rage did... because if is so... then 5000 multiplied by 80 is not a survival hit :? .

So here's my question... any of you know if the paladin gets hit hard during soul scream because of the mana drain? (I'm not worried about the mana burning me to the point of problems of aggro because it doesn't seem THAT frequent in the videos I've been watching.)
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Postby Eek » Tue Oct 02, 2007 7:24 pm

dhan619 wrote:Now phase 3 is the part I'm particularly interested and want to talk about. This looks like possibly an awesome place to place the paladin tank. But, I couldn't find anywhere if Soul Scream reflected damage back to the tank with mana as rage did... because if is so... then 5000 multiplied by 80 is not a survival hit :? .

So here's my question... any of you know if the paladin gets hit hard during soul scream because of the mana drain? (I'm not worried about the mana burning me to the point of problems of aggro because it doesn't seem THAT frequent in the videos I've been watching.)

After playing around with Reliquary of Souls for 2 days, I can tell you that this is pretty much an anti-Prot paladin fight.

You don't need a Prot paladin for phase 1. Rogues and warriors can tank Essence of Suffering through Enrage; rogues have Evasion and warriors generally have enough health to survive 5 hits (6 if someone is being a moron and attacking from the front), and you'll be lucky to get passed 50% block with Holy Shield active let alone have anything looking like dodge or parry:
http://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?imag ... 154gg0.jpg

In phase 2, the MT needs to be able to Spell Reflect the Deaden in order for DPS to kill Essence of Desire in the 3 minutes before everyone is out of mana. Hence, it needs to be a warrior. There's just no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

For phase 3, I just don't see how it's doable with a paladin tanking. Essence of Anger's Soul Scream hits hard (link) and he melees just as hard. You're going to have next to no mana throughout the entire phase, and DPS needs to be going a lot harder than he's hitting the MT.
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Postby dhan619 » Tue Oct 02, 2007 10:50 pm

This is not necessarily an anti-prot paladin fight.

After playing around with Reliquary of Souls for 2 days, I can tell you that this is pretty much an anti-Prot paladin fight.

You don't need a Prot paladin for phase 1. Rogues and warriors can tank Essence of Suffering through Enrage; rogues have Evasion and warriors generally have enough health to survive 5 hits (6 if someone is being a moron and attacking from the front), and you'll be lucky to get passed 50% block with Holy Shield active let alone have anything looking like dodge or parry:
http://img221.imageshack.us/my.php?imag ... 154gg0.jpg


Good point here. All we're left with is rating and holy shield with the libram. Doesn't seem too much of a liability tho.

In phase 2, the MT needs to be able to Spell Reflect the Deaden in order for DPS to kill Essence of Desire in the 3 minutes before everyone is out of mana. Hence, it needs to be a warrior. There's just no ifs, ands, or buts about it.


The attacks that essence of desire does is casted which can be earthshocked/kicked/pummelled. Not necessarily meaning that it can't be taken up by the paladin but becomes more of a liability. Warrior would be better in this case.

For phase 3, I just don't see how it's doable with a paladin tanking. Essence of Anger's Soul Scream hits hard (link) and he melees just as hard. You're going to have next to no mana throughout the entire phase, and DPS needs to be going a lot harder than he's hitting the MT.


Soul scream hits hard BECAUSE IT MULTIPLIES by 80 with each rage that the warrior has. I'm trying to figure out if it does the same thing with mana. If it doesn't then this is a GREAT phase for the paladin to be useful because this is where most guilds get stuck for a while on RoS due to so much damage done to the raid and the tank.
Last edited by dhan619 on Wed Oct 03, 2007 5:44 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Postby PsiVen » Tue Oct 02, 2007 11:17 pm

Um... haha. Our virtually consistant additional 30% block rating on top of our other avoidance stats add up to something called uncrushability... which also means there will be no direct hit unless the paladin messes up.


Look at that screenshot, and think really hard about the aura you get in phase 1.

Uh... the attacks that essence of desire does is casted which can be earthshocked/kicked/pummelled... so once again.. a misleading statement.


Deaden is a huge damage boost for the raid and must be spellreflected, not kicked.

As for phase 3, warriors can burn their rage by switching stances and using an ability while Soul Scream is being cast. It *does* behave the same way with mana, and paladins have no recourse to taking huge damage from it. It's not multiplied by 80 obviously, I think it's .8.
Last edited by PsiVen on Wed Oct 03, 2007 11:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Mithos » Wed Oct 03, 2007 3:54 am

Aura of suffering is -500 defense among other things...not looking so uncrushable now. Deaden has to be spellreflected to kill him in time, and p3 owns your mana too much to be useful, as well as owning you in the process.

Random: Do you still drop combat between phases?
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Postby dhan619 » Wed Oct 03, 2007 4:59 am

Look at that screenshot, and think really hard about the aura you get in phase 1.


Yes it is -500 defense. But the boss cannot crit in this phase according to what I have read. Defense does mean dodge/parry/block are decreased. Guess this means that you're left with d/p/b rating stats with holy shield and libram. Still don't think it would be bad to have a paladin take it up. Forgot about that apologies... I even mentioned it on my own post and that skipped over my own mind!

Deaden is a huge damage boost for the raid and must be spellreflected, not kicked.


That is a valid point. Deaden is a damage boost for the raid. But what I was saying was that it didn't necessarily meant that the paladin couldn't take it up. It would make it more of a liability, but didn't mean that it couldn't.

As for phase 3, warriors can burn their rage by switching stances and using an ability while Soul Scream is being cast. It *does* behave the same way with mana, and paladins have no recourse to taking huge damage from it. It's not multiplied by 80 obviously, I think it's .8.


It was mentioned that it was 80/rage in bosskillers and now my question has been answered. Much appreciated for that. If it's .8/mana then it is still fine. I've watched videos where bears tanked this last phase due to the threat needed. If what PsiVen says is true then it is very much an advantage! Was actually hoping you'd reply to the question.

Next time try reading the posts of people trying to help instead of randomly contradicting valid points.


... not really appreciating that comment but okay. K... not looking to start a fight here... so moving on... I saw it as more of a flame and attack than help so I responded the way I did especially because the majority of the palatanking community isn't at black temple yet. Don't really want people to read discouraging things which actually can be worked around.

Once again... didn't mean to come off mean but a little sensitive to people saying blah blah blah can't happen and going off tangent of the question. It makes it seem like a direct attack rather than support. Apologies if it was misunderstood :wink:

Now that I look back at the way I worded things it did seem kinda rude. Edited.
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Postby Lore » Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:05 am

P1 is pretty good for a Paladin, I tank it up to the first enrage when a rogue takes it over with evasion. Load up on block value and you reduce his incoming damage a ton (Dabiri's Enigma use effect is handy too), and his attacks are small enough to begin with that AD is very effective when you get low.
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Postby Eek » Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:28 am

dhan619 wrote:This is not necessarily an anti-prot paladin fight.

Judging by this statement and your last post, you don't understand how the fight works and why I said this. Reading about it on Bosskillers.com is one thing; seeing it and doing it for yourself is another matter entirely. For your sake, I'll go into more detail.

Phase 1
Essence of Suffering has a debuffing aura which does 3 things:
1) Reduces the armor of everyone affected to 0 (Feral druid at the armor cap? They've got 0 armor)
2) Reduces the defense of everyone affected by 500
3) Pretty much nullifies anything and everything that could possibly heal anyone (Fel Blossom and Power Word: Shield aren't affected by this, and they do help)

Essentially, everyone in the raid has to tank Essence of Suffering at some point. He hits for ~1k, he cannot land a critical strike, he cannot land a crushing blow, there's an easy gimmick that makes him fixate on the people you want, and everyone can go all out on DPS without ever pulling aggro... unless Suffering kills someone. Off the top of my head, someone will get killed if they don't move out of his circle, someone doesn't move into his circle, or the melee is being retarded and don't understand parry mechanics (which leads to a lot of the "wtf he hit me 8 times" statements you'll get after you wipe).

Every minute, Suffering enrages and hits ~2.5 times harder (that 3-4k statement on Bosskillers.com is bullshit) for 15 seconds. His fixate mechanic still works, so it's just a matter of having the right people take the fixate for the duration of the Enrage. You generally want people with lots of health (warriors and Feral druids) or who can avoid the hits (rogues have Evasion, which increases their chance to dodge by 50%). Besides Fel Blossoms and Power Word: Shield, the only way to mitigate damage taken while Suffering is enraged is shield block value. With a common raid setup, your raid will be able to take only 2 Enrages; if you hit the 3rd Enrage, that means your DPS is sucking and, in all likelihood, you won't have anyone left to take enraged hits. No, kiting him isn't an option.

Oh, and he also throws out a debuff every 20 seconds or so called Soul Drain that'll hit 4 or 5 people. Cleanse it quick because it does damage and drains mana.

Phase 2
Essence of Desire has a debuffing aura which, again, does 3 things:
1) 50% of the damage you deal to Essence of Desire is reflected back to you (it isn't uncommon to see 0/21/40 warlocks blasting half of their health at a time before Deaden is up)
2) Healing done by everything is increased by 100%
3) Maximum mana is decreased roughly every 10 seconds (from the start of the phase, you have 3 minutes to kill Desire before the entire raid has 0 mana)

Despite the aura, the big thing in this phase is Desire's casts. You pretty much need Curse of Tongues up all the time or her casts will be going crazy fast, and they need to be . Her casts:
1) The first and most common cast is Spirit Shock. This needs to be interrupted every time it's being cast, and she'll try chain casting it, so there needs to be an interrupt rotation of some sort. On the MT, it'll hit for roughly 9k arcane damage, but the damage isn't the issue. The issue is that Spirit Shock has a secondary effect which confuses the affected target for 8 seconds (off the top of my head, it's like the Pound ability that Mechanar Wreckers do on occasion), so if the MT eats this, Desire will start attacking the person that's next highest on threat. And no, you can't just have someone else tank her temporarily. For starters, she hits a lot harder than Suffering; she'll 1-shot just about anyone other than the MT. And the second reason is...
2) Deaden. This is her other cast. Deaden increases the damage taken by the affected target by 100%. She'll try casting this roughly every 30 seconds and it needs to be spell reflected back on her. If it isn't spell reflected, it'll hit the MT and he'll start taking a lot more damage than normal. If it's interrupted, your interrupt rotation is likely screwed up now and the MT will probably eat a Spirit Shock within the next second. If it's spell reflected like it should, Desire will take a lot more damage. This is crucial; the raid has 3 minutes to burn her down, and if they don't, they'll run out of mana, the MT will die, then everyone else will die. If your raid has very good DPS (i.e. your guild has Illidan on farm status), you can probably get by if Deaden gets interrupted or not spell reflected once. That's it.

Lastly, Desire puts up a Rune Shield every now and then. This needs to be removed ASAP whether through Devour Magic (I'd shy away from using a Felhunter here just because they won't have enough mana to use this ability later in the phase), Dispel, Purge, or Spellsteal. While it's up, all melee damage is absorbed, and if you're using a melee interrupt rotation, they won't be able to land their interrupts on Spirit Shock.

Phase 3
Essence of Anger's debuffing aura has 2 effects:
1) You'll take increasing amounts of damage over time (each tick increases the damage you take by 103; the only way to reset this is to die and use a Soulstone or have a druid use Rebirth on you)
2) Every tick increases the amount of damage you deal by 5%

Plain and simple, Anger is a DPS race. At the very best, you'll have 100 seconds to kill him before the stacking ticks are too overpowering and healing can't possibly keep up with all of the damage. The MT needs to be able to hold aggro throughout this phase, and it isn't uncommon for DPS warriors or Enhancement shamans to intentionally kill themselves so they can drop aggro, resurrect, and start fresh without anything holding them back.

To add to the fun, Anger also has a cone frontal ability called Soul Scream which burns both rage and mana. He does this every 10 seconds. If someone pulls aggro and points him at the raid at the wrong time, it's a wipe. Aura of Anger is doing a lot of damage in itself, Soul Scream is all but tearing apart the MT, and on top of that, Anger hits like a truck. Your MT will be eating a lot of damage; bursts exceeding 15k are common and the heals can't ever stop coming. If the heals stop, people die.

Also, Major Nature Protection Potions are necessary here so you can absorb damage if you ever get hit with Spite. This ability, combined with Aura of Anger, will obliterate the greater part of your health, and the potion is there to cushion at least some of the incoming blow.




So now, why did I type all of this? I wanted to go through the entire Reliquary of Souls fight to illustrate a point: this is an anti-Prot paladin fight. Beyond being an Enrage sponge in phase 1, Prot paladins cannot spell reflect Deaden in phase 2, and Soul Scream in phase 3 will zero your mana pool every 10 seconds. If you have no mana to work with, you can't build threat, and if you can't build threat at the incredible rate necessary to burn Anger down before everyone dies, it's simply pointless to attempt to have you tank him.

You cannot be there for just phase 1; you need to validate your presence for phases 2 and 3, and if you can't, you're dead weight that'll only hold back the raid. I've been there and I saw all of that for myself. The fight's mechanics make it such that our spec is useless.
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Postby Lore » Wed Oct 03, 2007 7:47 am

Eek wrote:Beyond being an Enrage sponge in phase 1, Prot paladins cannot spell reflect Deaden in phase 2, and Soul Scream in phase 3 will zero your mana pool every 10 seconds. If you have no mana to work with, you can't build threat, and if you can't build threat at the incredible rate necessary to burn Anger down before everyone dies, it's simply pointless to attempt to have you tank him.


This is an unfair statement. Yes, he'll zero your mana pool, but he'll do a healthy chunk of damage when he does it, which you'll get healed for. Incidentally, the amount of mana you get is just about enough to hit Consecrate, Holy Shield, Judgement, and Seal of Righteousness before the next mana burn. I see no reason a Prot paladin couldn't tank P3.

Eek wrote:You cannot be there for just phase 1; you need to validate your presence for phases 2 and 3, and if you can't, you're dead weight that'll only hold back the raid. I've been there and I saw all of that for myself. The fight's mechanics make it such that our spec is useless.


Ardent Defender + a healthy amount of block value makes Phase 1 trivial and reduces a lot of the confusion, I fail to see how that is dead weight that's only holding back the raid. Also, a good Paladin will continue to make themselves useful in P2 and P3 - I keep up Judgement of Light P2 (which helps a ton for keeping melee DPS alive) and Judgement of Wisdom P3, as well as swap on a healing weapon/shield/libram and help heal.
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Postby Eek » Thu Oct 04, 2007 12:16 pm

Lore wrote:This is an unfair statement. Yes, he'll zero your mana pool, but he'll do a healthy chunk of damage when he does it, which you'll get healed for. Incidentally, the amount of mana you get is just about enough to hit Consecrate, Holy Shield, Judgement, and Seal of Righteousness before the next mana burn. I see no reason a Prot paladin couldn't tank P3.

But after he burns your mana from the first one, the amount of damage you'd take from the consecutive Soul Screams isn't going to be as great. And if you chain parry and/or dodge a few of the attacks, that's melee damage you aren't taking; I could see this not being an issue later in phase 3 when Aura of Anger stacks are hitting you a lot harder, but early on, you simply wouldn't be getting enough mana back through Spiritual Attunement in order to continually build threat at the necessary rate.

If you want to get down into the nitty gritty, Soul Scream (link) will always hit for at least 2625-3375 damage before Righeous Fury and Spell Warding kick in. The mana burnt-to-damage ratio is 2:1, so assuming you're at 6500 mana after a starting threat rotation, that's 3250 damage. Factor in talents and Soul Scream is going to hit for 5625 on average. Spiritual Attunement is going to give you back 563 mana, about 100 mana shy of a max rank Consecration.

A full threat rotation using Holy Shield, Judgement, Seal of Righteousness, and Consecration takes 1285 mana with 5/5 Benediction; this assumes you aren't trying to sneak in an Avenger's Shield between incoming swings. Essence of Anger has a swing timer of 2.0 and, for the sake of argument, hits for 5.5k (although he was averaging 4.7-5.1k hits on the MT for our WWS logs). Between Soul Screams, you have 5 chances to get melee'ed in order to get mana back through Spiritual Attunement and continue building threat. Let's make another assumption here: you have 50% avoidance. On average, this will get you 1375 mana through Spiritual Attunement, but I'm not done yet.

You might look and say "well, 563 and 1375 mana is way more than the necessary 1285", but the 563 is mana gained from damage taken for the first Soul Scream. After that, Soul Scream will hit you for no less than 2363 assuming you have no mana; if you have even 1000 mana after a threat rotation (which means you were melee'ed at least 3 times), that means 450 additional damage taken. That example Soul Scream got you 281 mana, almost half of the first one.

At this point, this starts falling into the hands of luck. If you get hit twice between Soul Screams, you will have enough mana to keep on going assuming the average 5.5k hits, but if the combined damage from two hits is under 10k, you're only going to have enough mana to continue the threat rotation if the Aura of Anger's damage is high enough. If you get hit only once between Soul Screams, you're completely out of luck there; the threat rotation breaks down, you're forced to wait, and DPS has probably already caught up to you if they weren't tailing you already.

Now, keep in mind that I'm neglecting one basic factor in all of this (human error) and assuming that you'll get healed the instant you take damage. Going over it again, the first Soul Scream will hit hard but the rest won't be hitting nearly as hard, Aura of Anger will only start genuinely contributing to your mana gained through Spiritual Attunement after the first 30 seconds (i.e. when it starts hitting for 1k+), and avoid too many incoming melee swings or take some that aren't hitting as hard and you're going to end up being mana starved and unable to keep building threat at a normal pace.

At this point, it could diverge into numerous what ifs. What if there was an OT that would taunt off Soul Screams, what if someone pulls aggro and I taunt him back, what if I just use mana pots, etc. Regardless, using a Prot paladin to tank Essence of Anger really is a crap shoot and I hope I've illustrated that. Do I want this to be the case? Fuck no, but I'm looking at the reality of it all and it just isn't looking good for us whatsoever.
Lore wrote:Ardent Defender + a healthy amount of block value makes Phase 1 trivial and reduces a lot of the confusion, I fail to see how that is dead weight that's only holding back the raid. Also, a good Paladin will continue to make themselves useful in P2 and P3 - I keep up Judgement of Light P2 (which helps a ton for keeping melee DPS alive) and Judgement of Wisdom P3, as well as swap on a healing weapon/shield/libram and help heal.

Okay, so you're going into phase 1 stacked with a bunch of block value gear. Your chance to block is still going to be relatively low even if you also throw on a lot of block rating. Is that holding back the raid? No, but at the same time, the rest of the raid can still do your job while Suffering isn't enraged and there are still 2 more phases in the fight.

In phase 2, what are you contributing to the raid? A Ret paladin can judge Crusader, have another paladin judge Light, and then a 3rd paladin judge Wisdom. Then they're doing some semblance of DPS while keeping 3 judgements up on Desire.

And in phase 3, you're still in tanking gear but you're putting on 3 healing pieces. Your healing is going to be abysmal, you won't have any real endurance, and your mana pool will be shallow. Once you go OOM and are on pot cooldown, what then? Target the MT and hover your finger over Lay on Hands?

I'm not trying to criticize you. It's just... I want to find a use for a Prot paladin amongst all of this. Unless you're sporting something like a 20/41/0 build, it seems like we'd be more of a burden than a boon for the raid if we're healing. Our DPS output might look great on Hyjal trash, but on single targets, it's just terrible especially if we aren't the one being attacked. And lastly, we aren't tanking here. We're specced Prot, but there's nothing that we can tank. While we can be of some use for phase 1, phases 2 and 3 would require us to not be in tank gear in order to be effectively helping the raid but we can't just switch out gear. If there were a brief few OOC seconds between phases, I wouldn't be saying any of this, but that just isn't the case.

Hence I keep coming back to the same conclusion that I made earlier: Reliquary of Souls is an anti-Prot paladin fight.
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Postby Lore » Thu Oct 04, 2007 12:58 pm

Every time we've killed RoS, I've been the initial P1 tank. I know you're not taking any jabs at me; I merely say this because it's definitely not "nothing". Moreover, tanking for a little while and then doing nothing for the rest of the fight is pretty much the name of the game. It's a recurring theme that starts at Attumen the Huntsman and continues all the way to Illidan. Personally, I keep judgements up and swing my [Nightfall] to help caster DPS.

Having a high block value tank hold EoS up until the first enrage simplifies P1 greatly and lets the rest of the raid focus less on positioning and more on DPS. There's no reason a Prot Paladin can't fill that role. In fact, I would say that a Prot Paladin is best for this. EoS's attack speed is one second. A Warrior will Shield Block, lose his 2 charges, and take 3 hits until SB comes back up. A Prot Paladin can keep his +35% block chance for close to the full duration, and when coupled with a Redoubt proc it's a thing of beauty. And then there's Ardent Defender to consider. Hell, most of the time I'm able to stand by to tank him again after stepping out for the first enrage.

Sure, someone else could do it, but if you're looking for a reason to bring a Prot Paladin in over any other raid member based purely on virtue of class mechanics alone, I think you'll find very few fights in which this is the case. That doesn't make it "anti-Prot Paladin" though, it just means we don't have a free ride.

There's also another situation you overlooked in your P3 analysis: Seethe. Whenever EoA is taunted, he puts a debuff on the entire raid that triples threat generated for 10 seconds. Most guilds use this to their advantage by having the MT taunt immediately and giving him those 10 seconds to build a threat lead (while hunters misdirect, etc). Obviously you can use Avenging Wrath for these 10 seconds as well, and obviously it stacks. I shouldn't have to tell you just how much of a threat lead you can achieve with 10 seconds at 390% normal threat gen. I'd imagine you can stand to be mana starved for a little while after that.
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Postby Neuron » Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:16 pm

Fun fight to heal though! Yeah healing!


Edit: WTB shield wall for phase 3, jesus christ.
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Postby enbee » Thu Oct 04, 2007 4:20 pm

Lore wrote:P1 is pretty good for a Paladin, I tank it up to the first enrage when a rogue takes it over with evasion. Load up on block value and you reduce his incoming damage a ton (Dabiri's Enigma use effect is handy too), and his attacks are small enough to begin with that AD is very effective when you get low.


I do the exact same thing, BV gear tank till 1st enrage, full blocks once I hit AD, very handy
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Postby Mithos » Fri Oct 05, 2007 6:26 pm

Interesting stuff guys :) this is personally one of my favourite fights, I've never done it but after watching htee Nihilum world first video I fell in love with it for some reason...sorry to repeat myself like an annoyance, but do you drop combat between phases? It sounds like you don't, but I saw in some patch notes a while back that you would, then I heard it had been revoked but I never saw any confirmation.
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Postby fiorina » Sat Oct 06, 2007 12:58 pm

mithoss wrote: but do you drop combat between phases? It sounds like you don't, but I saw in some patch notes a while back that you would, then I heard it had been revoked but I never saw any confirmation.


Sometimes yes, sometimes not. I think it's not intentional. Just as one "face" is dying and new one is coming you can get OOC for a short time.
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