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Tanking by feel - no numbers, no theory, no napkinmath

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Tanking by feel - no numbers, no theory, no napkinmath

Postby Equillian » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:35 am

<insert long winded words and phrases trying to make myself sound more intelligent>

... long story short, I'm having a total blast as a pally these days. My threat seems to be great, even when I undergear the team by alot. I've never been so overall "thick". So for once, lets not look at numbers, and just play based on the feel. I feel strong. That has to count for something.
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Postby Arcand » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:42 am

"Sorry, we feel that this other guy's a better choice." ;)
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Postby iliya » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:43 am

"Dude, the DPS overtaking your threat. What's wrong?"
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Postby Io.Draco » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:44 am

iliya wrote:"Dude, the DPS overtaking your threat. What's wrong?"


When did that happen to you after 3.0 at a boss fight?
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Postby GothicPL » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:45 am

Io.Draco wrote:
iliya wrote:"Dude, the DPS overtaking your threat. What's wrong?"


When did that happen to you after 3.0 at a boss fight?


When a similarly geared ret pally leaves RF on?
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Postby uke » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:51 am

GothicPL wrote:
Io.Draco wrote:
iliya wrote:"Dude, the DPS overtaking your threat. What's wrong?"


When did that happen to you after 3.0 at a boss fight?


When a similarly geared ret pally leaves RF on?


I've never done that...NEVER!

>.>

(whistles innocently)

Hey, I've had to off-tank before in ret gear. I can't always remember to turn RF off when I'm done, right?
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Postby iliya » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:53 am

Io.Draco wrote:
iliya wrote:"Dude, the DPS overtaking your threat. What's wrong?"


When did that happen to you after 3.0 at a boss fight?


I'm quoting a hypothetical post-nerf undergeared tankadin.

...also, it was one of those damn moonkin with a string of crits that was doing it... I shoulda let him die.
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Postby Ascendant » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:56 am

I was having some trouble staying above a sunwell geared arms warrior the other day :? I had to salv him every fight to keep him from pulling. I also had a sunwell geared warlock complaining about being threat capped.

after that I am not throwing threat concerns out yet. maybe their damage was too high and will be "fixed" later (arms warrior), but for now I am not dominating threat meters in my ZA gear :P
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Postby Chunes » Mon Oct 27, 2008 10:57 am

when we killed illidan the other week on our third attempt i simply forgot to put RF back on after buffing. Mage instapulled aggro and while illidan was running to her i RF'ed, AS/Exorcism/HW his face and regained aggro.

the funny part was that everyone was like "l2p mage, let the tank get threat."

i felt only a little bad.
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Re: Tanking by feel - no numbers, no theory, no napkinmath

Postby daemonym » Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:04 am

Equillian wrote:<insert long winded words and phrases trying to make myself sound more intelligent>

... long story short, I'm having a total blast as a pally these days. My threat seems to be great, even when I undergear the team by alot. I've never been so overall "thick". So for once, lets not look at numbers, and just play based on the feel. I feel strong. That has to count for something.


this. only threat problems i have are: people in full sunwell stoofs, rogue starts attacking a mob that AS didn't hit during an los pull (damn where'd my taunt go? oh well), boomkin gets 4 big crits in a row at the start of the fight (ahh there's my taunt!), ret pally puts RF on.

so ya, threat is not a problem by a long shot. just bad players/gear/RNG can take threat from ya, not a player with 1/8 of a brain.

and btw, that clang has really grown on me...like a moldy fungus of some sort.
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Postby Ilara » Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:06 am

Chunes wrote:when we killed illidan the other week on our third attempt i simply forgot to put RF back on after buffing. Mage instapulled aggro and while illidan was running to her i RF'ed, AS/Exorcism/HW his face and regained aggro.

the funny part was that everyone was like "l2p mage, let the tank get threat."

i felt only a little bad.


They need a little reminder now and then.

I admit, I'm guilty of not strictly following mathbuster rotations. Never been a problem.

>.> and how is this a wotlk thread?
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Postby Equillian » Mon Oct 27, 2008 12:29 pm

It's a WOTLK thread for a couple reasons...

1: It's about the changes that go along with the content that wouldnt be here if not for WOTLK.

2: I was originally going to go into a long, drawn-out example of my feelings toward level 80 content and all that emo junk, just decided to leave it out.

3: This was a thread in response to everyone yelling about how bad we are in WOTLK... I just dont believe it.

Ok, sure, there are people out there that take less damage, do more threat, and are more sought after. Sure, WHATEVER.

I'm a paladin and a tank. Pally first, tank second. I only die when I screw up or when someone in my team does. I got heart, skill, I'm enjoying myself, and I know my toolset. That goes ALOT further then 5% mitigation.

Fastest way to be MT, make your own guild. There are plenty of other players out there that would like to join you. (people missing out on raids for similar reasons). Can't get your slot, make one :)
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Postby PsiVen » Mon Oct 27, 2008 12:36 pm

Rotations are guidelines, not hard and fast rules. Nobody maintains them perfectly all the time, or even should.

So I'm not sure what that has to do with people being angry about nerfs, but I'm glad you're having fun.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Mon Oct 27, 2008 12:37 pm

Equillian wrote:Ok, sure, there are people out there that take less damage, do more threat, and are more sought after. Sure, WHATEVER.
Just a comment in regard to this reaction: You may not mind being behind, most do. And even worse: People directly linked to you mostly do care. Come back with any kind of complaint that you got turned down a raid because "lol palatank", and I'll bring this quote back, and you'll have to swallow it.


Other than that, <shrug> I'm not taking any conclusions for now.
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Postby Amanor » Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:14 pm

Equillian wrote:It's a WOTLK thread for a couple reasons...

1: It's about the changes that go along with the content that wouldnt be here if not for WOTLK.

2: I was originally going to go into a long, drawn-out example of my feelings toward level 80 content and all that emo junk, just decided to leave it out.

3: This was a thread in response to everyone yelling about how bad we are in WOTLK... I just dont believe it.

Ok, sure, there are people out there that take less damage, do more threat, and are more sought after. Sure, WHATEVER.

I'm a paladin and a tank. Pally first, tank second. I only die when I screw up or when someone in my team does. I got heart, skill, I'm enjoying myself, and I know my toolset. That goes ALOT further then 5% mitigation.

Fastest way to be MT, make your own guild. There are plenty of other players out there that would like to join you. (people missing out on raids for similar reasons). Can't get your slot, make one :)


I'm glad you're having fun, I suspect if you weren't you'd likely not be playing your class and role. And if that works for you, that's fine.

However, for those of us who actually are trying to keep our thumbs on the pulse of tanking as prot, its present condition and a diagnosis of areas that are problematic, numbers are required and not to be discounted. The problem with going purely by feeling is that when someone comes along with cold, hard numbers as to why you won't be put in front of something, the only argument you can present is "But I feel capable." Which is not largely convincing.

People who become infected by contagions often "feel" fine at first--but that's only because the problems haven't escalated to the point where the body reacts.
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