Are we going to be nerfed?

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Are we going to be nerfed?

Postby Elderin » Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:57 pm

I've been tanking in two major instances and I've noticed a huge increase in threat.

While before the patch, I could maintain threat pretty well, but if one of the high DPSers went all out, they could pull threat off me.

Now, there is no way anyone could pull threat.

In fact, I have to be careful because when I'm not MT, I could pull threat off of the MT.

Even on trash pulls, I usually end up tanking all the mobs at once because I'll pull off the other tanks.

It is my observation that Paladins are now the highest threat generator of the three tanks.

Does anyone thing this was Blizzard's intention? And, if it wasn't, are we going to be nerfed?
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Postby Lore » Wed Oct 22, 2008 3:01 pm

Are you judging Light?

If yes, it's bugged and you're getting threat for every single heal it does. That's a lot.

If no, congratulations, you're the best tank in your guild :P Warriors and Druids are generating great aggro at the moment.
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Postby Elderin » Wed Oct 22, 2008 3:04 pm

I wasn't judging light when I noted the threat generation issue. I fell back to my old habits of judging wisdom.
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Postby Worldie » Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:14 pm

Then either, you are a exceptional tank, or your other tanks FAIL.
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Postby mavfin » Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:04 pm

Worldie wrote:Then either, you are a exceptional tank, or your other tanks FAIL.


Or a mix of the two.

As far as anyone being nerfed on the tank side of things, that will only happen in small doses, and only if one class scales too much better than the others or something.

Any big nerfs would have to be duplicated on the other three tank classes to keep it all in line, and Blizz really doesn't want to have to adjust four classes at once again. :D

I think the present balance is here to stay. Of course the Law of Unintended Consequences will slap Blizzard and the players a few times, but I think they'll try to keep things in line and definitely try to avoid the situation in the last half of BC if they can possibly do so. Four more-or-less equal tank choices is a wonderful thing for the players, imo, as is the same for healing and DPS.
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Postby Galoheart » Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:22 pm

I'm thinking somewhere in a Blue post I had read healing spells or buff proc's were changed in WotLK to credit the caster of the buff with the healing done like with Priests PoM to track and credit the caster for the heals/threat. Or maybe I'm mistaken.

But if that's the case isn't JoL and with all the changes to proc from target on melee and spells now doing the same thing by crediting all heals and threat to the caster of the debuff as well. Especially given that Salvation was removed and baked into all of our other casted spells. Could this be the case as to why JoL is possibly causing the threat increase?
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Postby mavfin » Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:27 pm

Galoheart wrote: Could this be the case as to why JoL is possibly causing the threat increase?


Yes, this is exactly the case, but, it's causing a threat imbalance between the tanks, so I'm sure Blizzard will figure out something to do about it. Law of Unintended Consequences slaps us again. One sort-of bug is that the modifier on JoL is 0.5 rather than the usual pally 0.25 threat per hp healed.

Will be interesting as to what the solution is. As it stands now, it's going directly against Blizzard's stated stance on keeping tanks fairly even.
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Postby Levantine » Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:04 pm

mavfin wrote:One sort-of bug is that the modifier on JoL is 0.5 rather than the usual pally 0.25 threat per hp healed.


No, the .5 threat per healing done isn't a bug. It's only Holy Light and Flash of Light (I'm not 100% sure about Holy Shock) that have the .25 modifier.
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Postby mavfin » Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:05 pm

Ah, ok. I was actually only repeating what other people have said on that particular (.5 vs .25) point. Regardless, whichever way it is, it's causing a threat imbalance when used.
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Postby Cowadin » Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:35 pm

my raid consistantly has 2 geared rets that are judging light and wisdom at all times.

that means my aggro isn't going to change when the fix the JoL threat thing right? cuz even tho i am judging light the rets ticks for alot more and therefore isn't getting attributed to me.

is that correct? or am i misguided here and both our JoL's are healing.
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Postby Levantine » Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:10 pm

Your Rets should not be casting JoL at the moment. Unless they want to pull aggro and die, that is.
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Postby Doloth » Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:15 pm

Well, I don't know, but I was 4th on dps in my last BT (granted, the dps in my guild is not impressive, but still), and on Supremus I was averaging 5k tps, and on gorefiend I was 6k. Now either Omen is broken, or I am, cause thats insane. On Illidan, before phase 1 ended, I was 120k threat past the next person.

And no, I ain't using light. I might do it now, just for kicks.
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Postby heuvarius » Wed Oct 22, 2008 8:30 pm

Threat at the moment for our guild has been at the same ratio as it has always been. Getting aggro largely depends on who gets the love of the hunter's MD.

I did have a few problems with JoL threat doing Muru side adds last night but it was still relatively easy for our warrior tank to grab the sentinels back before it reaches me.
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Postby mirkodeluxe » Thu Oct 23, 2008 12:38 am

Problem is: My retrifriends ARE casting JoL, I noticed in ZA yesterday when I for some weird reason lost aggro all of a sudden.. I myself wasnt judging light all the time.

I simply had to tell them to stop doing it, and I started doing it myself.
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Postby Cowadin » Thu Oct 23, 2008 12:44 am

Levantine wrote:Your Rets should not be casting JoL at the moment. Unless they want to pull aggro and die, that is.


as i said, 1 ret on light, 1 ret on wisdom. they dont have RF up so they dont get the threat coefficient on it anyways. im way ahead on threat as it is, only time the ret judging light has issues is when he bursts too quick at the beginning of a non-paladin tanked fight.

my rets jol heals more than mine, i dont see why he shouldn't be using it.
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