Supremus problem

Naj'entus, Supremus, Akama, Gorefiend, Gurtogg Bloodboil, RoS, Sharaz, Council, Illidan

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Supremus problem

Postby Dendrah » Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:43 am

Yesterday my guild visited BT for the second night. After I succesfully MT'ed Naj'entus I was also assigned to Supremus for maintanking. And then the trouble began.

The first phase went great. I stayed alive, Threat was nice, I avoided the fires,... Each try the first phase was excellent.
The second phase also went rather ok. I just ran behind him and tried to get a few melee strikes off while keeping my SoR alive.
A few seconds before transition I activate Holyshield and get ready to drop my exorcism and judgement.
I pick up Supremus fine but rather soon after I'm squish dead on the floor.
No worries, my tanking buddies take over on both MT'ing and OT'ing. and continue the fight. We even reached the 15 minute enragetimer that way (me being dead)

Next try I survive the first pickup but I go squish on the second.

All tries we had I went squish dead at some point. My tanking buddies take over and keep tanking the boss and don't go squish unless a decent lot of healers died to the vulcano's. So it looks liek I can't blame it on the healers. At least not all of them.

Compared to my mates I'm a little behind in EH but I'm higher in avoidance.

What could have gone wrong?
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Postby Worldie » Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:56 am

It's called "healers not precasting must delete their char"
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby caboom » Wed Oct 15, 2008 1:09 am

And judging by the "15 min enrage timer" remark dps rly needs to dodge volcanoes, cuz standing in it is bad.

What you can also do next time is watch your combat log and figure out how long u were w/o heals and if it was a burst or something else that killed you.
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Postby Worldie » Wed Oct 15, 2008 1:33 am

Consider that Supremus with the standard 2.0 atk speed will melee for 6-7k every 2 seconds. Assuming healers start healing you when you take the first hit, by the time the heal lands you might be dead already, expecially if you weren't topped.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Seloei » Wed Oct 15, 2008 1:41 am

Since your healers could keep up the other tanks fine that means they were "shocked" into working harder then.

The reason (i think, not sure) you were dieing was since you were the only one in melee range that had the highest healthpool and took a hateful strike and one or two normal hits before dieing. Were the other tanks charging/following the boss when the phase swap happened?

Also, dps/healers dieing on volcanoes is wrong. Their big, their glowing and you just run away from them >.>
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Postby Dendrah » Wed Oct 15, 2008 2:00 am

Well it was only the second night in BT for this guild and almost everyone of us (me and 1 other person excluded) was never there before.

Badge gear in Kara doesn't really teach the healers what precasting is.

My OT was equally fast on the boss as I was so it was not the hatefullstrikes.

One time thou Supremus ended up in the corner far away form all healers when I picked him up and the next time I had to pick him up when he was standing on 2 or 3 vulcano's. Is there anything you can do in that situation apart from running into the vulcano's and hoping for the best while you try to kite him out of it?
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Postby caboom » Wed Oct 15, 2008 2:14 am

Dendrah wrote:One time thou Supremus ended up in the corner far away form all healers when I picked him up and the next time I had to pick him up when he was standing on 2 or 3 vulcano's. Is there anything you can do in that situation apart from running into the vulcano's and hoping for the best while you try to kite him out of it?


When that happens i call for DPS to stop and i exorcise/judge/AS to pick him up(MD if available) and get him away from the volcanoes as fast as possible. Especially if your unsure of your healers don't run into multiple volcanoes.
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Postby amh » Wed Oct 15, 2008 3:23 am

From a healer´s perspective: Tanks have a tendency to get out of range when they´re picking him up. It´s understandable, and you don´t really have much choice. Tell them to NEVER be out of your range.
Edit: Typo
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Postby Seloei » Wed Oct 15, 2008 4:09 am

best way to find out what went wrong is to have an addon that lists what happened in the last 30s before you died. Recount has a builtin "deaths" system that shows the last 15s of heals on the person before he died.
WWS is nice since you can read a LOT more from it, if you know howto.

Next time you go there, try to start a WWS (wowwebstats.com) so you can see what was going wrong and help us figure out the real reason for the problem. Unexperienced healers in bt = wipefest. Same goes for tanks and dps, but without good healers you can't get far anywhere.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Wed Oct 15, 2008 6:06 am

from a tank's perspective, you did what you could. Maybe pop an avoidance trinket, but even that is kind of a stretch.

Worldie's first reply kinda sums it up.

Also, there's no excuse for healers(or anyone really) to be out of range of the tank. All it takes is always staying within 40 yards of the tank, that should be at Supremus' tail. If none of 5-6 healers can do that, you have a problem.
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Postby Dendrah » Wed Oct 15, 2008 6:06 am

Well that's why we go to BT. To have them learn something.

No more lazy collecting badges and Kara gear. T5 is also not enough of a challenge to bring much things to learn. (Unless you go for Kael ofc)
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Postby Kilthanas » Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:09 pm

Well he used to hit somewhat hard.

Just make sure that you move out of the fire if he drops it. Other than that its all on your healers.
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Postby vschiano2008 » Thu Oct 23, 2008 5:46 am

amh wrote:From a healer´s perspective: Tanks have a tendency to get out of range when they´re picking him up. It´s understandable, and you don´t really have much choice. Tell them to NEVER be out of your range.
Edit: Typo


yes, having healed this fight on my priest during progression, i can say range can be a killer. You'll notice all the healers will basically be standing under his feet, and just be in 30 yds to heal you. especially after running around during kite phase, it can be hard to get back in place.

coordinate over vent with your healers- best thing is to try to move him back to original position after the phases and 'regroup'.
stand where u want him and get a misdirect.
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Postby Belarkan » Thu Oct 23, 2008 6:39 am

It isn't that easy from a healing point of view.
Going in range + casting can kill.

Maybe you should either get full hot at the start, either review your healer's positions either ask any healer in range to focus you.
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Postby sanctifico » Thu Oct 23, 2008 7:12 am

Before the pull
Melee debuff Fortitude!
Assign healers to the Tank and OT (Player with highest HP after the MT)

Phase One - Let the tanks get in range, and build some threat.
Melee can then move in - and nuke away, be ready to avoid the flame trails.
Ranged - just nuke to your hearts content, avoid flame trails, and watch your threat if you get high

Use Heroisim/Bloodlust about 10-15seconds into the Phase, this should force him down to below 60% before his first phase two.

Phase Two - Survive.
Have someone announce the focus changes (one person not 24)
Kite him around objects, but avoiding moves which will allow him to gain on you (running into a corner).

Until people know when to move etc, just tell them not to DPS on this phase, but rather that they focus on avoiding the volcanoes and keeping themselves alive.

With the changes, even if you only dps during the Phase One, timers, you will never hit the enrage unless your dps dies.

Phase switch One > Two -
When the timer gets below 5 seconds squishy people need to check they have a safe direction to run from Supremus if he focuses them.

Phase switch Two > One - This is obviously where your healers are having difficutly.

When the timer gets to about 5seconds, take note of where your healers are, make sure noone is between the MT+OT and Supremus and the MT+OT and the healers (if they are they may get squished so tell them to move.)

If your healers are close, use AS/Excorsism to gain agro, and tank him where you stand (easy)
If there is a large gap with a Volcano in the way, you have to gain agro (AS/Excorsisim) and RUN towards them, if he catches up and

My suggestion is, throw AS / Exorsisim at him, and run towards you healers. If he catches up with you walk backwards towards your healers (use bubblewall & lay on hands if needed)
Stop once your in range, If you cant get in range, your healers suck, Volcanos are only 30yard radius, so they can heal through them / run around them to get in range before you die.


WORST CASE HAVE A PALADIN BUBBLE AND RUN INTO A VOLCANO TO HEAL YOU ;)
Last edited by sanctifico on Thu Oct 23, 2008 7:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
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