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Darkmoon Card: Vengeance vs Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal

Warning: Theorycraft inside.

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Darkmoon Card: Vengeance vs Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal

Postby Ossuary » Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:07 pm

First I'll start off saying that a friend of mine pointed me to these boards and they have been an immense help. ^_^ Secondly, is i am foremost a healadin looking to tank so my gear is rather cobbled together but mostly epic..

Looking at the threat output of the two, I'm looking for which one will provide a better use of the trinket slot. Currently using Moroes lucky pocket watch in 2nd slot for staying uncrushable. (I'm leaning towards vengeance anyways due to the 51 stam)

Facts:
Talismans proc is 50% chance every time you judge.(so every 8 or 10 seconds)
Talismans proc is 480 dmg over 12 seconds. 4 ticks every 3 seconds for 120 Holy damage.
Talismans proc will overwrite itself and you lose a tick. (120 dmg)
The damage of the proc while holy is not affected by JoC but is affected by one handed weapon specilization.

I haven't gotten the Card yet, have to wait on the Faire to show up.
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Postby Stupendous » Sun Sep 16, 2007 3:28 pm

You lose a lot of stamina with the talisman. a lot
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Postby Fridmarr » Sun Sep 16, 2007 7:25 pm

Stupendous wrote:You lose a lot of stamina with the talisman. a lot


Exactly.

Ossuary, you are comparing two different items that are generally used for two different things. Generally folks use the darkmoon card for the 51 Stamina, that it causes a little extra threat is bonus.
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Postby Agravaine » Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:15 pm

The Vengance Card is sick and borderline OP.
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Postby Mithos » Sat Sep 29, 2007 4:10 am

I have actually been thinking about this for a while, whilst I am nowhere near exalted with Ashtongue :>, I thought I'd play around with the idea. As you said, 480 dmg over 12 seconds which is 120 every 3 seconds, which is 228 threat per tick, giving 76 TPS. If you get this proc up every judge, then you are gonna be losing one second off the timer due to overwriting itself (or 2 if you have imp judge). If not then, could do many things as it's a proc and not guarenteed. In an ideal world where it procced every other judge, this is a flat 38 TPS increase, but due to overwriting itself, it will be less than this if it chain procs.

Vengeance Deck gives 51 stamina and an average of 105 damage every tenth damaging hit you receive. Assuming around 45% avoidance (threat fight, might be even less) then you are only proccing this 5.5% of the time, for an average of 199.5 threat per proc. Let's say a boss has a swing timer of 1.5 (I know nothing about boss stats), then you will be hit ever 2.7272.... on average, and you will see a proc ever 27.2727...seconds, giving 7.315 averaged TPS.

Also: Icon of the Silver Crescent gives 43 base spell dmg equalling 27 TPS (1 spell dmg = 0.63 TPS which I pulled from another thread) and a use giving 97.65 TPS for 20 seconds, which is an extra, on average, 0.81375 TPS over the entire cooldown period (i.e.,keep spamming it when it's up and you'll get that much TPS increase), but the use has a nice thing about increasing SoV stack damage until it falls off.

So I think stick with the Ashtongue thing for threat, and definatly get the DM Vengeance card for stamina, it is amazing for that. I think the Icon wins for aoeing though, for threat at least. please correct my math if it sucks.

Do you think maybe we could get blizzard to make the trinket work like SOV? As in, a proc refreshes the duration only, and doesn't reset it completely? That would make it far more useful but in no way overpowered.
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