what AD should have been

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what AD should have been

Postby kurros » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:27 am

Cheat Death Rank 3
You have a 100% chance that an attack which would otherwise kill you will instead reduce you to 10% of your maximum health. In addition, all damage taken will be reduced by up to 90% for 3 sec (modified by resilience). This effect cannot occur more than once per minute.


This is exactly what ardent defender should be. Hell, stretch it out to 5 talent points so it remains the same talent sink as it currently is, this would completely fix AD.
Anyway, lets just agree to disagree. Go away, or I'll just start reporting you to the mods for being a troll. In exchange, I'll stop pointing out your stupid in public.
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Re: what AD should have been

Postby adacus79 » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:30 am

kurros wrote:
Cheat Death Rank 3
You have a 100% chance that an attack which would otherwise kill you will instead reduce you to 10% of your maximum health. In addition, all damage taken will be reduced by up to 90% for 3 sec (modified by resilience). This effect cannot occur more than once per minute.


This is exactly what ardent defender should be. Hell, stretch it out to 5 talent points so it remains the same talent sink as it currently is, this would completely fix AD.


THIS^
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Postby Melathys » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:30 am

yea, until you play a rogue and realize how broken and useless it is. On average, I'd say cheat death extends my life time by about one tenth of a second. More often than not, I'm dead before the cheat death animation is done.
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Postby Nalyn » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:36 am

I honestly think AD, by and large, is fine, it would be GREAT if it couldn't be leapfrogged, but it serves it's purpose.

And ya...cheat death isn't what it used to be, right now, pvp'ing as ret, it just means rogue01 takes an extra swing to finish off typically, where as a patch ago, it was basically damage immunity for 3 seconds.
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Postby Sabindeus » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:37 am

uh, no?

Because that's not HORRIBLY overpowered for a tank to have, amirite?
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Postby solina » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:56 am

I'd rather see something like:

- Reduces all incoming damage by 30/40/50/60/70% - % max health remaining.
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Postby moduspwnens » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:57 am

Melathys wrote:yea, until you play a rogue and realize how broken and useless it is. On average, I'd say cheat death extends my life time by about one tenth of a second. More often than not, I'm dead before the cheat death animation is done.


Uhh... I play my Paladin in PvP, and I can assure you it works for many rogues.
I rule.
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Postby aureon » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:07 am

in PvP.
as pve tank, that'd be another story! :)
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Postby kurros » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:09 am

Sabindeus wrote:uh, no?

Because that's not HORRIBLY overpowered for a tank to have, amirite?


It's very similar to a non-leapfrogged AD, except it has a 1 minute cooldown added as a penalty. I don't think it's horribly OP, no.
Anyway, lets just agree to disagree. Go away, or I'll just start reporting you to the mods for being a troll. In exchange, I'll stop pointing out your stupid in public.
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Re: what AD should have been

Postby Alberich » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:09 am

kurros wrote:
Cheat Death Rank 3
You have a 100% chance that an attack which would otherwise kill you will instead reduce you to 10% of your maximum health. In addition, all damage taken will be reduced by up to 90% for 3 sec (modified by resilience). This effect cannot occur more than once per minute.


This is exactly what ardent defender should be. Hell, stretch it out to 5 talent points so it remains the same talent sink as it currently is, this would completely fix AD.


Cheat Death is fine for rogues.

It would really be gamebreaking for a tank to have something like this. That being said, I respectfully disagree with your assessment and say that all AD needs is to be trimmed to maybe 3 talent points, and/or have a combat log entry.

Edit: I kin speeel gud.
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Re: what AD should have been

Postby kurros » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:15 am

Alberich wrote:It would really be gamebreaking for a tank to have something like this.


Why? Because it would work in raids?

AD: works on any attack from 35% hp on.
CD: only works on an attack that would otherwise kill you
AD superior.

AD: no cooldown
CD: 1 minute cooldown
AD superior.

AD: can be leap frogged
CD: will activate before you die every time
CD superior.

AD: no lasting buff
CD: 90% DR for 3 seconds
CD superior, however given that you will be at 10% max health even a 90% reduced hit could kill you if you don't get healed.


AD seems to be the stronger talent, except when it's leapfrogged. Do you think AD is fine just because it is worthless in raids? I'd rather they just remove it, I don't really want to spend 5 talent points on a 5man tanking talent.
Anyway, lets just agree to disagree. Go away, or I'll just start reporting you to the mods for being a troll. In exchange, I'll stop pointing out your stupid in public.
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Re: what AD should have been

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:19 am

kurros wrote:AD: can be leap frogged
CD: will activate before you die every time
CD superior.


THIS IS THE BROKEN PART.
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Re: what AD should have been

Postby kurros » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:22 am

Sabindeus wrote:
kurros wrote:AD: can be leap frogged
CD: will activate before you die every time
CD superior.


THIS IS THE BROKEN PART.


This is what I don't get. So you think AD is horribly OP when it isn't leapfrogged?

What exactly is the benefit when it *is* leapfrogged? Zero.
Anyway, lets just agree to disagree. Go away, or I'll just start reporting you to the mods for being a troll. In exchange, I'll stop pointing out your stupid in public.
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Re: what AD should have been

Postby Sabindeus » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:27 am

kurros wrote:
Sabindeus wrote:
kurros wrote:AD: can be leap frogged
CD: will activate before you die every time
CD superior.


THIS IS THE BROKEN PART.


This is what I don't get. So you think AD is horribly OP when it isn't leapfrogged?

What exactly is the benefit when it *is* leapfrogged? Zero.


Who said anything about leapfrogging? Maybe I wasn't clear enough.


kurros wrote:AD: can be leap frogged
CD: will activate before you die every time
CD superior.


THIS IS THE BROKEN PART.
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Re: what AD should have been

Postby Snake-Aes » Thu Oct 09, 2008 10:28 am

kurros wrote:AD seems to be the stronger talent, except when it's leapfrogged. Do you think AD is fine just because it is worthless in raids? I'd rather they just remove it, I don't really want to spend 5 talent points on a 5man tanking talent.
Hm, since when it's worthless in raids?
1% mitigation, indeed, but it's kinda there when you need it the most, yanno? I'll try to talk _Chloe into redesigning the ad damage mitigation algorithm to not bother with ad mitigation on the last row of hits within AD in that you died. YOu'll see that it's not much smaller, it's still roughly 1% overall, which represents those 30% when you need it the most.
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