Kalecgos

Kalecgos, Brutallus, Felmyst, M'uru, Entropius, Kil'jaeden

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Healers

Postby Palad » Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:33 am

How many Healers do u take to Kalecos?

We are using 9-10 atm. Starting to think that is to many.

How do u set up groups?

We are currently tring 4 groups of.

1 MT healer
2 Group Healer
3 Decursing
4 dps
5 dps

With 5th MT group

1 Pally
2 Warrior
3 Warrior
4 Healer tied to Warrior 2
5 Healer tied to Warrior 3

I'm trying to do the Arcane risist strat atm.

So I tank full time. If a MT healer is top side they heal me. group healers heal group. The 2 Warrior drops in first portal while the 3 Warrrior drops in 3rd portal with thier tied to healers.

Best we have got is 30/30. but i think this is due to failure to excecute but I can't be sure. Does this sound resonable?
Last edited by Palad on Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
CC = Continuous Consecration
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Re: Healers

Postby Cakes » Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:39 am

Palad wrote:How many Healers do u take to Kalecos?

How do u set up groups.


We take 9 healers, some guilds do it with 8, some do it with 10. This is the one fight in Sunwell where most synergies be damned, it's just easier to group people up with the people they share a portal with. We do it with 4 portal groups, each one with the following:

2 healers
1 decurser
3 dps
1 tank

Obviously one of our groups has 3 healers because we take 9 to the fight, but we've done it with 8. Some healers and dps'ers serve double purposes as decursers, so keep that in mind when breaking people into groups.
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Postby Base » Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:43 am

We run with 8-9 healers. The groups are not optimised for dps - we make sure we have 2 healers and a decurser (ideally a mage, but if not then our boomkin or a last option being a tree out of tree).

We assign the lock from the tank group to group 2 - so he moves when group 2 moves. The "spare" in the tank group goes with group 3. On the first portal only if a tank gets targetted group 4 goes with him.

The fight requires constant use of vent, calling groups portal positions, tank rotations. Missed portals or deaths can be recovered, but they make it considerably harder to do.

Having grid setup to show the spectral exhaustion debuff helps whoever is calling groups (especially if a tank is targeted and another group needs to go with them).

The hardest time is when there is only 1 group with a tank - so for the demon tank on the first portal and on the dragon tank (if you are using the pally tanks dragon tactic) after the 3rd portal (all but 1 group with demon) and 4th portal (first group returning from demon realm) - during these periods the tanks need spam healing.

Other than that the fight is about nuking the demon, making sure you get your portals and spreading for portals.
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Postby Palad » Tue Aug 12, 2008 2:43 am

thx for quick reply. I edited and added to it.
CC = Continuous Consecration
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Postby Seloei » Mon Aug 25, 2008 12:39 am

Was wondering... with 3 tanks, could it be possible to have the dragon tank in AR gear and the demon tanks in SR gear to make life easier? Since corrupting strike is shadow based, maybe it can be possible to "resist" it?

200 AR on the dragon tank (me) and 300+ on the 2 warriors with SR gear.

We're still trying him out and failing due to the demon tanks dieing most of the time, or then the dragon tank dieing since too many go down. Portal confusion etc, but would those res sets make the fight easier on the healing/difficulty?
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Postby inthedrops » Mon Aug 25, 2008 7:34 am

Seloei wrote:Was wondering... with 3 tanks, could it be possible to have the dragon tank in AR gear and the demon tanks in SR gear to make life easier? Since corrupting strike is shadow based, maybe it can be possible to "resist" it?

200 AR on the dragon tank (me) and 300+ on the 2 warriors with SR gear.

We're still trying him out and failing due to the demon tanks dieing most of the time, or then the dragon tank dieing since too many go down. Portal confusion etc, but would those res sets make the fight easier on the healing/difficulty?


I don't think resist sets are going to fix the problems you're describing. And I don't know if SR helps down below. For the tank that takes the first portal make sure he doesn't go down until he knows a healer is there. Also, they can use a FAP to avoid the corrupting strike stun after they taunt and that goes a long way into staying alive.

Besides that, I think the portal confusion needs to be cleaned up :)
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Postby Seloei » Mon Aug 25, 2008 11:37 pm

yeah true, portal confusion is the bigger deal but the tanks downstairs keep getting knocked over and losing agro so that kalec is tanking 75% time. Or the tank downstair dies since there is just one healer who can't keep him + groups up.
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Postby Tekkel » Tue Aug 26, 2008 12:08 am

As a general rule you should always have a MT healer + group healer downstairs before the taunt. I found that 1 healer is sufficient if they spam max rank on you untill another MT healer comes in. Ours have finally learned to do that and I've stopped dieing since.

The only problem we have is that portals are sometimes very very late. Our dragontank goes into the 5th portal alone because all other groups still have the debuff and then it sometimes takes another minute before the next portal. Pretty much fucking up the tanking downstairs.
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Postby Daine » Tue Aug 26, 2008 3:25 am

Our strategy is pretty odd in that I don't set specific tank and group healers that -just- follow the tank. We run two tanks and 7 healers, and I have each group have a tank and group healer. For example:

G1: Two tanks, Resto Druid(G2, tank), Mage(G5), random DPS (G4)
G2: 4 melee, Resto Shaman (Group)
G3: 2 hunters, shadow priest, mage, my holy priest (tank+group)
G4: 2 warlocks, mage, resto shaman(group), holy paladin(tank)
G5: Holy Priest(group), Shadow Priest, Resto Druid(tank), 2 other random DPS

People in G1 except the two tanks go with other groups into their portals, and are responsible for and helped by those people. Shadow priests have Imp VE to help out with the group healing for me particularly, allowing the groups with Shadow Priests to focus much more on tank healing until debuffs stack high or just after a Shadow Bolt Volley. Provided healers are aware of what's going on, and know that the tank takes absolute priority until they have enough healers to back them up, it can work. It's quite random though in regards to portals unfortunately, and requires all healers to be decent.

I do find the two tank strategy to be easier to organise, though if you get a bad streak of portals you can lose an awful lot of health on human Kalecgos which could easily lead to a wipe. I don't really advocate the use of resistance gear on tanks though, I personally don't think it'll do you many favours. We just have everyone else either use the Kara AR trinket on a blue AR cloak enchanted to try and mitigate a bit of the AB/portal splash damage.
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Postby Elsie » Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:49 am

We just use a normal raid set up and assign 4 'groups' largely unbased on raid organization that contain at least 3 dps, 2 healers, and someone capable of decursing.
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Postby Amarant_Pally » Tue Sep 09, 2008 8:56 am

Halp, halp! Kalecgos raped me! (single Pally-tank method)

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... n=Vyndrian

Edit: Sorry, Armory link won't be stable unless I (/slap) remember to log out in "Kalecgos" gear every time! Is there a "gear profile" site that I can just input my gear and save it that way?

Swap:

Belt for Enchanted Adamantite Belt
Cloak for Cloak of Arcane Evasion
DMC:V for Violet Badge
Commendation for Morose Watch
7th Ring for Hyjal rep ring (max)
Signet ring for 2.4 Badge ring (the armor/dodge one)
(I think I also used the "Warrior" bracers; sorry, servers are down, can't swith out my gear)

Giving me the stats of: 28% dodge, 17%-ish parry, 17%-ish block, and almost 19k HP fully buffed. Was using stam food, Ironshield pots, etc. etc.

Our best attempt (out of 4 total; still learning trash = lotta wipes; oh, and hey, did you guys know the Kalec fight can lock people out? lulz) was about 58% on demon and dragon.

Healers noted that I seemed to get hit excesively hard when Kalec (dragon) got close to 50%. I assumed this was due to the debuff that I was waiting to hit the "magic number" to DS off. Perhaps I should DS stacks off at a static percentage, unless the stacks are abnormally low? (was running 160 AR buffed, no Chrom Flask). Or perhaps I am just not geared enough for serious attempts (I do understand what upgrades I need, and am just waiting on drops).

Also to note, I have these following trinkets (and any suggestions as to which to use in addition to Violet badge [or hey, maybe not the violet badge at all, and pop a Chrom flask?] are welcome): ZJ parry trinket (sorry forgot name; has a clicky armor effect), Commendation of Kael'thas, Morose Watch, and Shadowmoon Insignia.

Is it also feasible, I suppose, to switch to an avoidace/mitigation weapon after people take a round of portals? I have available to me: Brutalizer, ZJ parry axe (name??), Sun-Eater, and the "Warrior" sword from Anetheron (with +def and +armor); all are enchanted with +20 AGI (Mongoose better, perhaps?).

Also, we only tried it this way under my suggestion to do so. The Warrior MT wasn't too thrilled about it, but played along. I don't know if we'll continue to try this way next week, but it was worth a shot! Discussion after the raid generally led to admitting people in guild needing gear overall (we've only killed Illidan a few times), but we think it's very doable.
Last edited by Amarant_Pally on Wed Sep 10, 2008 11:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Seloei » Tue Sep 09, 2008 10:54 pm

We tried the solo tanking option for a while, gave up on it and now trying the 3 tank rotation. 25%/32% was our best attempt still. The 3 items i used was :

cloak, neck, trinket.

It was very very luck dependant on the debuff stacks and sometimes i had 2 debuffs at a try, sometimes all.

Healers are failing to keep you up? Did you notice if too many went down at the same time? 58% (from our tries) sounds like about 4. or 5. portal which means they are healing the ones who have a high debuff stack also outside and might neglect the tank.

What group rotation are you using? are the healers on the ball? Are some paladins spamming flashes still? Druids only hoting?
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Postby Amarant_Pally » Wed Sep 10, 2008 11:31 am

I don't know the intimate details of how heals were being handled (dragon realm, demon realm, raid, and tank healing), but I do know I had full HoTs from 3 Druids at most times (Lifebloom stacks fell off sometimes), but in every instance where "tank splatted," I hadn't received a full heal (non-HoT) for about 4-6 seconds. I don't believe I had a Paladin on me at all times, and we had 2 Holy Paladins in raid (mostly Druid HoTs and spam Chain Heals with me targeted, it seems from combat logs; our person who hosts WWS wasn't present that night, so I can't really analyze any data...going on recollection).

While I do believe a lot (if not all) of the failure was due to learning the encounter (and any healer issues will be worked out, I'm sure), my question is just "Do I have the gear to do this, this way?"
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Postby Worldie » Wed Sep 10, 2008 12:40 pm

I can for sure tell you that HoTs alone aren't going to keep a tank up in Sunwell.
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Postby Mortehl » Wed Sep 10, 2008 12:43 pm

Your gear is a little weak. You could do better ring, chest, leg, and neck wise. But not so weak that you can't do the job.

My guild uses the solo paladin method with much success. Your healers need to understand that they need to be ready to get heals on you as soon as they port back, THEN run into position.
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