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Brutallus causes QQ overdrive!

Kalecgos, Brutallus, Felmyst, M'uru, Entropius, Kil'jaeden

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Brutallus causes QQ overdrive!

Postby Consecrate » Tue Aug 05, 2008 10:29 am

Hello, the problem I am experiencing is not to do with the fact he roflstomps, or the fact he once made me use all of my shield durability during a try because I forgot to repair my shield.

No, my problem is the QQ this boss causes.

My guild has 3 tanks, a warrior, a paladin and a druid. Usually the Warrior isn't here, so most things get tanked by paladin/druid, this has worked well for a long time, as the Warrior is there for Illidan and Kalecgos.

All good so far, only the problem is that on Brutallus when the Warrior is not there, all of the DPS warriors start to QQ violently about having to keep up TC Demo shout and Sunders, one of them even logged off saying that they can't be bothered until there is a warrior tank online as paladins can't tank this fight.

I realise how amazingly childish this is, but is there anything I can show them, or any advice I can give them on keeping TC up? (As expose weakness is better, and demo shout is only once every 40 seconds)

Also, I am having problems with my JotC falling off the debuff list, other than switching rogues to instant rather than deadly, is there anything I can stop people doing to stop this happening?

I can't think of any debuffs we can afford to drop, usually have most classes except ret paladin and affliction warlock btw.
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Postby Ratanna » Tue Aug 05, 2008 10:38 am

tclap is a huge loss in DPS for a warrior just fyi. They have to switch stances to use it and they lose rage by switching stances. thats why they complain. U would too if u had 70 rage and had to dump it all on a stance switch so u could tclap for them.

get deathfrost, its same as tclap but 5% less.
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Postby kalbear » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:21 am

They can QQ all they want. It isn't a huge loss; it's been estimated by most DPS warriors I've talked to at about 20-30 DPS total.

And 5% less attack speed on Brutallus is essentially 5% less damage on the tanks. That is not something you want to give up.

If they're choosing not to do this, they are hurting the raid's attempts.

On JotC - you shouldn't have to worry about it, honestly. I can't imagine a paladin having problems with threat on this fight.
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Postby Consecrate » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:38 am

It's mainly for the crit for my warlocks and such.
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Postby kalbear » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:54 am

Ah, didn't realize you had specced imp jotc. In that case yeah, you definitely need to keep it up; it's a very big boost to rdps on a fight that needs every little bit. Depends on the raid makeup for optimal debuffs, but you'll want to make sure that curse of doom isn't being put up in that case.
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Postby Elsie » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:25 pm

Tell your dps warrior less QQ more pewpew. Arms warriors are there for the buffs.
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Postby Cakes » Tue Aug 05, 2008 12:59 pm

Tell them to keep Tclap up and a rogue can EA the boss. It's a net gain for the raid.
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Postby Worldie » Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:47 pm

Ratanna wrote:tclap is a huge loss in DPS for a warrior just fyi. .

no.


no.



just no.
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Postby PsiVen » Tue Aug 05, 2008 7:35 pm

Rogue -> Imp Expose Armor

You -> Imp JoCr

DPS Warrior -> Imp Demo

DPS Warrior -> TClap

Feral -> tanking in hunter group

Unless you have a ret paladin, this is the best possible DPS setup for Brutallus.
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Postby Snake-Aes » Wed Aug 06, 2008 6:07 am

Worldie wrote:
Ratanna wrote:tclap is a huge loss in DPS for a warrior just fyi. .

no.


no.



just no.
I'd like the documentation for that. Warrior QQ is pretty high on my side too.
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Postby moduspwnens » Wed Aug 06, 2008 6:45 am

I've bugged him about it before. He and Lore said in the famous "Are Pallys used in T6?" thread that you just wait until your rage is low (or burn some), and both Whirlwind and Bloodthirst are on CD, then switch, T-Clap, maybe Bloodthirst if it resists and you have to wait, and switch back. I think Whirlwind is the only DPS move that can only be used in Berserker.

I could see how it might tick them off, cause nobody wants to nerf their own DPS, but Thunder Clap is a big deal.
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Postby Worldie » Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:29 am

Snake-Aes wrote:
Worldie wrote:
Ratanna wrote:tclap is a huge loss in DPS for a warrior just fyi. .

no.


no.



just no.
I'd like the documentation for that. Warrior QQ is pretty high on my side too.

Modus quoted it, it's somewhere in that post from Lore.

Playing a warrior as well, even if it's just in Kara and occasionally ZA, it's so ridicolously simple to keep TC up without nerfing your DPS. I might lose 50-60 DPS if i get a resist, and i'm arms so i got rage issues. Fury warriors shouldn't have any trouble at all, only situation where they "might" lose some DPS is in the low 20% when they would prefer to randomly spam execute.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby DJSticky » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:11 am

Good fury warrior keeping TC up = -3% crit for 4-5 white hits while WW is on CD

Bad fury warrior keeping TC up = losing a ton of rage, missing WW CDs, staying in battle for to long, losing more rage switching back all of which may be less, more or equal to the amount of DPS they aren't doing because they are bad anyway so who cares?

No reason to QQ if you are good at what you do because it is usually part of your job anyway.
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Postby axxon » Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:53 am

PsiVen wrote:


Feral -> tanking in hunter group




Got abit curious when i saw this :) What is your typical tank grp setup on Brutallus? My guild always use 3 BM hunters for their FI buffs wich will gain the 2 tanks for the night with a possible 9% increase dmg output. We got 2 warrior, 1 Feral and me as Prot Paladin, so it varies who gets to tank. But either way the 2 tanks get 3 BM in their grp. Even though i dont completely agree with this setup because we dont get anything to help us during stomp, the threat increase is nice, but im sure i could live without it :wink: . And we have downed him 3 times now, so he's practicly "on farm" :wink:
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Postby Worldie » Fri Aug 08, 2008 9:16 am

Actually our usual tank group is interesting, depending on who tanks:

Druid + Warrior:
Druid
Warrior
Hunter
Hunter
Hunter or DPS War

Druid + Paladin:
Druid
Hunter
Hunter
Paladin
Hunter or DPS War

Warrior + Paladin
Paladin
Warrior
Hunter
Hunter
DPS War or Feral Druid or Resto Druid or Hunter

However, last week we had me + war again, but we went for tank party like this
Prot War
Hunter
Hunter
Hunter
Feral Druid (dpsing)
and i was in the healer group for maximum DPS synergy in G1. Well Improved Devotion aura isn't that bad after all :P I just had to remind my healers i had 3% less dodge and 1 less Stomp button since i had to wear some stamina gear over avoidance gear due to lack of Commanding Shout
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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