[WOTLK] Blessing of Salvation v.s. Hand of Salvation

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[WOTLK] Blessing of Salvation v.s. Hand of Salvation

Postby Karathos » Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:06 pm

-Blessing of Salvation renamed Hand of Salvation, now reduces total threat on the target by 2% per second for 10 seconds while also reducing all damage and healing done by 10%. Only one Hand spell can be on the target per paladin at any one time. Now costs 6% of base mana.


Okay, folks ... the question is with this ability now taking 6% of base mana AND it no longer being castable like the greater blessings (i.e. affecting everyone in a class in a raid), how will this affect threat for DPS/Healing classes? (Casting Hand of Salvation on a Healer or now means that they will do 10% less healing and dps for the time that the blessing lasts.)

Given that I'm not seeing much other than increased threat generation for the tanking folks, and no apparent new -threat talents for dps/healers ... what is the general take on this change?
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Re: [WOTLK] Blessing of Salvation v.s. Hand of Salvation

Postby Jtree » Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:09 pm

It's to help the classes without threat dumps.
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Postby Vencedor » Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:13 pm

Also means that everyone might have to work a little harder on watching the threat table than before.

DPS classes need to be more responsible and tanks need to work a little harder at putting out as much as possible, as well as controlling the ssituation when it gets to be too close.

Not like we Paladins weren't doing that before, anyway. We pride ourselves on the amount of threat we put out, so this should come pretty naturally for the majority of us.
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Re: [WOTLK] Blessing of Salvation v.s. Hand of Salvation

Postby Soltyr » Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:18 pm

Karathos wrote:
-Blessing of Salvation renamed Hand of Salvation, now reduces total threat on the target by 2% per second for 10 seconds while also reducing all damage and healing done by 10%. Only one Hand spell can be on the target per paladin at any one time. Now costs 6% of base mana.


Okay, folks ... the question is with this ability now taking 6% of base mana AND it no longer being castable like the greater blessings (i.e. affecting everyone in a class in a raid), how will this affect threat for DPS/Healing classes? (Casting Hand of Salvation on a Healer or now means that they will do 10% less healing and dps for the time that the blessing lasts.)

Given that I'm not seeing much other than increased threat generation for the tanking folks, and no apparent new -threat talents for dps/healers ... what is the general take on this change?


HoS is completely a new different ability added to the paladin arsenal.
Nothing interrelated with BoS or replaced to.

It's a Soulshatter alike ability (castable on target).

As said, the -30% threat reduction loss is compensated in more tank threat. Dpser will watch their threat in WotlK in the same way like they do now in TBC ;)

[edit]: according to the wowhead tooltip there is not dmg/healing reduction
http://wotlk.wowhead.com/?spell=1038
Last edited by Soltyr on Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ahms » Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:23 pm

i'm pretty sure it will be compensated by the fact that we, and other tanks, will be putting out a ton more damage and threat than we ever had. they probably took out the old salv to make agro-rips still possible, and maybe also so that if you don't happen to have a pally in your 5 man or whatever, you don't have to feel bad about no salv
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Postby Dorvan » Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:46 pm

If you're just comparing one ability to the other, HoSalv is strictly inferior to BoSalv. However, in the overall context of WotLK changes I'm sure threat will be balanced in the end and the change makes Pallies, esp Holy Pallies, more interactive.
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Postby solina » Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:33 pm

Dorvan wrote: the change makes Pallies, esp Holy Pallies, more interactive.


If I ever took my pally holy, I think the last thing I would want to do is micromanage my party's threat.
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Postby Jtree » Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:54 pm

I've seen some stuff saying it'll have a two minute cooldown, so hopefully no one is going to have to become the threat-bot now.
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Postby Makaijin » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:10 pm

I can see myself making a macro for this already.

/castsequence Righteous Defense, Hand of Salvation

That lock repulling aggro after your taunt fades? Take my bitch slap of Salvation.

Well the actual macro will be more complicated due to how RF works, but you get the drift.
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Postby Shamora » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:34 pm

Once again I'd like to point out another note in the beta notes:

Tranquil Air Totem has been removed. (Threat is being addressed by modifications to the base threat of players and/or "baked" into tanking abilities.)

From the sound of things tanks are going to do more threat and DPS are gonna do reduced threat such as:

Shadowform (Shadow): Now has an innate 30% threat reduction. Now has a shapeshift UI.

I'm willing to bet that after the changes we will be at about the same threat difference as if all the DPS had a constant Salv/Tranq. The new Hand of Salv will be used to cool off those over active or over geared DPS that start to pass the tank. Spamming this won't be the only task of some unlucky Holy Pally, but instead will be an extra thing to keep an eye out for instead of just smashing a couple of buttons.
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Postby PsiVen » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:37 pm

There's no real point in comparing them because HoS is just a cooldown ability and:

Ahms wrote:i'm pretty sure it will be compensated by the fact that we, and other tanks, will be putting out a ton more damage and threat than we ever had. they probably took out the old salv to make agro-rips still possible, and maybe also so that if you don't happen to have a pally in your 5 man or whatever, you don't have to feel bad about no salv
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Postby Jarkeld » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:39 pm

Okay, folks ... the question is with this ability now taking 6% of base mana AND it no longer being castable like the greater blessings

you seem to imply that 6% of base mana is a lot, cleanse costs 6% of base mana untalented, so hardly worth mentioning
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Postby Sabindeus » Sun Jul 20, 2008 9:51 pm

The way I read this, is that what it does is reduces the target's total current threat value, not the threat he produces while it's up.
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Postby moduspwnens » Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:01 pm

Sabindeus wrote:The way I read this, is that what it does is reduces the target's total current threat value, not the threat he produces while it's up.


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Postby aranil » Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:13 pm

That...that makes it very nice, and also very fun. My Kara groups love to mess around, tossing that on the MT would be really fun....>.>
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