Shattered halls question

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Shattered halls question

Postby Meatydog » Thu Jun 26, 2008 10:06 pm

Ive been running shattered halls every chance i get unless i get called off for something that is a harder instance to get a group for or a guildie pipes up.

Today in shattered halls i gotta complaint that we was moving too slow. Cause we(tankadins) rely on mana and without it we are nothing. And war tanks are much better cause its better for them to stayin fights to keep their rage.

But being able to take shattered halls with no CC and pulling 9 guys at once isnt fast enough?

Maybe im wrong or something. And i hope i didnt post this in the wrong area. If so move it where it should go.

I think basically my question is how slow is too slow?
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Postby Fivelives » Thu Jun 26, 2008 10:37 pm

For normal shattered halls? I blow through that in about 40 minutes (I have to drink more in normal than on heroic). Heroic is around 25-30 minutes or so, depending on healer mana and group comp.

Group composition can slow you down more than anything else. If you've got 3 melee classes and a healer with you, shat halls is going to seem to take forever. Every aoe class you bring (I personally <3 2x warlock/1x spriest shat halls groups) cuts the time nearly exponentially.
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Postby Marker » Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:04 pm

It also depends on what's slowing your down group down. If it's you needing to drink, I'd suggest the following:
Go all out threat on Skull (first kill)
Throw a JoR on second kill
Keep Consecrate up at all time
switch to last mob in the killorder, JoW, SoW and keep a downranked conc running should there be need for more threat.

This of course gets hard if everything is AoE'ed down and goes down simultaiously, but there's normally at least one single target DPS class in the raid which means that there will be some mobs going down later than others.

Also switching some mitigation gear for threat gear, or any gearswitch that provides a higher dmg income, is fine if you can survive it. Means you'll have to spend less mana to generate the same threat. Normally the healer has some time to drink while you pull and LoS the group. I'd also suggest to spam the drink button the second the mobs are down. Especially if you're on free manna biscs/magewater. One tick is still a wee bit of mana. Also make sure U drink the second you finish a boss, so your regenerating mana while hte group loots.

Doing these small alterations makes it smoother and you will shine more as a tank. From my own experience (semi-OK geared: kara+crafted+all badgeupgrades), being able to do swift no-bullshit runs without wasting time have gotten me a steady crowd of BT/sunwell geared DPS/healers wanting to do HCs with me, which certainly cuts the time the runs take significantly.
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Postby Aerfalle » Thu Jun 26, 2008 11:23 pm

Just keep tanking and keep trying to be faster until you want to know the answer "how fast is too fast?" :D

Once you have enough practice, you'll figure out how to downgear for what you're doing and you'll pull more mobs, butt-tank, sit, cast, bring a spriest, pot, whatever to get mana back. Not to mention you'll gauge your threat on mobs to see whether you need to continue your rotation at full force. Make sitting to drink your last resort!
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Postby Marker » Fri Jun 27, 2008 12:10 am

...and Omen or any other common threat-meter is a great tool. However, your party members need to have it too though. If only one or a few have it, I normally ask how the ones that don't have are doing on the damage meters compared to the ones that do have it, and you've got some faint idea at least. Then you can JoW SoW once you see your threat is high enough.
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Postby Dendrah » Fri Jun 27, 2008 12:58 am

Run both Omen and Recount visible so you can measure where your DPS aggro is.

As long as you have your taunt off CD you could even stop doing full TPS and see if they can catch up. As soon as they do I taunt and judge and I'm back in business.

You don't have to do dmg... you have to be the most annoying! Don't try to be top on Omen but make sure you don't let the DPS pass 110/130%.

Less TPS is less mana use.

My trick is mainly to start in my full SD gear and tell my healer to warn me if he can't hold it. 75+% I end up doing almost all pulls with full SD gear.

Also don't be scared to pull with 50% mana. As long as you can toss your frisbee, seal-judge-seal , Hs and Conc with your initial mana you'll do fine. The rest of the mana comes from SA.
Just don't pull when just your frisbee will get you oom.
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Postby Neejo » Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:06 am

I once received the answer: " you're a dwarf, you're supposed to drink" :D
Ebann `Protection Paladin ` Shattered Hand - EU
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Postby Argali » Fri Jun 27, 2008 3:28 am

Have you taken into account people being retards, and the tankadin bias?

90% of people I've run through SH with love tankadins now. The 10% are people refuse to believe that pallys can tank. Even when you prove it.
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Postby Dakiros » Fri Jun 27, 2008 8:42 am

My guild won't even run H SH unless I am tanking it and our warriors are pretty damn good. How long does it take you to run through?
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Postby Meatydog » Fri Jun 27, 2008 8:46 am

Dendrah wrote:Run both Omen and Recount visible so you can measure where your DPS aggro is.


My Threat meter that i use doesnt require anyone to have a threat library load or omen or anything. Its called Diamond threat meter and you can have up to 3 different meters going. its pretty awesome.
Itll show your target threat, the threat on other people beating on you, hollers at you when your about to lose aggro on the target mob and you can always watch the other and see who is about to get aggro.

when it hollers at you its says "Hey Wake the F*** up! Time to start tanking again!" but you can change it according to your tastes.

But enough of that.

I dont have a problem holding aggro with people that are geared like me or maybe with a few epics. But like a lock or a rouge with full epics its a little difficult. So then i make them sad by putting salv on em haha.

I think unbuffed i hav roughly 4.5k mana.
And from what most of the concensus is saying on here is to either downgrade or get hurt so i get healed. or when everyone is about to run in switch to heroic. haha, jk on the last one.

Thanks alot for the responses. Ill prolly have to take a bit from everyones posts and mash it into one thing and work it like a stripper or something.

Thanks again! 8)
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Postby Lookit » Fri Jun 27, 2008 8:49 am

Uh...

I'm pretty sure that if you are pulling those nice big packs with no CC and then AOE'ing them down, if someone says "Man, we are going so slow!" they are probably being sarcastic.

If people are used to running SH with a warrior tank, the first time they see a pally do it is pretty cool. That would be my take on the situation.
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Postby Kelaan » Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:15 am

If this is normal shattered halls, you might be able to get away with pulling two groups at once in some places. You should probably warn your healer, though. ;)
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Postby Ironia » Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:35 am

Meatydog wrote:But like a lock or a rouge with full epics its a little difficult. So then i make them sad by putting salv on em haha.


Salv = 30% more dps with my lock. I can get over 2.5k dps with seeds in SH. Definitely nothing to be sad about.
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Postby Ashmadai » Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:45 am

I would tell them if they can find a warrior or druid tank who can tank Shattered Halls as fast as I can, I will pay for their wow account for a year.

Also, if a group in a heroic is going slowly, it's generally because the DPS is killing things slowly, in my experience.
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Postby jere » Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:26 pm

Ironia wrote:
Meatydog wrote:But like a lock or a rouge with full epics its a little difficult. So then i make them sad by putting salv on em haha.


Salv = 30% more dps with my lock. I can get over 2.5k dps with seeds in SH. Definitely nothing to be sad about.


Actually it is up to 42.857% more DPS for your lock. A 30% reduction in threat is not the same as 30% possible increase in dps, it's more.
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