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Prince Safe Spots?

Attumen, Moroes, Maiden, Opera, Curator, Illhoof, Aran, Netherspite, Chess, Prince, Nightbane

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Postby Loganb1104 » Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:59 am

Why would you NOT want to do the fight as it was intended. It's pretty clear that Blizzard set up the mechanics to create a fight that requires all members of the raid to be mindful of their positioning (both away from prince and away from the infernals) and become mobile when appropriate. It's a perfect example of a fight that teaches players skills that they'll need later in the game. If you cant get out of the way of a few infernals, how can you possibly hope to consistently move out of flame patches on Al'ar, dodge orbs on VR (now that DBM doesn't announce who's being targeted), stay away from volcanoes on Supremus, or dodge eye beams on Illidan?

I reiterate, why wouldn't you want to learn, hone, and perfect these skills when they're relatively easy to execute? You're only selling your self short by killing bosses the "easy way."

I appreciate a discussion of whether or not the "safe spots" tactic still works, if only for the sake of knowing if it's available when you're especially short on time and can't afford a wipe, or you're farming the instance and just want a quick clear. Just remember that doing fights as they were intended to be done can be challenging and ::GASP!:: fun.
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Postby turion350 » Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:57 am

You know, I find it curious on how this topic brings anger in people. If there is a safe spot, who cares. Some will use it, some will not. Does not make them cheat, hack or any other thing. If it was intended not to be fought like that ever, it wouldn't be possible. Finding an easier way is not a "cheat", its simply finding the shortest route from Point "A" to Point "B". We in the military do not do a fight, because that is the way our enemy intended it to be, but the way we see you can win it. You see an opening that is a tactical advantage, you take it. Plain and Simple.

It may seem cheap, or easy, but hey, that is battle.C-130 Gunships may seem like cheating because they can't be shot back at by insurgents, but hey it gets the job done. I know there will be many replies to this as... "but you are not supposed to do that". Hey, if it helps them get their job done, so be it. If I ever found the safe spot, I would use it, why not? If it makes it go quicker and not lose raid members. As for training for other end game instances, some people may not be looking at going there, and they will just have to learn when/if they get there.
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Postby Catriona » Thu Apr 24, 2008 4:02 am

Out of curiousity do you feel the same about the Archimonde "exploit" (using the hill to escape the doomfire)? :D
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Postby Loganb1104 » Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:01 am

Just like the safe spots on Prince, the Archimonde doomfire exploit has been fixed. There's now an invisible wall surrounding the hillside. That strategy was total fail in the first place, because any guild that can kill Vashj and Kael can certainly learn and execute the Archimonde fight. They were just being lazy by standing in the hills to avoid the most difficult part of the encounter. Now that people don't have to ever even see SSC and TK to go to Hyjal, I'm glad that they have to work for it to get their t6 heads. ::evil grin::

And turion, you make some very good points. Just remember, this isn't war, it's Warcraft. Of course it makes sense when in a life or death situation to do everything you can to succeed and survive (even if you're not necessarily "playing fair"), but this is a game with few if any consequences for real life. The purpose of the game is to derive pleasure.

If pleasure in raiding comes from getting purple gear and badges, then by all means do things in the quickest and easiest way possible... even if that way is not what was intended by the game designers.

If pleasure in raiding comes from working with 9, 24, or 39 other players to learn and complete a task, then do things the way they were supposed to be done. It's not cheating to do things the easy way, but it certainly feels like it to me when I do it.

I guess it's just a matter of personal preference.
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Postby turion350 » Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:22 am

Logan I see your point and agree, it is a game and play as it pleases. The one big thing I was commenting on is how it seems to bring out such anger in the people calling others that used the "safe spots". I was pointing out that, that is the way they enjoyed versus those who like to move and do it the other way. For some guilds, that might be the only way they can get him is what I was saying and for them to kill Prince, it is important enough to do it with the very hot topic of "safe spots":) But yes, this is a game, and to each his own, not anyone here to criticize how they do it
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Postby mustangofold » Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:06 am

My guild killed Prince the first couple of times by doing a watch the skys and move method. It was annoying, mostly because of the totally random drops. No skill required, just luck of were they fall.

So now we use "safe" spots. USUALLY I am fine in our tank safe spot, but I have had 2 infernals on me at the same time once.

As it was intended or not, it is not something I care to bother with when farming heroic marks or gearing up an alt.
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Postby Aenema » Fri Apr 25, 2008 6:48 am

I'ts not like its so totally impossible to kill him after 2.4.

We noticed teh safespots were gone the first day after patch. We saw infernal incoming, we moved.. and kept moving away from new infernals.. No problems and kill on first try.

L2move dps..
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Postby Loganb1104 » Fri Apr 25, 2008 8:23 am

But seeing a giant farting infernal land and then running away from it is hard, amirite?

(sorry, had to say it)

Seriously, though. Learning to be mobile isn't just a skill for endgame raiding. Even if your primary focus is PvP or BGs, the ability to recognize what's going on in a situation and adjust accordingly will help you greatly. Might as well get out of the habit of standing there and DPSing/Tanking earlier rather than later.
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Postby sweeney » Fri Apr 25, 2008 11:32 am

I was relieved that we now have to run him around and reposition during the fight. If new folks need to wipe a half dozen times to get used to movement fights, I'd rather that happen in a 10-man than with 25. Unless Prince is the furthest boss in progression you ever plan to fight, you're not gaining much by being able to fight him in a static position.

Having a clued-in ranged DPS with a mark on their head serving as spotter and positioning away from infernals and out of range of shadow nova does make it much easier. As tank you really can't see that well and have other things on your mind.
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