Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Warning: Theorycraft inside.

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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Schroom » Tue Nov 25, 2014 7:21 am

yep and I think this is a good thing. it brings back the holy trinity of Tank - DPS - Healer

everybody needs to perform their roles right in order for a team to be strong. previously you could kinda compensate if one f those 3 was bad.

btw I did some sims to confirm what My logic told me already. for fights with lots of adds HS really shines for TMI. which makes it my default talent for CMs.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Wonton » Tue Nov 25, 2014 2:01 pm

November 25 hotfixes:

Protection

  • Mastery: Divine Bulwark now increases Shield of the Righteous' damage reduction by 0.5% per point, down from 0.75% per point.
  • Grand Crusader now also has a 30% chance to trigger its effect from Crusader Strike and Hammer of the Righteous.
  • Shield of the Righteous now reduces physical damage taken by 25% (up from 20%).

Initial thoughts: Obviously, the value of Mastery is lowered, and the value of Haste goes up with the GC change. I'm worried that the Haste buff might not be enough, though, which means that since Mastery got nerfed we'll end up with an even worse stat priority of BA > Crit/Multi/Vers > Haste > Mastery.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Klaudandus » Tue Nov 25, 2014 2:22 pm

I'd guess that Mastery doesn't get hit that hard if only because of Holy Shield.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby viperjason » Tue Nov 25, 2014 2:29 pm

Wonton wrote:November 25 hotfixes:

Protection

  • Mastery: Divine Bulwark now increases Shield of the Righteous' damage reduction by 0.5% per point, down from 0.75% per point.
  • Grand Crusader now also has a 30% chance to trigger its effect from Crusader Strike and Hammer of the Righteous.
  • Shield of the Righteous now reduces physical damage taken by 25% (up from 20%).

Initial thoughts: Obviously, the value of Mastery is lowered, and the value of Haste goes up with the GC change. I'm worried that the Haste buff might not be enough, though, which means that since Mastery got nerfed we'll end up with an even worse stat priority of BA > Crit/Multi/Vers > Haste > Mastery.


Initial thoughts is that this makes Haste much better. In fact isnt the GC proc similar to one we had in early MoP?

At low mastery levels, our current sera rotation still seems viable.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Schroom » Tue Nov 25, 2014 2:50 pm

if I read it correctly, with 15% mastery this makes:

before: 20+(15*0,75) = 31,25
hotfix: 25+(15*0,5) = 32,5

edit: this makes it a SoTR nerf past 20% mastery and a buff prior to that.
Last edited by Schroom on Wed Nov 26, 2014 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Hexzon » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:01 pm

So trinkets are seriously all over the place atm.
I've picked up a http://www.wowdb.com/items/114553-grandiose-resistance From 630 Follower Mission, its basically as good as mythic trinkets, also the 665 boe trinket gives like 600 stamina its pretty crazy

Its all bit over the place atm
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Schroom » Wed Nov 26, 2014 1:44 am

Schroom wrote:if I read it correctly, with 15% mastery this makes:

before: 20+(15*0,75) = 31,25
hotfix: 25+(15*0,5) = 32,5

edit: this makes it a SoTR nerf past 20% mastery and a buff prior to that.


as 110 Masteryrating = 1% mastery,

this means that the statscaling goes up from

previously: 147 mastery for 1% SoTR Reduction. (110/0.75)
to now: 220 mastery for 1% SoTR reduction. (110/0.5)
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Lastwolf » Wed Nov 26, 2014 2:22 am

Hexzon wrote:So trinkets are seriously all over the place atm.
I've picked up a http://www.wowdb.com/items/114553-grandiose-resistance From 630 Follower Mission, its basically as good as mythic trinkets, also the 665 boe trinket gives like 600 stamina its pretty crazy

Its all bit over the place atm



Yeah, I just got a 615 Trinket that's better than both my 630 ones, so this is the second piece of gear I've downgraded to upgrade.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Schroom » Tue Dec 02, 2014 7:37 am

I did a comparison of Weapon enchants for my actual preraid set and the T17 Mythic set for Mark of Blackrock and Mark of Bleeding Hollow.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/387 ... _T17M.html

they are quite close. you need to keep in mind that "hollow" also proccs when not taking damage. Blackrock only proccs when you are below 50% life so you won't see any use of it if the content you do is too trivial.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby theckhd » Tue Dec 02, 2014 6:43 pm

I also suspect that SimC will over-estimate Blackrock's effect unless you tweak the sim some. By default you'll be at negative hit points for all but the first few seconds, giving it much higher uptime than it should have.

What you need to add is some sort of a raid event that resets your health to ~90% every 5 or 6 seconds. That shouldn't affect TMI, but should give a better estimation of Blackrock's value since it'll reduce the effective proc rate.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby viperjason » Mon Dec 08, 2014 10:56 pm

Be still my heart...they changed the procs on crit...
Temporary buffs that increase Critical Strike should now correctly increase Parry through Riposte for tanking specializations.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Extermi » Tue Dec 09, 2014 12:34 am

viperjason wrote:Be still my heart...they changed the procs on crit...
Temporary buffs that increase Critical Strike should now correctly increase Parry through Riposte for tanking specializations.


So lets wait if they fix Seraphim to not offer additional Parry - or this will simply blow all other Lev 100 talents out of the water I guess. Which would be a shame since I prefer to keep with my old love, holy shield :-)

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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby theckhd » Tue Dec 09, 2014 4:53 pm

The extra 1000 parry will be gone as of reset today. Apparently that fix took a server restart to apply, whereas the crit->parry rating fix didn't.

Also I just found out Censure doesn't scale with haste anymore, so I'm fixing that in SimC as well.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Finkum » Tue Dec 09, 2014 8:40 pm

theckhd wrote:Also I just found out Censure doesn't scale with haste anymore, so I'm fixing that in SimC as well.


Presumably this will reduce the stat value of haste even further - oh dear!
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Jackinthegreen » Tue Dec 09, 2014 9:13 pm

Finkum wrote:
theckhd wrote:Also I just found out Censure doesn't scale with haste anymore, so I'm fixing that in SimC as well.


Presumably this will reduce the stat value of haste even further - oh dear!


For DPS only, so it's not a nerf to tanking really since no effect trigger off Censure. Prot is already doing well on damage compared to other tanks if SimC's list is accurate so the nerf will just lower us a bit.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby theckhd » Wed Dec 10, 2014 6:22 am

The nerf won't affect the SimC rankings at all - we're using SoI in those rankings, I believe. It will still be a slight nerf to our DPS while using SoT of course.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby theckhd » Fri Dec 12, 2014 7:38 am

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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Schroom » Mon Dec 15, 2014 6:49 am



is this WITH the change to Mark of Blackrock?

apparently they changed it to 60% with a guaranteed Procc if we fall below 60% (considering the ICD of course)
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby theckhd » Tue Dec 16, 2014 4:16 pm

Yes, that was post-buff.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Lastwolf » Fri Dec 19, 2014 8:42 am

Did they not nerf it from proccing in the first 40 seconds aswell though ?
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby Daeva001 » Fri Dec 19, 2014 11:47 am

That's the first 40 seconds from equipping the weapon. It's meant to curb weapon-swap shenanigans due to the 100% proc rate, and has no effect in practice.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby theckhd » Fri Jan 16, 2015 1:14 pm

Doing some quick tests with Empowered Seals post-SoT-nerf.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/62d8am975wbma ... .html?dl=0

Image

In this sim, I'm switching up with buffs we're maintaining. ES_SoR, ES_SoI, and ES_SoT just sit in their respective seals with no twisting. ES_IR twists insight and righteousness, ES_IT insight and truth, ES_TR truth and righteousness.
ES_3seals twists all three (usual APL).

SoI is still the TMI winner, but IR is a close second. As such, there does not appear to be a survivability benefit to twisting all three seals.

SoR is the DPS winner, meaning there's little point in twisting all three seals for DPS.

The only niche the 3-seal actor appears to inhabit is that it's still a pretty good compromise between DPS and survival, but ES_IR isn't really that much less efficient. I suspect that in practice you're actually better off using SoI and SoR and just letting insight drop off while not tanking anything to boost DPS.

TLDR: I think 3-seal twisting is gone.
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby DisRuptive1 » Sat Jan 17, 2015 3:51 pm

Does ES_SoI suck compared to Holy Shield or the nerfed Seraphim (+750 to stats)?
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby golfinguy » Sat Jan 17, 2015 5:15 pm

[EDIT] Nevermind - skipped ahead without reading the full instructions. Wish I could blame drunkenness, but this was all before I had my scotch. (sigh)
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Re: Theck's Simcraft Thread - WoD/6.x

Postby theckhd » Sun Jan 18, 2015 2:36 am


In addition, I went back and ran two talent sims with ES included. The first twists all 3 seals:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ssukln88afs539o/talents_es3.html?dl=0
Image

As you can see, 3-seal twisting is mostly useless. Can't keep up with either HS or Sera in DPS or TMI. Don't really see the point.

The second one has actors twisting just IR (ES_SW, ES_HA, ES_DP) and two additional actors that just use a single seal (ES_HA_SoR and ES_HA_SoI). For fairness I've also added an actor that sits in SoR with Seraphim (Sera_HA_SoR) and Holy Shield (HS_HA_SoR).

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8ha6b4mlzv5fkv9/talents_es2.html?dl=0
Image

IR twisting isn't really a whole lot better, though at least it isn't as significant a TMI loss. But again, there seems to be little point in using them. It might be a slight DPS increase over HS if you're only tanking half the time, but Sera would still be hands-down better.

ES_HA_SoI sits in SoI, and gives you roughly the same survivability as Sera, but at a huge DPS loss. Again, why bother.
ES_HA_SoR is barely ahead of Sera_HA in DPS, and costs a huge chunk of survivability. I don't really see that ever being a trade worth making, as if you're willing to give up that survivability you'd be willing to give up a little more and just sit in SoR with HS or Sera for even more damage.

As a final thought, let's assume we alternate between IR (tanking) and R (off-tanking), we can estimate the results as the average of ES_HA_SoR (23088 DPS, 110k TMI) and ES_HA (20904 DPS, 102k TMI). TMI would still be the smaller of the two (irrelevant while not tanking), so we'd get an actor doing around 21996 DPS on average with 102k TMI. This is still worse than HS_HA or Sera_HA (even with the usual caveat about HS's damage being an over-estimate).

TLDR: There doesn't seem to be any configuration in which Empowered Seals is worth using right now.
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