Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby Zibey » Tue Jan 11, 2011 2:27 am

I am not sure it's right topic to post in, but I can't seem to find any comparison between TPS from reckoning, and grand crusader with glyph of focused shield (or how is it called). I should also probably mention, that I also won't have 10 expertise from SoV glyph (or how is it called now - I dinged like 2 days ago after a year break, so forgive me if I don't know new spell names), which probably will affect reckoning a bit (for the most of time at least - its supposed to be self healing heavy build).
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby Durability » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:29 am

Focused Shield would increase GC's effect by 30% on a single target (and I assume that's the only place you'd consider using it). Reckoning would lose approximately 5% value from enemy dodges and parries. But since the gap in the first place is well over 2:1, Reckoning still wins out by a substantial margin - it's still 80-90% better, even against a single target.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby theckhd » Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:52 am

The Talent Comparison on the first page has exactly the information you're looking for.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby Sarkan-ZdC » Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:44 am

Vengeance Calculation
The Vengeance calculation is working correctly as far as we can ascertain. Vengeance caps at a number equal to Stamina plus 10% of base health, which is lower than 10% of health. When we buffed Stamina late in Cataclysm development, we specifically did not buff Vengeance because we didn’t think tanks needed 40% additional attack power in order to maintain threat or contribute to damage done by the group. The Vengeance tooltip is a little misleading, but in this case we think that’s fine because a more technically accurate tooltip would be quite long. Astute theorycrafters will understand the difference, while most tanks won’t actually be affected by the delta. (Source)


Was that information known before? Does it change the threat stats (specifically how good stamina is as a tps stat?)
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby theckhd » Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:27 am

All of the calculations currently up are based on pure hit-point scaling. We only became aware of the error last week. It's effectively like running at ~80% vengeance instead of 100%. So the value of stamina as a threat stat is about 20% lower than what's in the plots. The corrected Vengeance formula is already updated in the code base, but isn't going to be reflected in the posts until I update everything for 4.0.6.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby kristoferpally » Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:30 am

Has anyone any new information on the bugged block meta gem? No mention of it was made in the 4.06 notes I've seen thus far :(
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby Arees » Wed Jan 12, 2011 7:06 pm

kristoferpally wrote:Has anyone any new information on the bugged block meta gem? No mention of it was made in the 4.06 notes I've seen thus far :(


Thats because it might not actually be bugged, but suffers from an unclear tooltip.

The "bug" is that the tooltip says it increases the amount blocked by 5%, but when you equip it, your character screen block value does not go to 35%. This is because 30 * 1.05 = 31.5. I can't remember if the character screen truncates this to 31 or rounds up to 32. My memory says it truncates it, so only shows 31%, though my memory could be faulty.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby Durability » Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:28 pm

It truncates, both on the tooltip and some testing I did on beta.

If the tooltip is accurate, it still does it even with HS's 10% bonus, where 40*1.05 should be 42 even.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby kristoferpally » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:24 am

so worth wearing or no? my gut says yes but what do I know :oops:
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby theckhd » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:55 am

Durability wrote:It truncates, both on the tooltip and some testing I did on beta.

If the tooltip is accurate, it still does it even with HS's 10% bonus, where 40*1.05 should be 42 even.


Does the character sheet read 42% block with Holy Shield active? I was under the impression it was still 41%, indicating that it wasn't multiplicative, but was simply adding a flat 1% to the blocked amount.

My work in the derivations thread leads me to believe that the meta is not 'bugged' at all, but that it was determined to be too powerful at 5% late in beta and was adjusted so that its benefit was closer to what the 2% armor meta grants. In all likelihood, they changed it to a flat 1% and just never updated the tooltip (or they made it a multiplicative 5% and left the tooltip ambiguous, depending on what the HS test tells us).
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby sculder » Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:34 pm

theckhd wrote:
Durability wrote:It truncates, both on the tooltip and some testing I did on beta.

If the tooltip is accurate, it still does it even with HS's 10% bonus, where 40*1.05 should be 42 even.


Does the character sheet read 42% block with Holy Shield active? I was under the impression it was still 41%, indicating that it wasn't multiplicative, but was simply adding a flat 1% to the blocked amount.

My work in the derivations thread leads me to believe that the meta is not 'bugged' at all, but that it was determined to be too powerful at 5% late in beta and was adjusted so that its benefit was closer to what the 2% armor meta grants. In all likelihood, they changed it to a flat 1% and just never updated the tooltip (or they made it a multiplicative 5% and left the tooltip ambiguous, depending on what the HS test tells us).


I've been using the BV meta for a few weeks now and plan on parsing some logs when I have time. Also, I'll test the HS question when I get home.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby sculder » Thu Jan 13, 2011 7:41 pm

41% on tooltip with hs active
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby theckhd » Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:55 pm

If you have time, take a look at the Call to Arms thread. I think we still want a data set where you take a beating from a mob (hit size >1000 probably) with the meta active so we can determine exactly what the effect of the meta is. Though I suspect based on the tooltip it's a flat 1%.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby Panemtorvra » Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:15 pm

I've taken only a quick look, but given block value's consistency I think it's plenty. I block 44.9% of all damage with BV meta and HS active, likely due to rounding. I've been using the BV meta for a while, I believe it to have been hotfixed several patches ago.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB thread - Cataclysm/4.x

Postby theckhd » Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:50 am

Do you have parses that I can browse to confirm that? If the meta were actually giving a full 5% block amount, it would be vastly superior to the armor meta.
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