Remove Advertisements

Terrible Pally TPS

Warning: Theorycraft inside.

Moderators: Fridmarr, Worldie, Aergis, theckhd

Terrible Pally TPS

Postby Fatkenyna23 » Wed Jun 23, 2010 11:00 pm

Hello,

After reading multiple threat issues posts trying to adapt what others have said to my own situation i have to resort to posting just to figure out what i am doing wrong. On the typical raid night of 25m hm i generate and average of 6-9k on bosses. My armor shows my gear that i would typically use in most boss fights http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... cn=Leapold
The main warrior i tank with is Savagebooty and his gear usually looks like this http://www.wowarmory.com/character-shee ... avagebooty

I normally tank with 1-2 warriors or 1 feral tank. Both of which beat me. I use the 696 rotation to the best of my knowledge, using HW and AS when off cd to help with a tps boost. During the first few seconds I generally have to us Avenging Wrath so i can boost my tps. But relaying on those things for threat, makes it very difficult to use them for ablities such as stunning Raging Spirits when they come out or to silence lichs during dreamwalker.

Here is my parse of a raid night on a Saurfang encounter http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/de ... 225#threat
This is the parse of the warrior, (he also went second to focus on stunning adds) http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/de ... 229#threat

On tonight's encounter, of Festergut, generated this http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/de ... 509#threat
To me, this was what i thought as better threat then normal for me but i still feel like i could improve.

Here is another parse from this same night on the BQ encounter in which i sponged. http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/de ... 617#threat
My tps considerably lower then the tps on the same fight 2 weeks ago when i MT the fight http://www.wowmeteronline.com/combat/de ... 335#threat

I found this basic breakdown of how to do the 9696 rotation http://www.wow-pro.com/class_guides/tan ... king_guide but i still find ways to not pull high amounts of threat. I know im limiting the dps from doing the best they can do because they have to constantly watch their threat. Am i missing something with my rotation, improper mechanics, not using macroed rotations? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Fatkenyna23
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 6:07 pm

Re: Terrible Pally TPS

Postby Meloree » Wed Jun 23, 2010 11:20 pm

Your threat stats are fine - it's not gear. You should be able to put out at least 12k TPS in ICC in that gear - probably more. The rotation sounds like a problem.

First, HW and AS are unlikely to be significant TPS gains over straight 969, so it's probably best not to use them in place of rotational abilities. Just focus on executing 969 correctly.

Looking at the Saurfang parse linked: You started like this:
Hammer, Judgement, ShoR, AS, HS, Hammer, Cons, ShoR, Judge, HW, HS, ShoR... etc.

You aren't actually executing 969, and you're pushing back high-damage abilities significantly. Your ability chain should be:
hammer, Judge, ShoR, HS, Hammer, Cons, ShoR, Judge, Hammer, HS, ShoR, Cons - and repeat until boss dies. Focus on using the 5 rotation abilities on-time and weaved together properly - there should be no downtime in your rotation doing that, and Hammer and ShoR should always be used right as they're coming off cooldown. They are the bulk of your threat, and should never be pushed back, as you're doing.

In addition, your rotation has gaps in it - several seconds without a cast. In some cases up to 3 seconds delayed. In addition, your ability usage is sometimes just generally slow, 2 seconds between abilities when it should be very very close to 1.5.

As soon as you cast an ability, you need to know what's coming next, and be machine-gunning that hotkey. Don't wait for the GCD to be up to try and cast - spam the button in advance. This will raise your TPS.
Meloree
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 1420
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:15 am

Re: Terrible Pally TPS

Postby kysu » Thu Jun 24, 2010 10:56 am

Meloree wrote:Your threat stats are fine - it's not gear. You should be able to put out at least 12k TPS in ICC in that gear - probably more. The rotation sounds like a problem.

First, HW and AS are unlikely to be significant TPS gains over straight 969, so it's probably best not to use them in place of rotational abilities. Just focus on executing 969 correctly.

Looking at the Saurfang parse linked: You started like this:
Hammer, Judgement, ShoR, AS, HS, Hammer, Cons, ShoR, Judge, HW, HS, ShoR... etc.

Your ability chain should be:
hammer, Judge, ShoR, HS, Hammer, Cons, ShoR, Judge, Hammer, HS, ShoR, Cons - and repeat until boss dies. .


I thought it was "as far as this board is concerned" HotR Cons ShoR were the top 3 then continue from there based on if you want holy shield up and or if a melee debuff is on the boss.



Edit: pulled from da tps thingy majig

Code: Select all
Ability   DPS   Glyphed    TPS   Glyphed
ShoR      639       0     1644       0 
HotR      760       0     1957       0 
Cons      466       0     1200       0 
JoV       336     370      865     951 
JoC       166       0      428       0 
JoR       322       0      828       0 
AS         76     153      197     393 
HoW       623       0     1604       0 
SoV       704       0     1813       0 
SoC       695       0     1789       0 
SoR       626       0     1612       0 
HV        394       0     1015       0 
HS        209       0      538       0 
Exor      205       0      527       0 
Melee     714       0     1021       0



Also "As soon as you cast an ability, you need to know what's coming next, and be machine-gunning that hotkey. Don't wait for the GCD to be up to try and cast - spam the button in advance. This will raise your TPS." Is good advice lets you get in more "moves" per fight.
Image
User avatar
kysu
 
Posts: 154
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:21 am

Re: Terrible Pally TPS

Postby Meloree » Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:09 am

kysu wrote:
Meloree wrote:Your ability chain should be:
hammer, Judge, ShoR, HS, Hammer, Cons, ShoR, Judge, Hammer, HS, ShoR, Cons - and repeat until boss dies. .


I thought it was "as far as this board is concerned" HotR Cons ShoR were the top 3 then continue from there based on if you want holy shield up and or if a melee debuff is on the boss.


You tend to pre-drop Consecrate at Saurfang. Either way, it's pretty immaterial what order you use them in, after 9 seconds, everything is up and ticking. The point was that HW and AS don't fit in cleanly, especially when they're just added, as opposed to substituted. I just took his rotation and ripped out the extraneous parts, rather than completely rearranging, which is unnecessary.
Meloree
Maintankadonor
 
Posts: 1420
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:15 am

Re: Terrible Pally TPS

Postby kysu » Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:14 am

The point was that HW and AS don't fit in cleanly, especially when they're just added, as opposed to substituted. I just took his rotation and ripped out the extraneous parts, rather than completely rearranging, which is unnecessary.


Fair enough
Image
User avatar
kysu
 
Posts: 154
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2008 10:21 am

Re: Terrible Pally TPS

Postby Kelaan » Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:22 pm

Meloree wrote:The point was that HW and AS don't fit in cleanly, especially when they're just added, as opposed to substituted. I just took his rotation and ripped out the extraneous parts, rather than completely rearranging, which is unnecessary.

Well, and according to the tps listing that Kysu crossposted from the threat thread, Holy Wrath and Avenger's Shield are lower threat/sec than the normal 9/6 skills. Sure, they're good for initial burst stuff, but you shouldn't need them past that, unless perhaps to replace a Holy Shield cast.

On Saurfang, I often feel like I am doing less tps than I could be - postponing HotR or consecration until adds are safely away often puts a crimp in my rotation.
User avatar
Kelaan
 
Posts: 4036
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:01 pm

Re: Terrible Pally TPS

Postby Gamingdevil » Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:26 pm

Kelaan wrote:
Meloree wrote:The point was that HW and AS don't fit in cleanly, especially when they're just added, as opposed to substituted. I just took his rotation and ripped out the extraneous parts, rather than completely rearranging, which is unnecessary.

Well, and according to the tps listing that Kysu crossposted from the threat thread, Holy Wrath and Avenger's Shield are lower threat/sec than the normal 9/6 skills. Sure, they're good for initial burst stuff, but you shouldn't need them past that, unless perhaps to replace a Holy Shield cast.

On Saurfang, I often feel like I am doing less tps than I could be - postponing HotR or consecration until adds are safely away often puts a crimp in my rotation.


Skipping Consecration shouldn't be necessary as it does negligible damage to them. In place of HotR, keep in mind you could put a HW, as the beasts are not undead, but Saurfang is.
If it is weak, kill it before it gets stronger. If it is strong, weaken it.
Image
User avatar
Gamingdevil
 
Posts: 1738
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2008 8:16 am
Location: Belgium


Return to Advanced Theorycraft and Calculations

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Yahoo [Bot] and 1 guest


Remove Advertisements

Who is online

In total there are 2 users online :: 1 registered, 0 hidden and 1 guest (based on users active over the past 5 minutes)
Most users ever online was 380 on Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:28 pm

Users browsing this forum: Yahoo [Bot] and 1 guest