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Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis - WotLK/3.x

Warning: Theorycraft inside.

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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Brand » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:06 am

theckhd wrote:Logged on to do some testing right now.

ShoR confirmed to be dodged and parried.
ShoR triggers a SoRighteousness proc
ShoR triggers a SoVengeance proc
ShoR triggers a SoCommand proc

I think this is a decent confirmation that it's been moved to the melee table.


With this change, granted it's intended and not a bug, does it increase the viability of SoComm as a trash/AoE seal for us? If so, by how much? I play with it now and again myself, and I wonder if this helps justify the point I toss in there (for grins).
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Grehn|Skipjack » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:41 am

Well, it means that if you spec at least one point into JotJ, every ability in our rotation does some sort of aoe, with 3 of the 5 proccing SoComm damage. I only use it in non-ICC heroics though.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Wrathy » Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:24 pm

I ran SoComm for all of the three ICC heroics, using my anub tanking spec, and was pulling 6k dps last night during the trash packs and the wave bosses. I think SoComm is a great tool for tanking heroics. Also, SoComm has been a better AoE seal since the day the mechanics of the skill were changed to its current version.

Anub add tanks all use SoComm to maintain threat and do a significant amount of damage.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby theckhd » Fri Dec 11, 2009 4:17 pm

ShoR confirmed to also proc Vindication. Not sure if it did that before.
It does not seem to add a stack of Holy Vengeance though.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Grehn|Skipjack » Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:42 pm

theckhd wrote:ShoR confirmed to also proc Vindication. Not sure if it did that before.
It does not seem to add a stack of Holy Vengeance though.

It did do that before. Actually, when Vindication was first changed to a Demo effect, ShoR proc'd it 100% of the time. AS continues to do so, but ShoR's debuff application seems about equivalent with HotR.

I wrote up some stuff in that AS/SoComm thread.
Grehn|Skipjack wrote:Yeah, it's definitely JotJ that applies the seal damage, though it doesn't stack Blood Corruption/Holy Vengeance. Judgement is also definitely a "melee attack" with a 10 yard range since it can proc Mongoose. However, Judgement alone fails to do anything with damage seals. It doesn't appear to proc damage seals without JotJ, but it can proc SoL and SoW. ShoR works just like JotJ. It can proc damage seals, but can't stack HV/BC. It can also proc SoW and SoL like Judgement. Btw, this means that ShoR does indeed work with SoCleave. I got pictures, if you want.

Tangentially, would it be possible to graph the tps gained by speccing into JotJ? Since it allows Judgement to proc damage seals, I mean. Obviously all Maintankadins should be specced into it anyway, but it would add another element to it's importance if it's threat levels are high enough, right? Or did you already do that? I'd have to look again.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby theckhd » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:03 pm

JotJ adds 464 damage (SoV proc) every 9 seconds, for around 51 DPS. That'll go up a bit with new gear, since we'll have more STR. I'd guess about 55-60 DPS with 264 gear.

Triple that for SoCommand, of course.

As for the SoCom as a tanking seal question, I just ran about 4-5 heroics with SoCommand, and was pulling 4k+ dps on most trash packs. I managed to break 5k dps on a few of the bigger pulls. That's with 0/5 Reckoning as well - I'm guessing with 3/5 Reckoning instead of Divine Guardian, I could break 6k.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Wrathy » Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:45 pm

theckhd wrote:JotJ adds 464 damage (SoV proc) every 9 seconds, for around 51 DPS. That'll go up a bit with new gear, since we'll have more STR. I'd guess about 55-60 DPS with 264 gear.

Triple that for SoCommand, of course.

As for the SoCom as a tanking seal question, I just ran about 4-5 heroics with SoCommand, and was pulling 4k+ dps on most trash packs. I managed to break 5k dps on a few of the bigger pulls. That's with 0/5 Reckoning as well - I'm guessing with 3/5 Reckoning instead of Divine Guardian, I could break 6k.


Yeah I have a few parses where i break 6.5k for sustained fights in 5 mans, but I have my anub spec, so I actually have 5/5 reck and SoComm
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Grehn|Skipjack » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:07 pm

Can't think of a reason to do more than 3/5 Reck anymore, then. Those two points would be far better spent in JotJ. Really got to get my hands on a Black Icicle or something. Thanks, Theck.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Meloree » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:29 pm

That's fairly impressive.

I hate you both right now. I hate 5-mans, I do them under protest, since I need the 2 frost badges/day, and I suddenly feel a need to break 7k dps in a 5-man because I'm competitive.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Wrathy » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:44 pm

Grehn|Skipjack wrote:Can't think of a reason to do more than 3/5 Reck anymore, then. Those two points would be far better spent in JotJ. Really got to get my hands on a Black Icicle or something. Thanks, Theck.

I had 3/5 and I was still having threat issues so I dropped JotJ. You have to remember that this is my dual spec and the only thing that I really use it for is solo tanking all of Anub's adds on 25 man HM, JotJ really isn't worth it in that case. I had not stepped into a five man in months before this week.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Grehn|Skipjack » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:51 pm

Wrathy wrote:
Grehn|Skipjack wrote:Can't think of a reason to do more than 3/5 Reck anymore, then. Those two points would be far better spent in JotJ. Really got to get my hands on a Black Icicle or something. Thanks, Theck.

I had 3/5 and I was still having threat issues so I dropped JotJ. You have to remember that this is my dual spec and the only thing that I really use it for is solo tanking all of Anub's adds on 25 man HM, JotJ really isn't worth it in that case. I had not stepped into a five man in months before this week.

Well, see, that's just the thing. JotJ should out-threat 2 points in Reckoning. Or, at the very least, 1 point, since all you need is 1 to get Judgement to proc SoComm.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Wrathy » Fri Dec 11, 2009 11:56 pm

You got me thinking, and I am logging on now to respec to tweak a few things again... This damn anub spec is more painful than it should be.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby tlitp » Sat Dec 12, 2009 6:07 am

theckhd wrote:
Raenac wrote:strange new weapon on wowarmory
Last Word
tank weapon?

Yeah, it's certainly an oddity. It's relatively slow for a tank weapon as well (1.8 vs. 1.6), which would lead me to believe it's a threat weapon rather than a defensive weapon, despite the lack of baseline strength.

All around it's just a weird item. I wonder if the stats aren't finalized yet, since nobody can attempt heroic for another two months or more anyhow.

WH lists its proc chance as a static 3%. Assuming it follows the standard proc triggers, LW is... an oddity indeed. With a maximum uptime of ~46%, reached at hit/expertise caps, the difference in weapon "speed" is simply not enough in order to make LW keep pace with its ilvl-equivalent counterparts, BBS and FL.

Given that the proc mechanics stay the same (3% on the standard triggers, 10 sec duration, no ICD), the threat output of LW only shines in (a combination of) two scenarios : reckoning builds and/or high amounts of hit/expertise. With its defensive stats being nowhere near stellar, the current conception of LW seems to be merely an extravaganza. Should be useful for soloing or running dungeons without a dedicated healer, though.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby Brand » Sat Dec 12, 2009 6:25 am

theckhd wrote:JotJ adds 464 damage (SoV proc) every 9 seconds, for around 51 DPS. That'll go up a bit with new gear, since we'll have more STR. I'd guess about 55-60 DPS with 264 gear.

Triple that for SoCommand, of course.

As for the SoCom as a tanking seal question, I just ran about 4-5 heroics with SoCommand, and was pulling 4k+ dps on most trash packs. I managed to break 5k dps on a few of the bigger pulls. That's with 0/5 Reckoning as well - I'm guessing with 3/5 Reckoning instead of Divine Guardian, I could break 6k.


Thanks Theck for answering the question. I've been running with a 3/5 Reckoning spec for awhile and this new information about ShoR being a melee attack now helps. I'll look to pull out some decent numbers now on trash for grins.
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Re: Theck's MATLAB TPS analysis (A Jonesy derivative work)

Postby theckhd » Sat Dec 12, 2009 10:40 am

I hadn't noticed The Facelifter before, I'll have to add that to the list for the next round of the Weapon Analysis.
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