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DPS as Protection

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DPS as Protection

Postby gmoney » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:46 am

As an off tank, sometimes I need to DPS on a boss fight. I'm looking for info on the best way to DPS as a protection spec.

I'm wondering what kind of gear I should be wearing, what kind of gemming and what kind of damage rotation.

I know the obvious answer is wear Ret gear with your sword and board, but I want to keep tanking gear on too be ready to tank during the fight if needed.

Right now I have a block value/strength set and I guess thats the way to go.

Are there any threads out there that have advice and theory on this?
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Postby Dorvan » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:55 am

Honestly, you should never use an entire raid slot just to have a tank around in case the main one dies....it's simply a waste. If you're going to DPS as Prot, put on Ret gear.
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Postby gmoney » Sat Jan 17, 2009 10:57 am

Dorvan wrote:Honestly, you should never use an entire raid slot just to have a tank around in case the main one dies....it's simply a waste. If you're going to DPS as Prot, put on Ret gear.


That's just your opinion. Thanks for not answering my question.
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Postby Dorvan » Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:01 am

No, really. If you're having a tank die, the best thing the raid can do is figure out why the tank is dying and prevent that from happening, not stick in a back up tank who will then probably die for the same reason the main tank did. If you insist on DPS'ing in Prot gear, you're probably best off using SoW to keep from going OOM and stacking BV gear, but that's simply addressing the symptom and not the underlying issue.
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Postby gmoney » Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:26 am

Dorvan wrote: DPS'ing in Prot gear, you're probably best off using SoW to keep from going OOM and stacking BV gear, but that's simply addressing the symptom and not the underlying issue.


Was that so hard?
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Postby Candiru » Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:44 am

DPSing in ret gear is a bad plan.

At least for my gear, often my prot item is better than the ret item for Prot DPS.

This is due to Str being >>> all for prot DPS, while AP is a close second for Ret DPS.

Your tanking rings and cloak and probably more DPS than your ret ones, and the same for your weapon and shield (since a 2H weapon does minimal DPS for prot spec)

A reserve tank won't cost you too much DPS. You might do 2400 in dps gear, or 2k in prot gear.

Using SoB, a slow weapon and attacking from the back will boost your DPS quite a bit!
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Postby Scottzirra » Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:46 am

There is another post that I put up somewhere regarding this.

Using a mix of my current gear, and using my wishlist to fill some slots:

Yo,

I wanted to build a wish list up, and have down on E-paper which pieces of gear would shift my stats over to stuff I still need, as i'm over the def req, and currently at 120% total avoidance. I am currently looking to stack as much block value as I can due to the changes in tanking mechanics and holy shield up time.

Figured I would post it up here, so people know what I'm hunting.

Neck: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39470 Heroic Naxx Trash
Cloak: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40410 Normal Naxx (DKP free) Trash
Helm: T7.5 http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40581 Heroic Kel'Thuzad
Bracer: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39764 H Naxx Maexxna
Chest: T7.5 http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40579 Heroic Four Horseman
Shoulder: T7.5 http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40584 Heroic Naxx Loatheb
Trinket1: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=42987 Darkmoon Cards. (the str one gives roughly 190 str over time, which is 100 BV and 400 AP, threat and mitigation)
Trinket2: http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39292 Normal Naxx Thaddius

I wouldn't turn down http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40400 either. that shit looks amazing.



The general gist of the other post is that you can stack a massive amoutn of BV in all of those slots, and the ones left open are shoulders, and 2 trinket slots. IMO as an OT, or non tank for a fight, you can load the tankign BV gear up on all those slots, and toss ret gear into the 3 slots left over, and still make a decent emergency tank.
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Postby Dorvan » Sat Jan 17, 2009 11:51 am

gmoney wrote:
Dorvan wrote: DPS'ing in Prot gear, you're probably best off using SoW to keep from going OOM and stacking BV gear, but that's simply addressing the symptom and not the underlying issue.


Was that so hard?


You asked for advice. I gave you the best advice first, and you'd do well to heed it. Often people come here looking for treatments to symptoms, so when I see an underlying cause I point them to that first, because that's the more important issue. If you can't handle that with giving back a lot of attitude, try the official forums. Taking a tank in prot gear to a fight where there's nothing to tank unless someone else dies is a waste. That's the truth.
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Postby gmoney » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:09 pm

Dorvan wrote:
gmoney wrote:
Dorvan wrote: DPS'ing in Prot gear, you're probably best off using SoW to keep from going OOM and stacking BV gear, but that's simply addressing the symptom and not the underlying issue.


Was that so hard?


You asked for advice. I gave you the best advice first, and you'd do well to heed it. Often people come here looking for treatments to symptoms, so when I see an underlying cause I point them to that first, because that's the more important issue. If you can't handle that with giving back a lot of attitude, try the official forums. Taking a tank in prot gear to a fight where there's nothing to tank unless someone else dies is a waste. That's the truth.


Yes I asked for advice, but you gave advice that had nothing to do with my question. It's simple as that. I just get really annoyed when people who think they know it all answer a question with an answer that has nothing to do with the question.
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Postby Dorvan » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:25 pm

My advice directly addressed the scenario you presented. Your situation is that you're spec'ed prot and being asked to DPS. The best solution to that situation is to put on Ret gear with a sword and board. The answer to "but I'm worried about another tank going down" is to figure out why the tank is going down and prevent that from happening, not wear prot gear yourself.
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Postby gmoney » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:44 pm

Dorvan wrote:My advice directly addressed the scenario you presented. Your situation is that you're spec'ed prot and being asked to DPS. The best solution to that situation is to put on Ret gear with a sword and board. The answer to "but I'm worried about another tank going down" is to figure out why the tank is going down and prevent that from happening, not wear prot gear yourself.


You are a nerd.
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Postby Dorvan » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:48 pm

Yes I am. And? :)
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Postby kenshin648 » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:49 pm

This may not necessarily be appropriate, but...


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Postby Jellypop » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:56 pm

honestly,

say a fight like thaddius, where you need two tanks to start, what would the 2nd tank do on thaddius? dps

although i usually just pull aggro off the warrior tank on thaddius anyways..


there's always shit that can happen, and it's probably better if a tank can pick it up after the main tank DCs on a fight


food for though
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Postby Extermi » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:40 pm

I am actually raiding as Off-Tank, meaning we have a good warrior that tanks the fights that only need one tank, while I join in when more than one tank is needed.

My spec that is not prot but ret, with the key defensive talents (Parry, Avoidance, Armor, RF). This misses out holy shield, redoubt & AD as well as quite some stamina, so it is definitely not a main tank spec but my avoidance is the same as a pure prot spec.


http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?paladin=502320512033310302135001341000000000000000000000000000050053500000000000000000&glyph=120405040506

The advantage is that this spec puts out >90% of the damage a pure DPS ret spec would do, while being more than decent in all 10s and even many 25s tanking situations (tanking Satharion drake adds or eating Patchwerk hatefuls, for example).

For DPS, I simply put on my ret gear. If I need to tank, I put on my tank set and, when in fights like Thaddius my tanking job is over I equip a 2H weapon that still gives decent DPS.

Not everybody likes speccing as Off-Tank (espicially not on Maintankadin), but it is definitely very flexible if you are in an Off-Tank situation - which I am by choice.

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