Glory of the Hero, Difficulty analysis

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Glory of the Hero, Difficulty analysis

Postby Worldie » Tue Jan 27, 2009 8:34 pm

Alright, i'm totally bored, i'm banned from the official forums so can't troll them, servers are down for maintenance, and i can't sleep.

http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2136
I decided to make an analysis of the Glory of the Hero.
Most of the people who worked on it will for sure know of the big nerf to Gotta Go!, changed from 2 to 4 mins and made close to trivial. However, a number of other achievements got changed as well.
My aim is to find out if having the Red Proto Drake is still a symbol of prestige, or it is soon becoming the new NetherDrake.
I'm bothering in ranking the achievements in this ways:
Trivial: It's those that you get and go like "Wtf, there was a achievement for this?"
Easy: Simple, might require you to not have the IQ of a 2 yrs old baby.
Average: Will require a bit of special thinking and some competent players.
Hard: Will require over average group, possibly overgeared, of good players.

UTGARDE KEEP
- On The Rocks
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1919
Difficulty: Easy
Very simple achievement as long as people got a PvP trinket. Trinketting out of the ice tombs (or bubbling, or having Antimagic shield up when he's casting, etc) will not count as tomb destruction.

NEXUS
- Split Personality
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2150
Difficulty: Easy
Just requires a minimum of coordination, nothing special. The only relatively hard part is killing the frost one first.
- Chaos Theory
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2037
Difficulty: Easy
The tactic is pretty simple, kite the boss, kill the small adds. Will generally require a good geared healer however due to the amount of incoming damage in the end. p.s. Sacred Shield is op for this.
- Intense Cold
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2036
Difficulty: Trivial
You are cleansing yourself aren't you?

AZJOL NERUB
- Watch Him Die
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1296
Difficulty: Hard
One of my favourite one. Will generally require very good DPS, and excellent kiting from the kiter. Paladins (prot and retri) make excellent kiters here for the zerg.
- Hadronox Denied
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1297
Difficulty: Easy
Very easy as long as you got someone who can reset aggro and your DPS isn't green geared.
- Gotta Go!
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1860
Difficulty: Average
Before 3.0.8 i'd have marked it as Extreme, since it was. The nerf was tbh excessive, but even now, the achievement itself isn't easy. You still need a overgeared group to beat the timer. What really changed is that now you can afford 3 add phases, but they must last few seconds. Having a slow (poison, CoT) is a big help. It's not possible to obtain with the average pug, but a competent group should have no issues. No longer requires the 5 dps setup, a normal tank/healer/3dps can manage.

OLD KINGDOM
- The Party's Over
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1861
Difficulty: Hard
It's not as easy as it seemb. In order for the target to not die, the boss must suffer 40k damage before the victim has 0 HP. Most of the time, the victim will not even be at 100% due to the 3 flame orbs (fairly heavy damage) popped right before. Assuming average geared people, this will mean ~10 seconds before the victim dies. Now, 40k / 10 seconds is 4k DPS, which must be provided by 3 people, one of which is either healer or tank. This basically means you need 2 DPS capable of > 2k DPS each without buffs, cause if one of them gets drained, it will be healer + tank + 1 dps who have to do that much. It's a fairly healing intensive one as well, the orbs hurt and are hard to avoid.
- Respect Your Elders
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2038
Difficulty: Average
Old tactic would have said Trivial. It's clear that the kiting method wasn't intended. The new tactic is still doable, but requires more coordination and a decent offtank to hold the 3 guardians at same time. Kiting and killing through berserk still works apparently but it's not suggested.
- Volunteer Work
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2056
Difficulty: Easy
It's a matter of overgeared tank. DK are hax. Warriors/Rogues make this easy due to Disarm.
- Volazj's Quick Demise
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1862
Difficulty: Average
Overgearing matter, just more than the previous one. Stacked group significantly help, melee images are weak. Having a non-healer healing is a significant help.

DRAK'TARON KEEP
- Consumption Junction
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2151
Difficulty: Average
Both a DPS check and coordination check, doable with a good group who know how2los
- Oh Novos!
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2057
Difficulty: Trivial
Wat
- Better Off Dred
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2039
Difficulty: Easy
Nothing hard tbh, just requires decent tank and possibly tremor totem.

VIOLET HOLD
- Defenseless
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1816
Difficulty: Trivial
I think everyone was thinking the same when they got this one
- Lockdown
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1865
Difficulty: /
This aint hard or anything, it's just annoying as hell.
- Dehydration
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2041
Difficulty: Average
Requires someone who doesn't care for Defenseless and goes click some orbs.
- A Void Dance
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2153
Difficulty: Average
Requires good DPS and a good healer, that's pretty much about it.

GUN'DRAK
- What The Eck?
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1864
Difficulty: Trivial
You aren't going to die on the way to last boss are you.
- Share The Love
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2152
Difficulty: Average
Basically it's a matter of patience and good healer. The damage is significant during Rhino phase and keeping everyone up can be hard. Note that if someone dies and gets ressed, that someone must get impaled again.
- Less-Rabi
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2040
Difficulty: Hard
No longer exploitable, this if probably one of the hardest ones. Requires coordination, basically at 35% the group need to chain interrupt with perfect coordination.
- Snakes, Oh Why'd It Have To Be Snakes?
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2058
Difficulty: Easy
Bloodlust n burn him works wonders here.

HALLS OF STONE
- Good Grief
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1866
Difficulty: Easy
As long as your DPS is not sleeping.
- Brann Spankin New
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2154
Difficulty: Trivial
If you finished the event you should get it anyway. The hard part is actually finishing the event with a normal group.
- Abuse The Ooze
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2155
Difficulty: Easy
Just annoying and long, nothing hard here.

HALLS OF LIGHTNING
- Timely Death
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1867
Difficulty: Easy
If your group is not braindead and doesn't fail at moving you get it.
- Lightning Struck
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1834
Difficulty: Easy
Just requires a decent geared tank/healer
- Shatter Resistant
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2042
Difficulty: Trivial
I mean, that's the *standard* way of killing the boss.

CULLING OF STRATHOLME
- The Culling of Time
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1817
Difficulty: Easy
Not hard at all as long as you have a decent group
- Zombiefest!
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1872
Difficulty: Easy
Nothing hard again, just need to convince your group to give up the dragon for that run.

UTGARDE PINNACLE
- The Incredible Hulk
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2043
Difficulty: Easy
Nothing too complex, just needs the tank to be able to handle both boss and abomination.
- Lodi Dodi We Loves The Skadi + My Girl Loves To Skadi All The Time
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1873
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2156
Difficulty: Easy
Listing them toghether since you usually do them toghether. Very simple as long as you reset the boss.
- King's Bane
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2157
Difficulty: Easy
I'd say Trivial if your DPS is half decent since you'll not even see him casting Bane anyway.

OCULUS
- Experienced Drake Rider
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1871
Difficulty: Trivial
Nothing important here.
- Make It Count
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1868
Difficulty: Easy
It's just a matter of not wiping honestly.
- Voids
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2044
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2045
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2046
Difficulty: Hard
They changed whelps to have a higher range attack, so the 5 emerald kite tactic doesn't work anymore.
The easiest way to accomplish is now going 5 ambers for emerald/ruby void, then go with a mix of ruby and emeralds for the amber void.
Like most of us will know, 5 amber tactic require perfect coordination. Very quick kill, or very quick wipe.



Most achievements are easy. There is a handful of them which was trivial before, and now does actually require effort. A lot of people was stuck on Gotta Go and got their drake the first day of 3.0.8. HOWEVER, anyone starting it now, will have troubles getting it... maybe not as many as who did it before, but still plenty.
The following Achievements, at least in my opinion, will generally be the new "hard" ones, in order by difficulty:
- Voids from Oculus
- Less-Rabi
- Watch Him Die
- Consumption Junction
- Volazj's Quick Demise
- Gotta Go
- The Party's Over


Conclusion: We can still be proud of our Red Proto-Drakes. Omw to make a pic of my one.

Uhm this came out longer than expected, ah well, allowed me to pass half hour :X
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby majiben » Tue Jan 27, 2009 10:15 pm

Intense cold is also easily done by using BoF before an expected freeze.

Also watch him die may have been fixed to prevent kiting.
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Postby amh » Wed Jan 28, 2009 3:04 am

- Lodi Dodi We Loves The Skadi + My Girl Loves To Skadi All The Time
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1873
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2156
Difficulty: Easy
Listing them toghether since you usually do them toghether. Very simple as long as you reset the boss.


I thought they fixed this so you can´t reset it without bugging it?
I used to play a paladin.
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Postby Worldie » Wed Jan 28, 2009 3:33 am

Majiben wrote:Also watch him die may have been fixed to prevent kiting.

Just slightly different, you apparently can't go on the right anymore, so you literally need to charge in as soon as the tank got em.
Our tactic was funny, i shieldthrown one group, exorcism second, istant fear third, RUN :D
amh wrote:
- Lodi Dodi We Loves The Skadi + My Girl Loves To Skadi All The Time
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=1873
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2156
Difficulty: Easy
Listing them toghether since you usually do them toghether. Very simple as long as you reset the boss.


I thought they fixed this so you can´t reset it without bugging it?

No idea of what "bugging" means, done this yesterday and worked fine. No, actually not, at some point he healed back to full but i suspect it was cause one of the (dead) melee released and ran back in.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Cearn » Wed Jan 28, 2009 3:51 am

Worldie wrote:[...]
No idea of what "bugging" means, done this yesterday and worked fine. No, actually not, at some point he healed back to full but i suspect it was cause one of the (dead) melee released and ran back in.

It was. Normally happens when he targets them for whirlwind, maybe even for poison spears.
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Re: Glory of the Hero, Difficulty analysis

Postby Thornir » Wed Jan 28, 2009 6:24 am

Worldie wrote:NEXUS
- Intense Cold
http://www.wowhead.com/?achievement=2036
Difficulty: Trivial
You are cleansing yourself aren't you?


Just jump in place.

Also, for Lockdown! in VH there is a / instead of a difficulty (I would say Easy tbh).

Brann Spanking New might be considered Easy and not Trivial for some due to the spell casters.
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Re: Glory of the Hero, Difficulty analysis

Postby amh » Wed Jan 28, 2009 7:13 am

Thornir wrote:Just jump in place.


http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=48179 -> cleanse :)
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Re: Glory of the Hero, Difficulty analysis

Postby Thornir » Wed Jan 28, 2009 7:24 am

amh wrote:
Thornir wrote:Just jump in place.


http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=48179 -> cleanse :)


Let the healer do that. :roll:
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Men are but flesh and blood. They know their doom, but not the hour. - Patrick Stewart
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Re: Glory of the Hero, Difficulty analysis

Postby Worldie » Wed Jan 28, 2009 7:53 am

Thornir wrote:Also, for Lockdown! in VH there is a / instead of a difficulty (I would say Easy tbh).

I put a / because that achievement has no difficult per se and requires no effort, it's just about luck.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Senador » Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:28 am

Just slightly different, you apparently can't go on the right anymore, so you literally need to charge in as soon as the tank got em.
Our tactic was funny, i shieldthrown one group, exorcism second, istant fear third, RUN


This is effectively what I did with it, except instead of fearing I ran past the initial group on the left (The poison volleying one) and judged the gatekeeper. After that I just ran for the zone, do they now reset if they leave the room, because they didn't seem to when I used the entrance to LoS the stupid casters the other day (Though I know if the boss tries to leave the room it resets).

Also, I consider Quick Demise as a bit harder as well. I know when I went had some issues and we had a fairly solid group and no "healer" (Elemental Shaman healing) and it still took us about an hour to get it down right, and even then we only beat the timer by a handful of seconds.
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Postby Senador » Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:31 am

Just slightly different, you apparently can't go on the right anymore, so you literally need to charge in as soon as the tank got em.
Our tactic was funny, i shieldthrown one group, exorcism second, istant fear third, RUN


This is effectively what I did with it, except instead of fearing I ran past the initial group on the left (The poison volleying one) and judged the gatekeeper. After that I just ran for the zone, do they now reset if they leave the room, because they didn't seem to when I used the entrance to LoS the stupid casters the other day (Though I know if the boss tries to leave the room it resets).

Also, I consider Quick Demise as a bit harder as well. I know when I went had some issues and we had a fairly solid group and no "healer" (Elemental Shaman healing) and it still took us about an hour to get it down right, and even then we only beat the timer by a handful of seconds.
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Postby Seloei » Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:50 am

Watch him die -
Kill off the 2 adds from the left and middle group, don't dps the middle and shield toss the last group, run like mad and stun the one who does web wraps. By the time you reach the top the dps should be able to burn the boss. Any plate class can tank him with a decent healer.
Downside : group dies, upside : you zone out when they have killed him
Still hardish.

The party's over -
tank him in the corner, preferably bring 3x caster/ranged dps and have them stand at max range, each time he starts casting flame orbs run away.
Hard on dps requirements tho.

Volazj demise -
get 2 paladins and 2 locks and form a raidgroup, soulstone the paladins. Or bring 2 druids + 2 paladins. Easymode (atleast 1 minute left)

Less rabi however...

Didn't do it before it was bugged, hell didn't do most of them before they were bugged and having serious problems with these.

The only solution we've found is to bring 2x enh shamans with reverbation talented (-1s on shock spells, 5s cooldown) and have them spam it as soon as it's off cooldown after the 2. interupt and bring 4x dps, 1 tank.
His casts (seem to be) based on incombat time. (10, 20, 25, 30, 35, 40 etc) and the haste based on life left.

Was just wondering if anyone had achieved the Less-Rabi achievement post 3.0.8 and if you had then how? :S
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Postby Worldie » Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:17 am

Less rabi in 3.0.8 is a matter of chaining interrupts, you need about 3 people alternating interrupts every couple seconds.
theckhd wrote:Fuck no, we've seen what you do to guilds. Just imagine what you could do to an entire country. Just visiting the US might be enough to make the southern states try to secede again.

halabar wrote:Noo.. you don't realize the problem. Worldie was to negative guild breaking energy like Bolvar is to the Scourge. If Worldie is removed, than someone must pick up that mantle, otherwise that negative guild breaking energy will run rampant, destroying all the servers.
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Postby Spectrum » Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:46 am

Seloei wrote:Less rabi however...

Didn't do it before it was bugged, hell didn't do most of them before they were bugged and having serious problems with these.

The only solution we've found is to bring 2x enh shamans with reverbation talented (-1s on shock spells, 5s cooldown) and have them spam it as soon as it's off cooldown after the 2. interupt and bring 4x dps, 1 tank.
His casts (seem to be) based on incombat time. (10, 20, 25, 30, 35, 40 etc) and the haste based on life left.

Was just wondering if anyone had achieved the Less-Rabi achievement post 3.0.8 and if you had then how? :S


Hrm, they changed it? I thought it also cast more frequently at lower health and the best way was to get him around 35/40% and then have a mage CS for the 8 second lock-out and then burn him down.
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Postby Lore » Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:48 am

Less-rabi is still a "do you have a mage in the group" check.

It's very, very easy to do with an 8-second Counterspell.
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